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Mapping Help
This is the place to ask about mapping problems, techniques, and bug fixing, and pretty much anything else you want to do in the level editor.

For questions about coding, check out the Coding Help thread: http://www.celephais.net/board/view_thread.php?id=60097
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Thanks! 
I mean a higher refresh rate in your monitor. You' know it if you were as you need to set it in the engine in this case anyway. I ask about refresh rate because I searched here and that error was mentioned before in a thread elsewhere. I have no idea what could cause that so grasping at straws. :) 
Thanks 
No, just 60Hz
Thanks for the help, maybe it was a once off. I'll release as beta and see if anyone wants to test the map and see what happens. 
Re: Undead Fiend Head 
Hi Sir_Random, was the fiend mid-leap when the exploding box went off? Possibly it leapt into the box and set if off? I have a theory that you might have tumbled upon one of the many bugs that arise in the standard exploding box QuakeC code. 
Hi Preach 
It may well have been mid-leap, there was a lot going down at the time with ogre grenades and hell knight fire raining down :)

I haven't looked at the relevant code, but I'm surmising that when the Demon was gibbed it somehow wasn't flagged as dead, so the engine was still treating it's head as a walkmonster and trying to animate it. 
Now..where Was I 
One of the aspects of monsters dying in Quake which matters here is that the only real reason they don't continue attacking is that their think function gets reset by the death animation, so they never re-enter the ai loop. There's no other safeguard against a dead monster carrying actions out.

My guess of what happened is this:

Fiend leaps into the barrel and starts running Demon_JumpTouch
Demon_JumpTouch inflicts damage on the barrel
...The damage explodes the barrel
......The barrel explosion kills the fiend
..........The fiend turns into a head gib
Control returns to Demon_JumpTouch, which then sets a think function on the head gib, putting it back into the monster ai loop.

You might worry that this could happen in other situations, like if a grunt shot a barrel, blew it up, and died in the resulting explosion, would it also become a zombie? The answer is no, because army_atk5 sets a think function before it inflicts any damage. In fact, almost all monster animation functions set the think function before they take any action.

Demon_JumpTouch is an exception because it's a touch function that can triggers ai functions, and does so in an unusual order. The fact that the fiend was a head gib might have caused it to find one of the paths through the function that set an ai function (not all of them do).

Having gone on about Demon_JumpTouch so much, you might expect that the fix should be located there. But actually the traditional fix in QuakeC mods is just to add a short nextthink delay to the explosion of a barrel. This fixes whole other categories of bug - like multiple barrels exploding at the same time and resetting each other's radius damage loop. It also prevents the explosion interrupting other code, such as Demon_JumpTouch - which is especially confusing when the monster might change from alive to dead during the interruption! 
Thanks Preach 
I suppose a Fiend never encounters an explobox in original Quake, so there's not much chance of spotting that oversight in testing. I'm more familiar with idTech 4 & 5 (Doom 3, BFG) and there are plenty of anomalies in that code too :) 
@Preach 
This thing also happens with zombies?

I'm asking because there's a warning in the readme file of "The Pillars of the Damned" map that says "If you activate one of the crushers while a zombie is lying on the ground that zombie can only be killed by splash damage"

And this is what it looks like when i played (the bug shows at 09:30)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=udyyohmHvZc&t=570s

It's the same bug, or is something else? There's a way to fix this in progs.dat so it won't happen again? 
Zombie Vs "Zombie" 
Afraid not Tribal, where I said zombie in that post, I really meant "zombie". I was using it as shorthand for monsters affected by Sir_Random's bug - monsters that continue acting after the player has killed them. Any resemblance to actual zombies is entirely coincidental.

I don't think your bug is related, because the bug is triggered after the zombie is already "dead" on the floor, not at the moment of dying. It sounds like the engine tries and fails to restore the collision hull to the zombie when it stands up inside a BSP object, but I can't tell you more than that... 
@Preach 
Thanks anyway :) 
Trying To Get Started Mapping, Little Help With Compiling Probs? 
Hi All, long time quake player, thinking about my first quake map.

Hi Im looking into making my first quake map.

Im having problems understanding why qBSP runs on my map but vis and light doesn't run.

I dont understand why it finds my QCompileTools folder just fine for qbsp, yet it wont do the vis and light right next to it in the same folder?

I'm using necros compile gui

Im very new to all this and this in particular is really confusing me, so I hope you can help, and if the soltion isnt obvious I could post the compiler output.



I hope you can help and Best wishes! 
First Question 
Is qbsp.exe creating a bsp in your maps folder?

Next, if not we'll need to see the .log folder that is created in the working directory. 
Hi Dumptruck, Great Youtube Vids By The Way. 
Hi,

Yeah I get the bsp, it runs, Fullbright and with geometry disappearing.

Here is the compile

------------------------------------------
Copying Files...
The file cannot be copied onto itself.
0 file(s) copied.
Converting map...
--------------QBSP--------------
---- qbsp / ericw-tools v0.18.1 ----
Input file: FirstQuakeMap01.map
Output file: FirstQuakeMap01.bsp

---- LoadMapFile ----
*** WARNING 06: No info_player_deathmatch entities in level
2700 faces
450 brushes
2 entities
28 unique texnames
452 texinfo

Opened WAD: D:/Projects/Texture Archive/texturedownloads/base.wad
Opened WAD: D:/Projects/Mapping/MyTrenchBroomQuakeMaps/id.wad
Processing hull 0...
---- Brush_LoadEntity ----
450 brushes
425 planes
---- CSGFaces ----
2700 brushfaces
3205 csgfaces
3025 mergedfaces
---- SolidBSP ----
3886 split nodes
1749 solid leafs
1840 empty leafs
298 water leafs
0 detail leafs
0 detail illusionary leafs
0 detail fence leafs
0 illusionary visblocker leafs
20722 leaffaces
19774 nodefaces
---- Portalize ----
2138 vis leafs
2138 vis clusters
5477 vis portals
---- FillOutside ----
*** WARNING 10: Reached occupant at (1504 -144 312), no filling performed.
Leak file written to FirstQuakeMap01.pts
---- MakeFaceEdges ----
---- GrowRegions ----
Processing hull 1...
*** WARNING 10: Reached occupant at (1504 -144 312), no filling performed.
Processing hull 2...
*** WARNING 16: Texture __TB_empty not found
---- WriteBSPFile ----
Wrote FirstQuakeMap01.bsp
923 planes 18460
23094 vertexes 277128
3886 nodes 93264
368 texinfo 14720
19774 faces 395480
5626 clipnodes 45008
2139 leafs 59892
20722 marksurfaces 41444
79088 surfedges 316352
47598 edges 190392
32 textures 346812
lightdata 0
visdata 0
entdata 216

0.469 seconds elapsed
Peak memory usage: 69414148 (66.2M)
--------------VIS---------------
---- vis / ericw-tools v0.18.1 ----
running with 8 threads
testlevel = 4
LoadBSPFile: 'FirstQuakeMap01.bsp'
BSP is version 29
LoadPortals: couldn't read FirstQuakeMap01.prt
No vising performed.
-------------LIGHT--------------
The file cannot be copied onto itself.
0 file(s) copied.
The file cannot be copied onto itself.
0 file(s) copied.
The system cannot find the file specified.
Press any key to continue . . . 
2 Issues 
1. You have a leak in your level so VIS will not run.

2. Light will not run if you don't have any light entities in your map. If you do, then I am not sure why it isn't running. Double check the path in the GUI to light.exe Maybe it's incorrect?

Also it's a good idea not to have spaces in any of these tools paths or for your wads etc. But that's not the issue above. 
@AM 
Open the .pts file in your editor, you should see a dotted line leading you to the leak so you can fix it. 
Okay 
sorting the leak means vis will now run,
it makes a prt file, does this go in the same dir as the bsp when loading it into quake?

I put some light entities into the map, and now when I try to compile, it gets to light, and crashes.

light.exe system error
The code execution cannot proceed because embree.dll was not found. Reinstalling the program may fix this problem.

I see the flame of the wall torches, but there is no light. still fullbright textures.
Strange. Light.exe is in the same place as the other 2 compilers. 
 
PRT files are just for use with the compile tools. The Quake executable doesn't need it.

The prebuilt builds of ericw-tools require (and come with) embree.dll. Try reinstalling it: https://github.com/ericwa/ericw-tools/releases/ 
AM 
re: light crash

You are missing the MS Visual C++ files. TB and ericw tools use 2 seperate libraries. Go to the site and look at the link right under the blue download button.

https://ericwa.github.io/ericw-tools/

Also plz watch my troubleshooting video which will help you with leaks.

https://youtu.be/kFd-D46OCrg 
Above Should Read 
"you might be missing" 
Sounds Good. 
which of the 3 should I download?

vcredist_arm.exe

vcredist_x64.exe

vcredist_x86.exe

Im using 64bit windows 10 
 
vcredist_x64.exe 
Still Getting The Embree Message After Vcredist_x64.exe 
I downloaded and ran vcredist_x64.exe only. It didnt ask me for a destination when I ran it so I dont know where it puts those libraries. My projects/mapping is on my D drive whereas windows system files are on c
could this be an issue? 
@AM 
When you extracted the ericw-tools-v0.18.. zip there should be a "bin" folder containing an embree.dll as well as the various .exe's. Maybe just confirm you still have the embree.dll because copying just the qbsp/vis/light.exe to a separate folder would cause the "embree.dll not found" error.

