"Some of the hot tempered posts might be due to people's job in the industry?"

No, it's more because people's attitudes towards the issue are wrong. It may be a grey area and maybe nobody prosecutes over it but it IS important. It's like when open source people blow gaskets over GPL abuses. 

Willem:
This is what people say until they have some. When that happens it suddenly becomes very important. :)

We inhabit a situation in which IP is clearly inane, yet, we as creators of IP need the artificial monopoly of IP to get money and survive.

So, what I'm suggesting is that we don't pretend IP is morally OK, regardless of how we feel we need to use it at this present moment. 

inertia

I'm not getting into this argument as it's even more of a cesspool than the original one. However, to suggest that people's creations deserve no protection under the law is insulting at best. 

This is straying even further from the original topic, but I think it's pretty well accepted (even in the legal community) that software EULA's are unconscionable and unlikely to hold up in court.

This is not to say that we shouldn't respect the developer's rights, but EULA's are getting more and more ridiculous as time goes on. Nobody reads them or takes them seriously.

I just love the fact that they all pretty much boil down to this: you don't own the product you just paid us money for.. you've bought the right to use it for a while, in the limited way set out in the agreement, but you can't do anything else with it, or resell it, or modify it, etc... oh, by the way, we can remove access or change the product at any time without prior notice or consent.

Sorry for going off on a tangent... 

when someone creates something new, it should be respected, and he should be compensated and given credit.

This map probably doesn't contradict any of the above, it's more of a tribute, it's not blatantly exploiting doom3 stuff, taking away glory or income or anything.

Since the digital world enabled making copies so easily without destroying the original, the laws that have been built around the traditional ownership issues have been lagging. I don't know yet of any good concept inventions (patents come to mind as one system but it's too heavy for this stuff) to ensure some benefit to the creator of an easily copyable thing. 

Can you pls somebody link/send me the q3 radiant editor? I am probably too lame to google it, thanks. icq 259689233, email jardomir.b@seznam.cz, thanks a lot, sorry. 

http://www.qeradiant.com 

Talk about the map, stop whining about copyright.

Shambler's post said it all in a nutshell anyway.

JPL - you're wrong. 

All is fair in love and war!
If people don't like it, I'll personally kill them!
If they just want a fight, I'll still kill them.
If the policemen come to take me away, I'll give a good fight, they wont take me down easy, I might even kill them too!

Hahahaha!!

HAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAH!! 

The days of fair use and sharing of creative work are over. Big Content has been pushing for years for ever more restrictive licenses and paranoid attitudes about IP. This all filters down as more and more ordinary people come to accept it as normal that all information should be jealously hoarded, and that the only legitimate form of 'tribute' comes written on a fat check.

All the people who are having aneurisms over Distran's use of the Doom 3 textures (which, incidentally, isn't the first map to have done so) I don't know whether you all work in the 'industry' or not, it's not really important. Please take some time to google 'The Right To Read' by Richard Stallman, if just one person opens their eyes to the real evil of this age this post will have been worth it. 

... If Carmack and co didn't like the community's fair-use of textures.. they'd sure as hell do something about it. (It IS fair-use, even though it may be plenty of them. A small community of id-software groupies playing an ancient release for non-profit. No harm. It's FAIR).

More-over, he probably wouldn't want you to ask.. For plenty of reasons, but basically because he is beholden to investors and lawyers, whether he likes it or not. Possibly forcing him to say "ummm... no" in public, him and us both lose. Hell, they ENCOURAGE mod communities. It's good for business, and good for gamers.

I'd love to see a TC with these textures and Dis' eye for detail ;> 

Dave's not here man... 

its pretty obvious from the start this will be a different sort of gameplay so you should adjust accordingly (obviously some people didnt).

Loved the look, the textures were employed better than in jpl's map IMHO.

Only nitpick was that bit where I got stuck, I seriously thought that area was going to lead somewhere. 

...the textures were employed better than in jpl's map IMHO.

Yes, I agree on that point: I have to admit distrans really kick my ass there :D 

I liked the textures - though I admit having a hard time spotting a door initially (I was wondering why you had given me the silver key, as I didn't even see a door to open let alone unlock). I played on Easy since everyone spoke of how hard it was. Easy had a few moments of kind of toughness, where I managed to become a little frantic. The thing is, the only enemy that was a real problem were the Defenders. They were the only ones who did any considerable damage.

People spoke often of cheap moments, but the only one that seemed cheap to me was going up the stairs after the silver door, and having the Defender spawn in below you, with the lasers ahead of you. I suffered a lot of damage from that, as I had no room to move - in all other occassions, space was most definitely ample.

I played it in DarkPlaces so you know, it ran fine - maybe a tad slower than other maps, but never slow in terms of gameplay responsiveness.

I find great humor in people speaking of this map being less about running ahead, and how its different from other Quake maps, as it seemed to be more Rushing Ahead than other Quake maps for me... But I also generally play very conservatively. This could also just be an element of skill 0.

The shaft was some rather overpowered item placement, it completely nullified the existence of the Edie. Pretty solid map, at least on skill 0. Wish it was less linear though, and I do wish you had marked ... less obvious, items as secrets, as I do get curious about such things.

Alright, having just now ran around it in God mode on normal and hard, I can see that it would be quite difficult - though I had trouble even seeing the monstes due to the Pyros. It actually looked annoying at times, particularly the Eliminators, who are quite annoying even with God mode on. 

Make greater use of the destructible brushes - all that machinery and nothing to break!

Same goes to you Biff! 

 

I'm playing this map (on skill 3) and I want to know: is there a way to keep a demo in record mode while I do a quickload? 

I think JoeQuake supports that kind of stuff...
I've never tried it.. 

You can start recording a demo after quickloading in JoeQuake.
JoeQuake is amazing anyway. 

I played the map on Telejano. It worked great until the exit. The gold key opens the elevator
but the elevator never comes down. I liked the map thank you. Oh, the shambler trap was about the only thing I DIDN'T have a tough battle with. Before going through the door to the trap, I shot the shambler and backed up to the closed door by the button, the shambler wouldn't follow and I shot him from a distance like the coward I am. 

that repeating sound that may want to be a music, is funny. but is not. its stupid and annoying.

i started playing it in joequake. i cant figure how to get past red lasers. i got the under way, but come back to the starting hall. 

you have to shoot something behind the lasers, the other path (through the vent) was just a diversion 

found it. i was fooled by somebody that said previously, that up the lift and behind the crates... and I was looking especially there. 

the end difficulty is mad. the only chance (for me at least) is to run to a safer place right when u get the golden key and when near exit. and to fight the enemy from there. but of course all paths are blocked and i still got wounded...