I downloaded and ran vcredist_x64.exe only. It didnt ask me for a destination when I ran it so I dont know where it puts those libraries.
Yeah this is fine, it's part of Windows so it gets installed globally somewhere.

One last thing there are 2 packages of the tools, -win32.zip and -win64.zip. The -win32.zip requires vcredist_x86.exe and the other one requires vcredist_x64.exe. I should probably spell this out more clearly :) 
It Works Perfectly Now =D 
beautiful moody quake lighting.

Yeah it all makes sense now, I think I moved the .exes thinking it would be ok. I put them where they should be and everything is fine.

THANKS SO MUCH 
 
Wait what....why would you need separate .dll's for the compile tools? Did something change? What's embree? 
Trenchbroom Custom Model Display (.fgd File) 
Hello! In my progs I have misc_model entity which places custom models into maps. It has a parameter "model", which contains the path to my model in folder (for instance progs/v_shot.mdl). It works fine, but how should I set my .fgd file to display this custom models in Trenchbroom? Is it possible to do somehow? 
Reyond 
It is possible. I have an improved version of the fdg for progs_dump that has this feature. Here's the bit you need to add to the fgd:

model({
"path" : model,
"skin" : skin,
"frame": frame
}) 
 
Sorry for being so stupid, but I have never worked with .fgd files before. I have this in my .fgd file:

@PointClass base(Appearflags) size (16 16 16) color(30 150 35) = misc_model : " Place your custom model"
[
model(string) : "Path to your model"
]

Trenchbroom sees the entity in the entity list, bit it can not display the model when i wright the path to it. Where exactly should I add your piece of code so the model could be seen?

P.S. I tried to add your piece of code but got an error. I have downloaded fgd from your drobpox but I still can not sort out how to use fgd files. Thanks for helping me! 
Thanks To Dumptruck_ds 
Thank you so much! I found out how the misc_model is made in your fgd file and this worked for me:

@PointClass base(Appearflags, Target, Targetname) size(32 32 16) color(255 128 0) studio({ "path" : mdl}) = misc_model : "A point entity for displaying models"
[
mdl(string) : "Model Selection (ex progs/model.mdl)"
frame(integer)
first_frame(integer)
last_frame(integer)
speed(integer) : "Speed" : 10
angles(integer) : "set 'angle' to 0 if this is used"
 
Studio is the key bit here 
Is It Ok To Just Add The RL On Skill 0 ? 
I'm trying to balance my map for skills, and I'm wondering is it ok to just add the RL near the start for easy skill? Or would that be viewed as lazy?
It just seems harder to remove enemies and still keep the map exciting. 
Uh.., 
Depends on the game-wise developpement you tend the player to behave like.
A RL at the start makes it easy to clear path for almost the hardest monster, so then it depends on the ammo, health and armour you supply.

At the other hand with the weakest weapons you can build up a steady monster count that balances on to a harder fight at end.
Don't forget that several knights can make a player already uneasy to fight.

So an easy skill won't say an easier fight IMHO.
Or start with no weapon, there's an easy hack for it. 
Thanks Madfox 
Thanks, I do have a build up of monsters, geared at Normal/Hard. I guess I'll just change/remove some monsters for easy. I wanted to keep the ambush/crossfire situations, but I guess not many play on 'Easy' anyway. 
Sir_Random 
Don't forget that you can do more than just take away monsters on easy -- you can also replace them with weaker monsters that only spawn in easy mode.

For example replacing a vore with an ogre, or a shambler with 3 knights. 
@metlslime 
Thanks, that's what I'm going to do. 
 
It would be an interesting challenge on its own - a map where the # of monsters decreases with skill, but the overall challenge still increases. 
Suggestion: Progression, Plan Your Encounters 
Start with your ideal hardest level.
For each "encounter" consider the next logical easier encounter to step down to for Normal, then Easy. Either placement change, cover addition (e.g. func_wall post, crate), lower health or lower damage per second enemy swap out, or fewer enemies.

Gets fuzzy if you have near constant encounters but if so maybe pacing is needed on lower difficulties, longer timespans between encounters rather than one long continuous encounter with no breathing room between enemies (e.g. Nightmare).

Weapon-changeout/early-add is good, but remember how it will affect pacing, better weapons earlier = shorter fights = more time between encounters which can make for lower percieved difficulty. 
Qmaster 
I did make it for Normal/Hard, with a few strategic Nightmare monsters and I got great feedback from jcr who made demos in Nightmare. His play style is more aggressive than me so it was good to see the map played at pace and it seemed fairly balanced for him.
I just need to rework some battle areas to suit fewer/weaker monsters without making it toooo easy. 
Difficulty 
I think resisting "easier is just fewer monsters" design is the right way to go. There should be fewer monsters, just not many fewer, because too few is just plain boring. We're all Quake Experts after 20 years of this, so I think anyone playing custom maps on Easy in 2018 is doing so because they're doing it on a lunch break or a stolen evening away from the kids, and not because they can't handle more than one fiend at a time. Maybe we should think of it more as 'higher investment.' Besides, Quake gives you tons of unappreciated variables that you can tweak by skill, both obvious and subtle.

- Armor makes Quake significantly easier. More reds and yellows, more often, effectively extends the player's survivability in a given fight by hundreds of HP. More Greens, or stretches without armor at all, shrink the until-death buffer to little more than the player's current health. If you do want to keep the same monster loadout on all three skills, give the Easy player several Red and Yellow armors and the Hard player only one or two Greens. They'll feel like completely different games.

- Adding a vote for weapon pickups coming earlier or later. On Easy, the next big weapon might come before the next big encounter so the player can kick ass with it, on Medium it might be placed within it so the player has to engage to grab it, and on Hard it might only come as a reward after beating the fight entirely without it.

- Greater monster variety leads to more ways the player can be attacked at any one time, requiring juggling more variables to avoid damage and find the safe place to be standing at any given millisecond. A shambler and a vore together are harder to handle than a pair of either. Variety also raises the chances of infighting, however.

- The angles that enemies are presented from makes a difference. In front of the player is easier, flanking is harder, behind is bordering on unfair depending on circumstances. Below the player is a turkey shoot, eye level is straightforward, and monsters up high have a distinct advantage.

- Quantity of resources matters, of course. Bigger medkit pools clearly make the game easier, plentiful rockets can be splashed around while rare ones are only for emergencies, etc. Nail weapon DPS is higher than SG/SSG DPS and so on.

- Frequency of resources matters too. A steady drip lets the player feel secure, but isolated bursts create situations where the player has to stretch himself to get to the next 'island'. Depending on where he makes his errors, he might have to stretch pretty hard (eg those 'quicksave with 5 health left' or 'shambler axe dance or bust' moments). Feast-or-famine item placement can induce mild stockholm syndrome, leading to more positive reviews :)

- Unless you're using a lot of Enforcers, maybe provide all players an early Lightning Gun and simply vary the cells provided, as a way of dealing more or fewer 'get out of jail free' cards.

- Don't forget that the difficulty spawnflags are present on every entity. If you're using monster closets, vary the locations of the ambush triggers. Have the Hard ambushes happen when the player is in the worst possible position, and give them a leg up or more warning on easier skills (or even leave the closet open on Easy so there's no surprise at all). You might even duplicate the doors so you can set different 'speed' keys per skill, so the harder ambushes are an instant pants shitting and the easier ones are more like a countdown until the monsters come out, complete with early warning aggro sounds. Doors can be temporarily barred behind the player on hard skills while he is free to retreat from a fight on easier ones. Falling into a pit can be a mild backtracking inconvenience on easy skills but death by spikes on harder ones. How much room is there between nail shooters in this hallway? With careful use of triggerable lights and skill-specific trigger_relays, you can even use light and darkness against the player differently.

Getting crafty with what you change between difficulty levels can give you ideas for entire encounters, although don't rely on that too much for interest, because any given player is probably only going to experience one such permutation and thus won't realize the need to appreciate how different it is from any others. 
@Lunaran 
Great suggestions above. I may steal this and create a "gameplay" video based on it and a few other posts. This is an area I struggle with and just two or three of these suggestions would have have a big impact on any map. I know some players hate "back spawning" monsters but I think if you use them sparingly as an easy task after a more challenging encounter they can be effective. 
Ammo Science 
Here's a method I've been using. It's really rough, and time consuming without a custom progs to do it for you, but it can be a helpful way to ground your estimates.

A box of:
25 or 50 nails = 225 or 450 damage
20 or 40 shells = 440/880 dmg
6 or 12 cells = 180/360 dmg

6/12 rockets are harder to judge because of 1) splash damage and 2) zombies, but let's say every rocket is 180dmg, for 1080/2160 dmg per box.

Total all the ammo you provide in the map (add 25 shells for the starter ammo, add 2 rockets per ogre and 5 shells per grunt and so on), and that's the max amount of hit point damage you are giving the player to deal. Total the starting health of all the monsters, and compare the two numbers.

Researching id maps and popular custom maps reveals an average 'custom' of about ~3:1 on Easy, ~2.2.:1 on Medium, and ~1.7:1 on Hard. the id maps are generally above that curve (4/3/2:1), and custom maps tend to fall below it(2.5/2.0/1.5:1).

Careful cheapskate shot-counters can finish a map with a ratio of about 1.3:1 ammo DP:monster HP, but most players will have to resort to the axe at some point and will complain of shortage. RPGSP1, which was greeted by universal reviews of "good but I ran out of ammo at the end" still had a ratio on skill 2 of 1.4:1 DP:HP.

There are lots of outliers to these curves, though, because so much of it comes down to how the level design enables the player to *use* the weapons, as well as exploit infighting, choke points, etc. Do rockets get spent one at a time on individual zombies or can they be used to gib crowds of knights for maximum ROI? or are they useless against herds of shamblers?

It also matters when the player gets the ammo. Ammo the player doesn't pick up or can't use is effectively not present in the map at all. Does it come too late to be used when it was really needed? does it come too early and get skipped? or partially wasted when picked up by a player who's already nearly maxed and getting too much at the wrong times? How much of that ammo is in secret areas? 
I Can't Add 
20/40 shells * 24dmg/shell = 480/960 DP per box 
 
also quad damage placement 
Glad To See I'm Not The Only One 
Right there with you buddy. I once made a mod that outputs my health, shells, nails, etc to the console once per minute. Then I graphed it for my favorite levels. Made sort of an S type curve and tends to plateau with plentiful supplies of ammo towards the end but health still only hovered around 40 to 75. 
BUT 
I always come back to this: to heck with the numbers, make it fun. 
Of Course 
I cannot caveat enough that such measurements are of little exact use. It's good for ballparking it and discovering "oh shit I'm way off" and don't trust it more than that. 
Quake 3 Patch 
Hello! Does anybody know if there is a special utillity for converting .obj to quake 3 patch? Also, where can I find any documentation about q3 patches? 
-- 
Or use a model! 
Help? One Teleport To Much. 
Hi!
Have a problem with my map that I don't know how to fix.
After finnishing all and testing, in the first room, a black rectangle appears on the floor with the sound of a teleport. I can't remember that I made one and even can't find it in the editor.
Is there a way to search for things in trenchbroom or other ways? 
GunSgt 
I would go to the spot in the map in TB and "drill down" to see if there's a brush embedded in that spot in the map. IIRC you hold control + mouse scroll wheel to drill down your brush selections. Of you can hide the floor brush to see if anything is below it. 
@dumptruck_ds 
I haqve deleted the floor and theres nothing. I've also been going downward if theres something below. Also nothing. I have no clue? A bug? I've posted the map on screenshots and betas. 
 
in game:

"r_showbboxes" will draw white outlines around all entities, this will confirm there is an entity there. (NOTE: i don't think this shows static entities)

(alternate: set "r_drawentities" to 0 which will stop drawing all entities, including static entities -- another way to confirm this is an entity)

"edicts" command will list all entities in the console, problem with this is that brush entities all have the origin of 0,0,0 so you need to look at absmin/absmax or something to figure out which one is the one you are looking for. (hint: condump this to a file since it's easier to read in a text editor.) 
@Dumptruck_ds 
THANKS!

With r_shobboxes 1 I found a brush that moved somewhere and made me trobles ago. Deleted it and that was it. Bohh! Thank you so much!!!
Hope you're doing fine and find some time to play my map.

Best wishes!

GunSgtHighway 
Thanks Metlslime 
:) 
@Dumptruck_ds 
Haha! :D Thanks for assistence! :D 
Func_insidevolume And Func_pushable 
Is there any documentation on these two AD entities? I can't find them in the ad_v1_70P1_documentation.txt, and I can't get the func_insidevolume to detect the pushable and send an output to a func_door, even though I have the "pushable" flag checked. 
IIRC.. 
These were added/modified very close to release. Probably why no information.

Did you open the "test_pushable" map to see how to set it up? 
For A Simple Setup It Goes Like This: 
1)Create a brush then --> tie to entity > func_pushable, no other parameters needed.

2)Create second brush then --> tie to entity > func_door, then give the door a name Ex: "PushableOpens".

3)Create your last brush and --> tie to entity > func_insidevolume, give it a Target(fully inside) of: "PushableOpens". Uncheck all flags but Pushable.

Tada!

Now I don't remember the specific conversation with sock but there was concern for this: "Name of target(s) to trigger when something is FULLY INSIDE the volume (fires every 0.1s)."

Namely, the constant firing. I think that's why there's more complex setups for these. But you could select "Only ONCE" for "wait", for the func_insidevolume if that will work for you?

hth's 
 
Or if it does do constant firing, just target a trigger_relay set to once. Only have the trigger_relay target the actual door.

My guess is it has to do with needing the pushable fully inside rather than just touching like a trigger. 
@19956 And @19957 
Thanks! You hit the nail right on the head - I did not know the pushable had to be completely inside for it to work. Did a few more tests and it worked exactly as it should.
I'm a bit annoyed that pushables, that doesn't move, don't block gasshooters but this allows me to do a workaround for that. 
@Spipper 
You could use Target2 also, which is when a pushable is "partially inside" the volume ;)

Also, I'm a bit confused on the pushables that "don't move" comment? Maybe you mean when you are not pushing them? 
@Spipper Nvrmnd 
I tested it. Yeah, pushables are not solid to the gasshooter at all.

Seems an isolated case, versus the other trap types I tested('nades, spikes etc). Prolly not that hard to "fix". 
Messages In Quake 
Hi. Do someone know if there's a way to create longer messages than one line? and maybe change its colour? 
Reply To GunSgtHighway 
Yes, you can just move to another line by adding \n.
Just like this. “Hello, this is my message \n how do you like it?”
In game it will be seemed like this:
Hello, this is my message
how do you like it? 
@ Reyond 
Thank you very mutch! 
Message Color 
Color is possible in Darkplaces but you only use normal white or orange (bold) in all other engines like this:
\bImportant Message!\b\nNotice, thank you for noticing\n this notice.

For Darkplaces or QuakeLive engines:
The color codes are as follows:
^1 = Red
^2 = Green
^3 = Yellow
^4 = Blue
^5 = Light Blue
^6 = Magenta
^7 = White

E.g:

^4BLUE TEXTBOOK\n^7Normal white message. 
Skies 
Does anyone know where to find some good sky textures? I looked through most of the wads on Quaddicted's wads section but only found a few skies, none of which matched what I was looking for. 
Enjoy 
Skyboxes 
 
Thanks OTP. And GunSgtHighway, although I should've clarified I was looking for old-school style sky textures rather than skyboxes. 
Buttons, Info_notnull And Spawnflags 
Hi!

I'm getting crazy on this.
Is there a way to turn for example lights on and of or turn it on with two buttons and turn it off again? Thought I can handle this with trigger_relays or an info_notnull but I have no coding practise. Is there a tutorial or a manual for coding, spawnflags,...? 
 
turn lights on and off -- give light(s) a targetname, give button that matching target, make sure the button has a wait that is not -1.

same lights with two buttons -- if you want either button to do it, just give both buttons the same target value.

same light with two buttons, where you have to press both -- both buttons have wait = -1, they both target a trigger_counter, which triggers the light. This setup is not repeatable.

two buttons that you have to press both and then the light turns off and then you press them both again and it turns on -- a complicated setup with logic gates probably. 
@GunSgtHighway, Metlslime 
Not sure if this exactly what Sgt wanted, but here's a light that requires pressing two buttons (order doesn't matter) to be turned on or off. The buttons stay depressed until the other is pressed at which point the light toggles and they both reset. Demonstration here, bsp and map here. As metlslime suggested, it's done with some logic gates, a setup that could be cleaned up a lot by someone more skilled with gate optimization who doesn't rely on babby-mode spike shooters like I do, or just using a custom progs set, not to mention fixing up the timing on the button and trigger resets a bit. 
@metlslime And Spud 
Thanks for answers.

What I want to do is to put a little more riddles in my maps.
Means I made three buttons. Two of them have to be pushed for activating something, the other on sets them and the activating thing back to zero and you can push them again.

I don't know if quake supports this logic things with IF and THEN. But hopefully there might be a way. @Spud I'm hoping to find time today or tommorow to check your map out. Big thanks anyway! 
A Non-Gated Community 
Quake doesn't support that kind of logic internally (at least, not in terms of what one can normally use in the map, other than predefined setups i.e. "open door if player has key, else don't open door"), but you can use the various entities to make physical logic gates including if, then, all sorts of and, nand, and so on, and combine them all to do all sorts of tricksy logic stuff that you'd never expect to be possible. Some of them involve other types of map hacks (info_notnulls and InitTriggers and so on), but the most basic form just needs a spike shooter trap, a door, and a button- a simple if gate. From there everything spirals outwards, and you can even save a couple entities/edicts by using further hacks in the gate itself.

There's some great reading material to be found around, including the QuakeWiki entity pages and the QuakeC source, but here's a couple offhand:
New Logic Gate Design (2013) and part two of the same article,, along with Logic Gates for 2017, all hosted at the Tome of Preach, a most excellent site run by Preach that's absolutely chock-full of crazy map hacks. Those articles primarily focus on gates themselves; there's a number of other pages on the site that go into detail about specific hacks, some of which require gates, others that don't.

Not coincidentally, the last page above also links to a relatively ancient example of the aforementioned trap-shooter logic gate in Quake 2, penned by metlslime, whose post is a couple paragraphs up, and whose thread we're posting in, not to mention whose board we're posting on. Maximum respect to the old guard for figuring this stuff out years ago so us noobs don't have to.

The Teaching Old Progs.dat New Tricks thread is an enormous and fantastic source of information and hacks for the vanilla (id1) codebase, many of which aren't collected anywhere else and some of which are only discussed in the thread in throwing-science-at-the-wall form, but would be refined and used by mappers months or even years later. Ctrl+f is your friend, and sometimes stuff shows up in other threads like this one instead; if that thread doesn't have it, I find just Googling "topic or hack you're looking for here" site:celephais.net often works very well.

Lastly, dumptruck_ds (whose videos relating to Trenchbroom you've likely seen once or a dozen times) created and runs a Quake mapping help/discussion Discord channel along with a number of long-time or experienced mappers, if you're into the instant-response* type of help. You can't say how fucking awesome someone's newest screenshot or mod might be, though, because apparently we aren't all consenting adults there.

*instant response may be less than instant depending on time of day and interest level of whoever's online 
@Spud 
Wow! That helps!Thanks!
It's realy hard to get into that stuff no matter what you find in the web as long as you find the links between informations and understand how to use it.
Thank you very much!

PS.: No instant reponse guy. Have a Job to do too. :) 
@Spud Twobuttons.map 
Thanks for the map. Checked it.
Thats a lot to learn. :)

Best wishes. 
Similar Hack 
Here's a similar hack which is specifically about toggling lights. There are five different lights in the example, so it's a bit more complex that what you were after. But there are some useful things to bear in mind here.

https://tomeofpreach.wordpress.com/2018/02/22/five-statues-challenge/

I should also mention that I wouldn't treat the 2013 logic gates as an alternative to the 2017 article - the 2017 method is better all round because it fixes a bug, is easier to integrate using copy-paste, and supports an unlimited number of output on a single gate. Upgrade your map today! 
@Preach 
Thanks!. Thats an good to read tutorial!

Think I got it slowly.
So I have to transfer my If/Then-diagram to a gate model where every gate simulates an 0-1 status that will be activated by a target_shooter pointing on an info_notnull that does the action? 
Trenchbroom Help 
it's been a pretty long while since I've started on a new map in trenchbroom, but when I run the compiler it looks like there's no .bsp for the map. I've had this problem before but I don't remember what to do.

here's what it says:

#### Executing 'C:\Program Files (x86)\Steam\steamapps\common\Quake\bin\light.exe coldwiz.bsp'
---- light / TyrUtils v0.15 ----
running with 4 threads
************ ERROR ************
Error opening coldwiz.bsp: No such file or directory 
Skizzle 
Many times this is an issue with spaces in the path names. I see you are using TyrUtils so that could be it. ericw tools are the next "gen" of TyrUtils. I highly recommend you use them. https://ericwa.github.io/ericw-tools/

And in general just check all the paths in your compiling configs. 99% of the time that's is the issue. 
Triggering Console Variables At Runtime 
Hi, deving a map for AD mod with rusty hands.

How do you trigger console commands (or change cvars) within a map at runtime? Triggers, timers, etc.
In this case I want to alter the worldspawn "_gamma" value.

Searched various boards but couldn't find or understand how. Is it possible without altering .qc?

Thanks in advance. 
Look In The Manual 
For stuffcmd. Not sure AD has this but probably does.

People are wary of abuse so be careful. 
Stuffcmd 
What's the nastiest, most malicious thing a jolly japester can do with this? I'm genuinely intrigued.

Sounds like a good Jam idea: "break someone's PC with stuffcmd lol". 
Well 
Allegedly this used to be a thing:

apparently the Quake engine lets you overwrite the game data with savegames should you be enough of a moron to call your save “pak0.pak”, a bug that seems to hail all the way from the original release eighteen years ago

But I can't reproduce it in QuakeSpasm... maybe for the best. 
Trololol 
Well that's a good one. 
Not Down That Road.. 
..yeah, better stick to fog triggers. 
The Road To Hell Is Paved With\nsave Pak0.sav 
Fitzquake-derived ports (at least QS and Mark V) are smart enough to add a .sav extension to the end of whatever filename you enter, even if it already includes a different one, so it won't let you overwrite any files other than existing save files. Other ports and versions do not do that, however, meaning that you can indeed overwrite .pak files with savegames in Winquake... and Darkplaces. Oh yes.

I actually fiddled with this on my own a little while back to see what exactly can be done in that vein with vanilla console commands, and the answer turns out to be "not much." Most cvars that allow you to stuffcmd (map, save, load, etc) will either interpret directory-modifying characters as part of the normal folder or filepath or are intentionally set to ignore such commands, e.g.
save foo/bar.sav (a subfolder) will spit out
ERROR: couldn't open.
and
save ..foo.sav (a parent directory) will throw up
Relative pathnames are not allowed.
and
save ./foo.sav (the same directory) will expel
Saving game to <Quake directory>/./foo.sav... but will write the save file to the normal directory, making the ./ showing up misleading.
game, which isn't present in the original engines, will auto-reject anything that isn't a single directory name, not a path.

So you can overwrite .pak files in your game's base directory and not much else and that's only if you're using a outdated or shitty engine, but what about loading files? Again, nearly everything is locked down- map will load maps from subfolders, but not in parent ones. Everything else will give the same errors (primarily the relative pathnames one) except the exec command, which does allow directory changes in every port I've tried. Not especially interesting, but it does allow it, e.g.
exec ../quoth/config.cfg while playing in id1 will function and return
execing ../quoth/config.cfg
This (obviously) also works for the quake.rc stored within vanilla or mod .pak files. All the above limitations still apply to whatever's written in those config files, though. You can also string multiple ../ segments to navigate to two, three, and so on folders up.

So, food for thought: someone more malicious and skilled than myself can probably find some nasty way to write to system files outside of the Quake directory, and Darkplaces sucks. I didn't test the various extra console stuff in AD and similar mods, but I doubt they left any serious holes open. 
SM189 - Doom 
Sorry for likely asking a repeated question, but in regards to SM189 being:

"Progs: id1, because I feel it's too soon for another modded pack after the last speedmap/halloween jam/xmas jam."

Obviously Id1 .dat entities etc., yet are these vanilla jams intended to run w/out mod engines?

In this case I'd want to use alphas textures, eg. window/crossbar alphas contained in the various doomtex wads. Is there a restriction on the added functionality these mod engines provide? (alpha, fog, increased limits..)

..also, where the HELL should it be submitted?? 
Hi. 
Obviously Id1 .dat entities etc., yet are these vanilla jams intended to run w/out mod engines?

Yes, but almost everybody uses QuakeSpasm, so it's fine to consider a target engine.

..also, where the HELL should it be submitted??

Package the .bsp and the .lit if it exists in a zip file, upload to your file sharing service of choice cough and post in the speedmapping thread.

Alternatively catch me on the Quake Mapping Discord
Thanks A Bunch! 
"Hmm, not enough ash.." *stirs mortar 
Info_player_start Ambience 
I'm new to trenchbroom, been messing around with it after watching some tutorials just to get a handle on working with the software, and the entity info_player_start seems to be emitting that teleporter ambience. how do I get rid of this? 
@shrotus 
If you have a monster spawning in using the point entity method set the spawnflag to 2 for silent. That will solve this issue.

When I made the entity tutorial I was unaware that that hack caused the teleport sound to play at origin 0.0.0

Hopefully this is the cause of your issue. 
@shrotus 
If you have a monster spawning in using the point entity method set the spawnflag to 2 for silent. That will solve this issue.

When I made the entity tutorial I was unaware that that hack caused the teleport sound to play at origin 0.0.0

Hopefully this is the cause of your issue. 
@dumptruck 
That did the trick. great tutorials! 
Need Help 
Greetings everyone! I'm pretty new at Quake mapping and mapping in general for that matter and need help.

I'm trying to build a map for Quake Rally. It is a rough recreation of Bowser Castle 1 from Mario Kart. When compiling the map it seems to do fine but when it runs Quake (I use Qrack by the way) it plays my pc's error sound and closes Qrack. I can fix this by changing the sky brush to a different texture and getting rid of the lava. This allows the map to compile and launch. Once I get in the game though it spawns me in one of the outer walls instead of where the info_player_start is. I can walk out of the wall and fall to the floor. Once i'm on the floor I am able to walk around the bottom of the map until i hit an invisible wall or the game window turns black. I've tried all I can think of and can't get it to work properly, any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks. 
 
What are the coordinates of your info_player_start? Likely the entire map needs to be shifted to be inside +/-4096. 
 
The info_player_start is at -1440 8832 360 
Standard BSP Limit 
Yep that's it. Select all and move to center everything over the world's 0 0 0. Make sure you have Texture Lock on when you move it or everthing will get off.

Quake has a max positive or negative position of 4096 in any direction. I believe you can still have stuff past 4096, like distant towers or some such, it just won't be reachable. <side note> certain engines allow for larger maps if you compile with -bsp2 but I don't recommend it for beginners unless your map is truly that gobsmackingly huge. 
No Option To Add A Wad File 
https://speeed.ga/pic/none.jpg



I have the wad place in

quakedev/wads

Thanks 
Jaeon 
You need to set (or reset) your Quake directory in Preferences. 
Follow Up 
Merry Christmas ! I see that you are the author of the top notch youtube tutorials. I did not want to be more specific in my initial post. What I am attempting is to add a generic game, namely Kingpin. I again followed your setup tutorial. I was able to add a def file(which initially did not provide for a worldspawn) but by cutting and pasting other def or fgd files I overcame that problem. That does not mean the I solved the problem. I was also able to get the textures in Trenchbroom though I can't be specific as to how.

Maybe this log will help. By no means do I expect you to solve this but any suggestions would be great

---- qbsp / ericw-tools v0.18.1 ----
Input file: k1.map
Output file: k1.bsp

---- LoadMapFile ----
*** WARNING 06: No info_player_deathmatch entities in level
36 faces
6 brushes
3 entities
1 unique texnames
3 texinfo

*** WARNING 00: No wad or _wad key exists in the worldmodel
Processing hull 0...
---- Brush_LoadEntity ----
6 brushes
12 planes
---- CSGFaces ----
36 brushfaces
24 csgfaces
12 mergedfaces
---- SolidBSP ----
24 split nodes
6 solid leafs
19 empty leafs
0 water leafs
0 detail leafs
0 detail illusionary leafs
0 detail fence leafs
0 illusionary visblocker leafs
33 leaffaces
33 nodefaces
---- Portalize ----
19 vis leafs
19 vis clusters
48 vis portals
---- FillOutside ----
18 outleafs
---- MergeAll ----
6 mergefaces
---- SolidBSP ----
6 split nodes
6 solid leafs
1 empty leafs
0 water leafs
0 detail leafs
0 detail illusionary leafs
0 detail fence leafs
0 illusionary visblocker leafs
6 leaffaces
6 nodefaces
---- Portalize ----
1 vis leafs
1 vis clusters
0 vis portals
---- Tjunc ----
12 world edges
24 edge points
0 edges added by tjunctions
0 faces added by tjunctions
---- MakeFaceEdges ----
---- GrowRegions ----
Processing hull 1...
Processing hull 2...
*** WARNING 16: Texture b_cp_v18 not found
---- WriteBSPFile ----
Wrote k1.bsp
17 planes 340
8 vertexes 96
6 nodes 144
3 texinfo 120
6 faces 120
12 clipnodes 96
2 leafs 56
6 marksurfaces 12
24 surfedges 96
13 edges 52
1 textures 8
lightdata 0
visdata 0
entdata 401

0.031 seconds elapsed
Peak memory usage: 168816 (164.9k) 
Vis Murderation. 
0....1....2....3....4....5\
WARNING: RecursiveLeafFlow: recursion on leaf 550


Help please.

Yes I have googled and searched through this thread and see leafs mentioned a lot but don't understand what is going on nor how to fix it.

Yes I have used a LOT of func_detail_walls and func_detail_illusionaries

Yes my map does have a lot of botched rotated stuff tho.

Ta
 
Yes my map does have a lot of botched rotated stuff tho

Live by the sword.... 
Thanks Kinn. 
Any idea how to fix or reduce the Leaf Recursion error?

Incidentally, I didn't get this error when I did a fullvis a week or two ago, when I already had almost all of the rotated stuff in place. 
I Unno 
I assume the warning message doesn't indicate the area of the map where the problem is?

Is what you've posted all the info that you have? 
Wired Lmscale Behavior 
trying to compile map with options (using ericw-tools 0.18.1):
light.exe -lmscale 4

And here results on different sourceports (latest available versions):
FTE https://imgur.com/a/6mLY1mM
QS https://imgur.com/a/GyzozC8
QSS https://imgur.com/a/jE0nvBA

For FTE all working well. According to http://www.celephais.net/board/view_thread.php?id=4&start=19267&end=19267#19267 this feature supported by QSS, but actually not, or im doing something wrong? Maybe i need some additional parameters or config tweaks for QSS? And is this feature supported by QS?

And one more question about ericw-light. When im using options:
light.exe -extra4 -lmscale 4
it reports error:
C:\projects\ericw-tools\light\trace_embree.cc:696: Q_assert(rayindex <= 32767) failed.

Anyone know any workarounds for this particular options combination? 
 
Hey, I downloaded gtkradiant, made a test map, and found the bsp menu empty, so I cant compile. I then found a link to netradiant, made a testmap and tried to compile. it makes a testmap.bak file. I need a bsp file right? the hell do i do? 
@-StrickNine 
That's because GtKRadiant is an editor, not a compiler.
For god compiler files search for ericw compiler

I tried a long time to get the compiler running under Radiant.
Then I decided to use the editor for maps,
and save the map to a different file with the compiler tools.
Works fine now. 
 
thanks for the reply madfox. I see now in radiant when i use the compile options it writes it to qe3bsp.bat, but the syntax is all wrong so it doesnt work. I downloaded the ericw tools and did it manually. The level loads, but the textures don't. Any idea why? 
@strickNine 
Check for spaces in the pathnames to your wad. Compilers can chock on those. I recommend using Necros' Compiling GUI to simplify the process. https://shoresofnis.wordpress.com/utilities/ne_q1spcompilinggui/ 
#20009 (@KLIMaka) 
I don't know why you're getting different results in qss from either of the other two engines.
what I can say, however, is that you should be using the _lmscale worldspawn/entity key instead of the -lmscale commandline arg - this will fix QuakeSpasm/others (by providing multiple sets of lightmap data in a backwards-compatible way, allowing for opportunistic upgrades). (This also allows different lightmap scales per func_detail etc, unlike the commandline arg.) 
Wad File 
When the wad file doesn't load it means the path is unclear.

You can open the *.map file with TexPad and at the beginning you see something like:

"classname" "worldspawn"
"message" "MyMap"
"worldtype" "0"
"sounds" "4"
"wad" "C:/Quake/ID1/Quake101.wad"


It is the wad path you should look at and make sure the wad files are in C:\Quake|ID1\... 
#20014 (@Spike) 
Thanks! I tried it before, but just now figured out that
_lmscale == 1/-lmscale 
Trigger_teleport, Info_teleport_destination And Trigger_once 
Hello, I am teleporting monsters into my map. I have made two functioning examples. They work fine. The third teleports the monster to 0, 0, 0 no matter what I try. I know the third example is set correctly because when I make a map just to test it no problems occur. Any thoughts? 
Jaeon 
There's a problem with the teleport destination. Check if the targetname is correct, if the (skill) spawnflags are correct, and if it's placed correctly (enough space, not inside geometry). 
Figured It Out 
The first teleport combo was set wrong but none the less it worked. The second was a copy and paste of the first with target and targetnames changed and it worked as well. The third one was a new build with the same target and targetname scheme used previous with minor changes to indicate new events. Initially I was transported to 0, 0, 0. I saw an error and fixed it then the monster went to 0,0,0. I spent a couple hours trying various things but none of that was fruitful so I began asking for help and rereading the docs. I interpreted them differently and fixed my scheme. It now works. The reason my third scheme worked in a map with no other schemes seems to verify that one or two mistakes can be forgiven but as in life if you keep making the same mistake over and over you will pay. Thanks for the reply negke 
Coloured Light ~ Switch On/off 
I have a room with two lights.
One is coloured, the other one not.
When I add a button I can switch the white one on/off,
if I switch the coloured one nothing happens.
Is this preordered? 
 
Can't output centerprint message if activator is not "player" in standart progs.dat (trigger_relay or other). Is there any way to do this? 
 
Set an enemy | 1 key/value field on the trigger sending the message. In singleplayer, the player is always edict number 1 (worldspawn being 0), and the entity being activated should still consider the player its enemy, thus sending the message properly- at least in my experience. Note that this only works in singleplayer, as MP will have different edict numbers for different players. 
@Spud 
I understand your idea, it is interesting, but it does not work for me. The event sends a monster. I added him the property "enemy" "1". He is killed by a Vore's shell. But the message is not displayed.

I looked at the source code.

void () monster_death_use =
{
...  
if (! self.target)     return;  

activator = self.enemy;  
SUB_UseTargets ();
};

Only a number is assigned here. But elsewhere the entity is verified.    

if (activator.classname == "player" && (self.spawnflags & SPAWNFLAG_NOMESSAGE) == 0)

How can this work? 
 
And I have another problem. If I set "enemy" "1" for a monster, then his stops seeing me 
Suggestion For Digs 
Hi Digs,

I think you can use the following hack to get your message to display:
https://tomeofpreach.wordpress.com/2012/11/18/mid-map-entity-spawning/
Use this hack to create a trigger with your message, which gets spawned when the Vore dies. You'll need to make sure that the trigger is so big that the player will hit it straight away - why not make it the size of the whole map! 
@Preach 
Thank you very much! This is a very interesting decision. I will try to use it in the future when the opportunity arises. But I already sent the map for which it was necessary. Therefore, now only the next time. Thanks again 
Anyone Using Linux To Map ? 
And would point me in the right direction for tools of the trade, wanted to start making maps for a long time, just lurked around for almost a year... 
@vossk 
Trenchbroom is available for linux:
https://github.com/kduske/TrenchBroom/releases
As well as EricW's compilers:
https://ericwa.github.io/ericw-tools/

I don't use Linux, but this is what I'm using currently for mapping and am pretty happy with it. 
Unreal Engine Question 
Does anyone have a pipeline going from Trenchbroom to unreal engine 4? Or failing that, is there a good way to “map” in unreal engine 4 in a vaguely “quakey” manner? 
Starbuck 
Don't have any experience with it myself, but you might want to check out HammUEr:

https://nte.itch.io/hammuer 
 
HammUEr will be your best bet, me thinks. I havent used it personally but it very much seems to be worth the money. 
HammEUr 
That’s a terrible name for something that looks really good. Thanks! Will look into it. 
How To Change A Q2 Map's Gravity By Hitting An Ingame Button / Trigger 
Is there any resource that could help me find a way to change gravity in Quake2 midmap? Either a tutorial on how to create such a custom entity, a way to alter the existing trigger_gravity in order to affect players as well, or some other way?

Thanks 
TrenchBroom For CTF Maps? 
I'm trying to make a Threewave map. Does anyone know where to find the FGD/DEF files for use with TrenchBroom or another Level Editor? They don't seem to be anywhere. 
Open A Door Using A Key 
How would I create a door that rises upwards when activated by a key? I am using Trenchbroom 2. 
Thoth: 
Good question about CTF.

As far as I know, back in the day CTF mappers would just edit their own copy of the fgd to define a few more entities, because there weren't that many new entities to add & they didn't have many interesting keys to set on them.

(Or even manually edit the map file to add the entities.)

You have item_flag_team1 and item_flag_team2 for the red/blue flags. Then info_player_team1 and info_player_team2 for the initial spawns. The spawn entities could have the angle key set to determine their facing. That's about it.

For respawns after the initial team spawns, that just used normal info_player_deathmatch entities. 
What About Runes? 
Are they just the normal quake runes? Or is there a different info? 
 
Runes will automatically spawn at randomly selected info_player_deathmatch locations. 
Failing To Understand Func_wall 
Hello folks,

My goal: Have an explosive box blow a hole in a wall. Simply deleting a brush is all I'm looking for.

The following image shows what I've got:
https://i.imgur.com/fN5jwAk.jpg

I've tried to directly "target" and "killtarget" the func_wall from the misc_explobox, and I've tried throwing a trigger_relay in the middle because some Quake wiki mentioned it. Tried a short delay and I can't really justify why, just throwing things at the func_wall and hoping something sticks. I'm considering using a silent, instantaneous func_plat to "disappear", but there must be a more elegant solution.

Thanks for reading my post 
Tez 
Create a func_door, choose the appropriate spawnflag for the key color you want and then give the value -1 for the angle key. (If you want the door to go down, give the value -2.) 
TheNewFlesh. 
I have no idea, logic looks sensible to me. But the first thing I'd do is troubleshoot the explodobox, replace it with a button and see if that works. If it does and there's an issue with explodoboxes targetting stuff, then put an invisible shootable button beneath the explodobox and have that killtarget the func wall? 
@NewFlesh, Shambler 
Exploboxes won't trigger or killtarget entities when they explode because on death they run the barrel_explode function, which just goes kablooey and deletes itself and is missing the SUB_UseTargets function that allows an entity to trigger and killtarget things. However, with the dark majyyks of map hacks, it's possible to rig up a setup to do what NewFlesh wants, with only one extra entity and thankfully no usual fussing with any info_notnulls.

Normally, you could just manually set the explosive box to killtarget something by sticking SUB_UseTargets someplace in its key/value fields, but just about every field is already taken- th_die is already filled with barrel_explode. th_pain works, but only activates if the barrel isn't blown up in one shot, and then you have the wall already missing and the barrel still clearly not blown up. If your name is Preach and you're a member of Mensa, maybe you could juryrig something with SUB_CalcMoveDone, but it's five in the morning and none of us have time for that crap. The one big field that we want that a boom-box doesn't use by default is use, but how do you use a barrel o' boom? Make a trigger_once around it with a reasonable amount of health (both sizes of explodebox have 20 health, for reference) and make it just big enough to overlap the funbox. Have the trigger_once target both the explodebox and a relay that killtargets the wall- this is necessary because in id1 progs, you can't have one relay both target and killtarget things at once. Then add a use | barrel_explode key/value pair to the explodebox- this will make it go boom like normal when called upon by the trigger_once. In short:

classname | barrel_explode
origin | (wherever the box is placed)

targetname | splodebox <- add this line, change name if desired
use | barrel_explode <- add this line

classname | trigger_once
target |
splodebox <- make it match the targetname above
health |
20 <- this is the default explodebox health

classname | trigger_relay
origin | (doesn't matter)
targetname |
splodebox <- share a targetname with the actual explosive box so both are hit by the trigger_once
killtarget | splodewall <- use whatever name fits your normal entity naming schemes

classname | func_wall
targetname |
splodewall <- this is the wall you want to be 'destroyed,' so link it appropriately

Double check to make sure everything's wired up right and it should work just fine. Note that this really works with anything you want instead of an actual misc_explobox, but by using an actual box (even if the box itself isn't actually shot by the player) you don't have to worry about spoofing a model or including extra textures or anything. Or, you could just add a tiny invisible button like Shambler suggested... if you're a weenie. 
20051, Continued 
The bit that says
classname | barrel_explode
should actually be
classname | misc_explobox or misc_explobox2
depending on which size box you want to use. I slacked off in proofreading and now I'm the weenie. 
So Basically. 
Use the shootable button method. 
 
I hope you stub your toe on your dumb button. 
Yup. 
Then it will trigger the relay and remove the func wall. Unlike your essay of code, god knows what all that does, maybe someone else can read it and summarise for me. 
From The Quakelab - Exploding Walls 
Here's a file passed the BBS -
Exploding Walls v1.0 from The QuakeLab
6 okt 1996.
It is a nice example of exploding walls.

exploding walls

Have Fun With It! 
Func_wall Suggestions 
Thank you kindly for the suggestions, folks! I'll sink my teeth into it ASAP and I'll be sure to upload a version for testing when it shapes up a little more. 
@spud 
Why not a trigger once under a false floor (beneath the explosion) with health set instead of all that? 
 
No real reason other than autism, I guess. Or that trigger_onces don't take damage from explobox explosions. There's a thousand ways to accomplish the same thing, I just went with the trigger setup out of lack of knowledge for what triggers and buttons would do when in floors, behind geometry, inside the button, etc. 
Heh 
trigger_onces don't take damage from explobox explosions

duh me 
Spud You're Scaring The Children 
A trigger_once inside the explodobox will suffice 
Hide The Children. 
Trigger_once doesn't take damage from the explodobox. Keep up, man. 
Kept Up 
Quick test shows it working here 
 
You got a copy of the .map you can upload? I tried it multiple ways and no matter what, the trigger wasn't hurt and required being shot by the player separately, even when it's buried inside the box itself and should be at ground zero of the explosion. 
I Tested Earlier Also... 
I had same results as Spud. As he and others posted, explodbox did no damage to the trigger. 
Map+bsp 
 
Strange, I'm using what should by all means be the exact same setup and it doesn't work. I thought maybe it was related to entity order but my test has the explobox listed before the trigger_once, just like you do. 
Very Strange 
You can compile the map I uploaded and it works? 
How Do I Make Movers In Quake (Darkplaces)? 
The only id Tech-based game I've ever mapped for is Prey. I like its way to manage movers from its scripting system, where triggers call a scripted function that specifies which movers will have to move, in which direction, how long the movement must take, how many degrees they must rotate...

With the recent news of 3DRealms releasing a Darkplaces-based FPS soon, I started using GTKRadiant to map for Darkplaces. While the process of building the architecture for a level is quite similar to Preditor (because Preditor was based on GTKRadiant), there is no func_mover to select. So how do I add moving brushes in Darkplaces levels? 
@ww 
Yeah, compiled it using ericw's tools and it worked just fine, player_start health buffer and all. 
Devil Master 
This will be specific to the Wrath gamecode, not the DP engine code. For now, just mackle up placeholder movers using the vanilla Quake progs, using func_door, func_train or whatever, and then when 3DR release a dev kit for their game you'll have to convert your placeholder movers over to whatever system they are using. 
Movers In Darkplaces 
Oh. Then, I imagine there's no guarantee it's even gonna be possible to use something similar to Prey's movers, because 3DRealms had made a big deal about making everything with QuakeC, for authenticity's sake.
Which leads me to ask another question: is it possible to use QuakeC to move around models (e.g. .md3 models) instead? 
Explode Box Damages 
my trigger_once - no problems.. I set the health to 2, put the trigger inside (and outside) the box... works fine. 
Func_wall Question Closure 
Ladies and Gentlemen, you've truly gone above and beyond to satisfy my question, and I appreciate it very much.

TL;DR - So far, so good!

I tried trigger_once outside of my explobox, mostly satisfied, but in 1% of my playtests, a monster would trigger it and the wall sequence would fail.

My .map currently has a shootbutton underneath the explobox and it has triggered as intended in 100% of playtests so far. Today, I realized the button is making the typical button sound, and I'd rather not have that.

I'll try the trigger_once INSIDE the explobox, thanks again for the stream of suggestions. If I can't get it to work, I'll fall back to the button and accept the additional sound effect.

I just noticed there was further discussion about my question, so I felt the need to chime in. I do intend to post my map eventually, but it's my first "complete" map. I don't want to spam your board with numerous iterations of this cornball, amateur, mess of polygons. 
@-newflash 
#20058: closed wall that explodes, no matter how many monsters walk aside.
Just reset the path_corners somewhere behind the surface, or they will z-brush. 
Texture Problem? Any Ideas? 
Mostly empty map in which I test new textures. And it seems that some of them are causing problems, 'cause when I fill the level with standard texture, it compiles. One texture at a time it also compiles. But when there are many (no more than 10, actually), it doesn't. Is there a way to pin point the problem (without hours of combinations checking)? I would guess it's something to do with the name, but names are pretty standarad, like: snowed_rock and burned_wood.

line 6: Unrecognised string escape - \S
line 6: Unrecognised string escape - \s
line 6: Unrecognised string escape - \c
line 6: Unrecognised string escape - \Q
line 6: Unrecognised string escape - \I
line 6: Unrecognised string escape - \q
line 6: Unrecognised string escape - \И
line 6: Unrecognised string escape - \T
line 6: Unrecognised string escape - \G
line 6: Unrecognised string escape - \B
line 6: Unrecognised string escape - \S
line 6: Unrecognised string escape - \s
line 6: Unrecognised string escape - \c
line 6: Unrecognised string escape - \Q
line 6: Unrecognised string escape - \I
line 6: Unrecognised string escape - \s
line 6: Unrecognised string escape - \S
line 6: Unrecognised string escape - \s
line 6: Unrecognised string escape - \c
line 6: Unrecognised string escape - \Q
line 6: Unrecognised string escape - \I
line 6: Unrecognised string escape - \f

BTW, what would happen if I'd had textures with the same name? I'm asking, 'cause 2 my of wads have different textures named dry_wood.

---

Texture screen: https://drive.google.com/open?id=1mDFK8cLOlgiFY5CqVha5hmsoY_FGeh-i (they are mostly from Tomb Raider xD) 
The Solution? 
eh, I just copied parts of the map into the new file and it works... >_> 
Hi I Need Some Mapping Help. 
I have looked in here but....couldn't get a conclusion.

[19:36] Shambler: can you give me the top ten causes and top ten cures for massive greyscale in quakespasm in this day and age?

[19:36] Shambler: i get a fuck off big lump of it in one area of a map i am working on

[19:37] Shambler: the map is sealed and vises, the other areas are fine, this area is not looking towards an excessively detailed / open view

[19:37] Shambler: there's a lot of func_detail, backed up with worldspawn where it needs sealing

[19:39] Shambler: it occured during testing but not after tinkering with this area in particular (well i was tinkering with a gameplay element but not changing architecture there)
 
Hi 
[21:18] madfox : When I first entered this board in 1999 I was afraid Shambler was really developper of the monster in Quake.
[21:20] madfox : Later on I realized it was just a nickname.
[21:22] madfox: Maybe it's because I'm a foreigner who has to register to post.


Not sure who's Shambler anymore.., 
0.125 
Shambler.map is like madfox.mdl. The two of you should team up... or maybe you've been one and the same all this time! 
Fine. Sending The .map File To You To Fix. 
 
Shambler 
Any screenshots? Also have you tried older versions of ericw's tool to see if there's a difference? 
Hopefully A Dumb Question 
Is there any reason why when I walk down a long hallway, suddenly the nearby geometry goes invisible and I can see through to the other side of the map? Compiled with and without vis, same result.

I've uploaded a clip:
https://gfycat.com/ThatInnocentCrayfish 
 
Your map goes out of bounds, so to speak. Nothing can go beyond the -4096 and +4096 coordinates on each axis. 
@Dumptruck 
Shots from discord:

Before moving into greyflash area:
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/292236297173467138/558959023597289495/spasm0005.png

After moving:
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/292236297173467138/558959051493605377/spasm0006.png

Greyflash area from other side:
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/292236297173467138/558959083273584640/spasm0004.png

I've tried compiling with a new dev build ericw linked me, same issue.

BUT...


[10:24] Shambler: now i just checked and when i delete my big prefab-filled box, it works fine
[10:24] Shambler: prefab box is sealed with func_group (for easy access obvz), not worldspawn
[10:25] Shambler: but that should still stop it being drawn?
[10:25] Shambler: n.b. in image 2, that pillar is func_group or worldspawn now, not func_detail - i changed it cus there is a corridor behind and i was worried about line of sight....makes no difference ofc


It seems to be, in the words of Kinn "the engine hitting the limit of the number of faces it is allowed to draw"??

Obvz I will remove prefab box before release, and I can trim down some designs....but I've got plenty more detail to add....if there is other stuff I can do with func_whatevers....that is useful. 
 
the engine hitting the limit of the number of faces it is allowed to draw

This was always an issue in WinQuake (had to stick beefed up r_maxedges and r_maxsurfs in the config file).

...but, I would have expected QuakeSpasm has this pretty damn high (as in: "you'll never need to worry about it" high) by default??

Do these faces flicker on and off if you move around, shums? 
 
Thank you #20088, there is clearly some fat I can trim from that level 
 
Hello. I want to try to make some maps for Quake. Well, wanted since long ago, but never got far. Now I saw AD and discovered Trenchbroom and had my interest in Q mapping renewed. So I've read Trenchbroom manual, and tried some things, and got some questions.

1. Is there a way to create geometry by drawing it with vertexes from scratch and extruding or smth? In any Q editor?
What are standard ways to shape geometry in Trenchbroom? Vertex tool and Brush tool feel kind of awkward, probably because I dunno how to use them properly lol.
By far I've had most success with cuboids and CSG substract - made a kind of hall with rooms on sides to test various blnking lights in each room.

2. I've finally found out that stuff like doors is done with brush entities and their keys/values, after downloading Quake source maps from Romero's site and looking at them. Wasn't mentioned in manual much (not the brush entities themselves, but making various things :). Should I just continue to look up stuff in id maps and look up entity parameters in editor/the quake wiki entity guide or there exist some good tutorials on the subject? Seems to be better documented for id Tech 1 :)) 
 
Trenchbroom is a multi-game editor, so by design its manual doesn't talk much about the specifics of mapping for a particular game.

Have a look at:

https://quakewiki.org/wiki/Getting_Started_Mapping

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gONePWocbqA&list=PLgDKRPte5Y0AZ_K_PZbWbgBAEt5xf74aE 
@BlueSkullKey 
Doom and Quake mapping are very different beasts as you can see. Your best best is to learn to think and map in 3d. Especially with TrenchBroom as your tool of choice.

Now that being said, there is the "brush tool" (default is B) that you can use to "click" out vertices and then extrude. But I would not recommend making maps entirely this way. It's very limited in that it can only be used on an existing surface and only in 3d mode. It's also a bit clunky. Not many ppl use it AFAIK.

Your best bet is to watch my early tutorials on each of the tools and start creating brushes. For the most part, you will need to abandon most of what you have learned from Doom editing. Quake is true 3d and TB makes creating levels more of a 3d process than before.

The good news there are tons of resources here and elsewhere.

Bal's mapping streams are good to watch - although he's very fast.
https://www.twitch.tv/videos/370358937

Good luck! 
2 Post 
regarding the link above.... his mapping starts about 35 minutes into that video. 
 
Thanks for replies. I'll look through links/videos a little later.
I wasn't going to make maps using the brush tool only or such. I'm just trying to figure out what is the usual workflow for creating more complexly shaped things than a corridor or box room, before starting to make a finished map.
Seems that it is mostly adding up sloped/cut/rotated cuboid brushes?
I guess there's also nothing like subdividing faces to get more vertices. 
Freecs FTE Textures Trouble 
Hello, I have some troubles with textures on my map in FTE engine:

My map has low-quality textures and here is how it looks in darkplaces engine:
https://pp.userapi.com/c852036/v852036050/f069d/0_mPVRJq0RI.jpg

In darkplaces I added high quality textures in "textures" folder (each hd texture name corresponds to each lq texture name). I also use normal maps and gloss. Here is how it looks after that:
https://pp.userapi.com/c852036/v852036050/f068b/vqyePzRkKEg.jpg

I tried to do the same in FTE engine. So I have a map with low quality textures and I have some hd textures with normal maps and gloss in "textures" folder. Hd textures are loaded too:
https://pp.userapi.com/c856016/v856016024/17d19/O76Ncfgg5nQ.jpg

After that i decided to run this map in "Freecs" for FTE quake. The problem is that now hd textures are not loaded from "textures" folder. Only normal maps and gloss can be loaded. Screenshot:
https://pp.userapi.com/c852036/v852036050/f0664/6TWdO2Y4pPo.jpg

I replaced all the cfg files in freecs for cfg files from my mod. The graphics changed but my hd textures are still can not be loaded. I also tried to use different formats - tga and jpg for textures in "textures" folder but still no result. Map is in quake 3 format.

Does anyone know how to solve this issue?
(sorry if I made any mistakes, my English is still poor) 
 
try gl_load24bit 1 
Reply To Spike 
This variable is already set to 1 on those screenshots. I tried to change its value to 0 and return to 1 but still nothing changed. 
 
I have path with 3 path_corner ("wait" "-1"). I made 2 trigger_once for start func_train. But only one works. How to make to move to the next path_corner only in the event? 
Digs 
You can't... wait -1 stops the train permanently. 
 
rubicon 2 source has this feature ... every time it's triggered it starts moving again. 
 
I took a look at your source a while back, I'll add it to progs_dump for the next final release. It keeps coming up so ppl want it. 
Quick Question. 
I have seen in some maps glass that is transparent and I couldnt find any help on how to do this.
Can anyone tell me how to do something like this? 
Nolcoz 
"alpha" key on brush entities, from 0 (invisible) to 1 (opaque). 
Thanks! 
 
Water Fullbright/minlight 
Is there any way to make it so water is not a set brightness? I'm using waterfall textures from ikwhite that fall into a vanilla water texture. I need either a way to set the water texture to not be fullbright/minlight or a better texture set for a waterfall into a body of standing water. Thanks for any help. 
^^^^ 
I have not tried this but you try a func illusionary brush above the liquid with a black texture and set alpha between 0 and 1 (i.e. 0.5) to darken the brush underneath.

Good luck! 
@dumptruck_ds 
Thanks. I'll give that a try. 
Different Music Tracks In One Map? 
Hi!
I'm still trying to get more atmosphere to different sections in my map.
Does anybody know if there's a mod or something to play different music tracks in a map, activated by a trigger? 
#20122 AD(Arcane Dimensions) 
Has "trigger_cdtrack"

I'm sure you could look at the QC and use that in your own progs.dat if you did not want to use the whole Mod. 
@_GunStHighway 
Short tutorial from Inside3D.
Quake1 Background Sounds 
@damage_inc And Madfox 
Thanks. I'm testing this and tell you if it works.

Best wishes
Gunny 
Noob Question About Removing Limits 
Hi. I am new to mapping, and working on my first quake map, for AD mod. I am using the latest Quakespasm and Trenchbroom 2.
I am about about halfway done with the map, and seem to have hit the limits. When I compile, no lights and everything is dark.
From scouring the net, I understand I need to use BSP2 and sv_protocol 999 ?
How do I do this ? Where do I change these things ? 
 
From scouring the net, I understand I need to use BSP2 and sv_protocol 999 ?

You 100% do not. 
 
No lights and pitch black map does not sound like something related to hitting any BSP limits, you probably broke something else.
To test bsp2, just put -bsp2 in your qbsp.exe params. 
Compile With Light 
Try running LIGHT.exe when you compile. Tends to brighten things up sometimes. 
@Strydom 
Come over to Quake Mapping Discord for real time help. https://discordapp.com/invite/j5xh8QT

Sounds like you are running light but may not have enough (any?) in your map. If you didn't run LIGHT the map would be full brightness. 
@Strydom 
AND come over to Terrafusion Discord for real time banter and casual on-topic and off-topic chat.
https://discord.gg/d5mytUj 
Silly Question 
and totally out of order,
but how do I take a screenshot in Doom1? 
Screenshotting Doom Properly 
the correct way would be to play it on a 1993 CRT monitor, and take a photo of the monitor display using a traditional film camera, and then get your photos developed (i dunno where you do this now, i used to take mine to Boots in the 90s) and then post your photo via physical mail to a magazine publishing house that still prints a semi-amateur PC gaming magazine, like the sort you'd see in the 90s, you know the ones with headlines like "Commander Keen Kerbstomps The Konsole Kweens". Finally, get the magazine publishers to send you a copy of the edition containing the print of your photo. Anything less just wouldn't feel proper and retro. 
@madfox 
depends on the engine you're using
i'd recommend gzdoom [prtscr button] 
Ah! 
@-Kinn: As I'm a publisher myself I can take my screenshot with a digital camera, send the picture to my computer, and than ask myself what to do with the blurry picture I got myself. Then I won't offend any magazine publisher, or in this case ID1, who is been that good to deliver the Doom'93 programm for free, on which I run it on a 386 PC.

@-spy: Thanks for the info. I'm aware of the SLADE programm, which give me all possible access to the programm itself.

There are a lot of screenshots published, so it's a bit stupid to ask the question anyway. Me in my ninties adaption was thinking there would really be a F12 button to do so.

Why I want a screenshot? Well, after converting all monsters to Quake1 I thought it a good qc aprehension to do so with the weapons as well.
Blessed the poor of armors, for they will inherate the heavens of weapons. 
@madfox 
I use GZDoom and F12 is the key to take screenshots, but i don't remember if i had to change it or not... anyway, if you are using GZDoom just go to the "customize controls" menu and you can set any key you want to take screenshots 
Thanks 
I tried printscreen, but it results in a pink-blue gamma error. Then used my old 386 with VGS (dos screencapture) but then Doom shut of because of the Terminate and Stay Resident prog.
Will try it out anyway. 
Sv_startsound: Not Precached 
While I'm modding, I still can't lay my hands on this little error.

I can't help it. Everytime I add a new monster, with its specific alterations, the game stays persistent giving this warning.
Sometimes after a few weeks, or pakking the file to a pak file it disappears.

How does it come? Is it something hard coded or just a flawn in the engine? 
 
make sure you've called precache_sound() before you call sound() with that name...
some engines allow you to call precache_sound outside of spawn functions while others consider that a fatal error. these permissive engines still expect you to precache, its not fatal to fail to do so but you'll still get warning spam.

secondly, remember that many engines (including quakespasm) are lame and favour files from paks over files outside of them.
(hence why qss and qs display slightly different ordering from the path command).
So yeah, don't put your progs.dat into a pak, at least while still developing your mod. 
Yes 
but I precached new sound in a soldier.qc, made a new sound folder for it, the script runs fine in fteqc and still these warnings apear. The sounds come through well.
Can't think of another place to store them, world.qc?


I run the game in quakespasm_spike_ad. 
WAD For Original Jrbase1.map 
Any idea where can one get the gfx/base.wad file that should have come with the example jrbase1.map in the original source code of QuakeEd? I’m working on a MacOS port of the app and would like to run some tests with it. 
@-Izhido 
I jumped into my archive, installed the original QuakeEd. Read me shows This is qED(tm) Version 2.0.0126 (26 Jan'1998)
I couldn't find the jrbase1.map, probably a later version.
Maybe you could combine it with the original QUAKE101.WAD.

Here is the original sample file that came with Qed2.
Hope it is of any use. 
And 
qedsamp is another one.
This one is slightly larger (2.48Mb).
qedsampq.zip = 1.752Mb 
@-madfox 
Thanks for the help! Alas, the files do not seem to be compatible with what the app needs.
Just to clarify, the app I'm porting is the very, very old QuakeEd written in Objective-C for NeXTstep machines.
Somehow, the app expects a WAD file whose first lump is called precisely PALETTE and contains palette data, followed by many miptextures (and *only* miptextures). I'm not sure that qed, or any of the modern map editors, would have (or generate) files following such a strict sequence and format. 
@-izhido 
I only have the light version of qED as it was a commercial programm, but there´s a work around for it.

With adquedit_v13 you can manage to extract the wadfile into specs for *.lmp and *.mip textures. But there's glitch, it will show the texture files in 16bit only and that's really bad.
Solution is to export your texture files to *.bmp 256bit and export them to *.pcx.

From there you can import them in adquedit again and export them to *.lmp. Then import them back again and export them to *.mip files.
I know, it's a bit complicated, but it works. One good thing is that adquedit has the quakepal.lmp stored.

So let's say you've got your directory with quakepal.lmp first, then you start adding the others to it and when you use quake101.wad you'll be able to import them in Wally and compose your own wad file for research.

I know it is quiet a lot of hussle, but as I suspect you're a tester it shouldn'ty be that much work. 
Monster_damage 
There is a little overvieuw which counts the maximal damage versus ammunition towards monsters.
I'm eagerly searching for it to finish my level.
Does somebody has it close at hand? 
 
This is probably not what you are looking for but it's helped me in the past.

http://www.celephais.net/board/view_thread.php?id=61262&start=26&end=26#26 
Sure 
it's a close goal to reach.
thanks! 
Missing Textures In Darkplaces 
Hi all. About three years ago, I started on my first ever map and got a long way into it before real life got in the way.

I'm coming back to it now and finding that some of the textures seem to be missing in Darkplaces:
https://i.imgur.com/qeL3pUp.jpg
(maps works fine in Quakespasm).

In those three years, I replaced my PC and thought I'd copied the entire Quake directory across so I'm not sure what's gone wrong.

I've tried reinstalling Darkplaces but the textures are still missing.

Any ideas gratefully received. Thanks. 
Re: Missing Textures In Darkplaces 
If only I could delete my previous post.

I found the problem. A .shader file in the ID1/scripts folder. I removed it and bingo! All textures display properly again.

Now to get round to finishing my first ever map ... 
Questions About Csaddon For Quake3 
Questions About Csaddon [EDIT]
Posted by FTE terrain editor, csaddon on 2019/05/15 14:48:19
Hello!
I was making map with landscape for quake3 and when I decided to make landscape with q3 patches I remembered about the csaddon in fte engine. Yesterday I tried it and it works pretty fine but I have some questions about it.

First of all, which type of heightmap is it using? Is it a kind of format which some terrain-editors like worldmachine can use or it is a format which was made only for csaddon editor? And where is it saved? I cant find any heightmap files in maps or in any other folders.

The second question is can I make a lightmap from the sun (q3 shader light) or can I make lightmap for terrain without using any realtime lights? And if I can do that, what exactly should I do?

Thanks, and sorry for my poor English... 
 
its some private sparse format, split over multiple files (which allows for some massive terrain).
losslessly exporting it to a raw heightmap would take 16gb.
the texture blends (and granularity) is unlikely to be compatible with other programs, and would be about 16 times bigger, and it would still be missing data.

the sections get written into some 'maps/FOO/block_XX_YY.hms' files, which you'll generally find in some annoying homedir location somewhere that everyone forgets about etc.
use the 'path' command at the engine's console and you'll see lots of paths, files usually get written to the first one listed.
or `dir maps/*/*.hms` should include the system path info too (and can list dupes if you have the same file in multiple places - a red colour shows inactive entries). 
Landscape Works With Csaddon In FTE 
Hello, I copy this question from my thread which was deleted for some reason. I have some questions about terrain editor in FTE.

First of all, where are all those terrain files saved? I checked maps and other mod folders, but nothing is there.

The second question is which format is used for terrain in that editor? Is it some kind of format which can be used in other editors like worldmachine, or is it format which was created only for FTE?

I wonder how can I make light for terrain on my map. I am making map in q3 format and I would like to use only lightmaps without any rtl lights. But if there is no other way than use rtl lights is there any possibilitiy to make directional rtl light? I mean not pointlight but something similar to sun light shader in q3.

P.S. Nice editor. It is pretty convinient to use and in my opinion it is the simpliest way to make landscapes in quake forks. Thanks for that. 
Sorry For Coping This Here 
Sorry, I didnt notice, that Shambler already copied my question here 
Lightmaps 
What about adding the lightmap. Is it possible to make lightmap "from the sun" for terrain which was created with csaddon? And if it is possible how can I do that? 
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