News | Forum | People | FAQ | Links | Search | Register | Log in
General Abuse
Talk about anything in here. If you've got something newsworthy, please submit it as news. If it seems borderline, submit it anyway and a mod will either approve it or move the post back to this thread.

News submissions:
First | Previous | Next | Last 
is down. and will be down for the foreseeable future as I have no interest in resurrecting it. 
I never emailed you when went down, but assumed that you didn't want to keep paying for it so I just moved to quaddicted. Thanks for the hosting while it lasted though :) 
Yes, many thanks to you scampie for some good solid years of hostin' 
Anyone know if there are any updated Dark Forces engines available? I seem to remember there being some a while ago, but I haven't had any luck in finding any. 
Kudos To Scampoe 
Ditto on thanks for hosting, Scamp. I too have moved on the quaddicted, due to the kindness of Spirit, but was glad to have your help. 
To Biff + Spirit 
Biff: what's the url? doesn't seem to work right now (forbidden). I like to drop by your site every now and then to see the awesome pics you put up. I sometimes even read your film reviews :)

Spirit: is there any way to find out who is hosted on Quaddicted? 
conversation with an old man about gta4
aka 'Grand Theft Auto IV: FAQ for old people' 
Biff just hasn't put on something visible yet I think.

I updated with the full list of hosted people, thanks for the nudge. ;) 
4 New Reviews

Fort Ratsack (by biff_debris)
Slave To A Machine (by RickyT23)
Lair of the Dragon Ogre (by DeathMethod)
Tower of Dal Gurak (by Spy) 
All Is Quiet... 
(Thanks Tronyn/Underworldfan btw!) 
anyone decent at skin modification? I don't need a new skin, I just want to modify one so that it's different colours and a bit dirtier. But I suck too much. 
Thanks for review :) 
Np, Nice Map. 
Liked the horde combat.

Another question: Anyone want to rotate a skybox for me? Again this should be simple, but I tried for like more than an hour yesterday and kept fucking it up. Yup, I can be a real retard. 
Graphs And Numbers, Mmmh 
I made some statistics from the sp maps: 
1997, The Year Of Creativity 
Yet, the greatest map of that period is missing from the archive. Behold! 
I'm Thinking.. 
we need two more bsps adding to that archive ;) 
1997 may have been filled with creativity, but it appears that the time around 2000/2001 was the silver age of quake mapping due to the high ratio of awesome maps and their volume. 
I Think I Am A Major Contributor To The Blip Right At The End 
nice work on generating those stats. 
Actually - Do These Figures 
run right up to present day?

ie - where it says 2006 - 2007, er, I know how Excell graphs can work, so the figure plotted for 2007, albeit right at the end of the x-axis, does that mean figures for the entire of 2007?

It's 01.01.1996 - 31.12.2007.
2008 looks promising though. 
I think 2008 will be promising indeed...
Since 3/4 years the number of released map didn't changed that much, so let's assume we will see the same number of release in 2008. So regarding the fact that map quality is constantly increasing, we will have very good fun time this year for sure.... errr or a t least during this end of year :P 
Who asked Q to ban everyone from #tf? Fess up. 
No Idea, Prolly Some Outside Moron Or Problem 
Everyone is unbanned now. 
OMG, Thanks! 
Nice review Tronyn, you rock, sir. 
It takes me a horribly long time to do anything, but eventually it gets done.

Nice map. Now lets see you get back to METAL 
Quick Question 
Is czg's curved pipes tutorial uploaded anywhere?

There's one on but it's not got any pictures unfortunately... 
speeds has one but can't find it.

12-sided circles,the outward and inward slopes in a 90 degree curve coming from down and going to the right are 1:0 (straight up), 1:2, 2:1, 1:0 (straight to the right). The piece interfaces have 1:4 and 1:1 slopes.

If you want to do this for more complex shapes, you have to stretch them a bit wider, then shear vertically and finally horizontally (this shrinks them back).

24-sided works a bit similarly but you need a finer grid.

I made templates some time ago that vis without leaks. I'll upload them some time. 
Fuck I Can't Write 
but I hope you get the idea.
The correction.

Ie in degrees
90, 63, 27, 0 
I've Got CZG's Curve Tutorial On My HDD: 
Here it is now on the Shub-Hub, in a zip! Should work fine, just extract it to a unique folder! Or a folder full of junk. Should work either way:

Thanks czg for a comprehensive tutorial! 
thanks, but I'm trying to remember the actual numbers for the pipe bending, how much to stretch and how much to shear in each direction when the starting section is a certain size... any idea? 
IIRC When Making A Pipe 
that comes from bottom and goes to the right
stretch a section to the left, then shear it up from the left and shear it right from the top until you're at 1:2 angle.
It's not a huge amount, it's pretty fast to experiment it with a 12 sided curve. Ie if you were left short, do a couple undos and stretch more this time.

Oh, first clip the pipe segment so that that it's a trapezoid from the side, ie the ends have 1:4 slope. 
For Radiant / Bsp 
thanks, but I'm trying to remember the actual numbers for the pipe bending, how much to stretch and how much to shear in each direction when the starting section is a certain size... any idea?

(i'm going to use compass bearings to explain, it seemed the easiest way)

assuming you have your initial segment (with the 1:4 edge) laid out with the angled edge facing north east (as it were) so that you want to curve up to the north & round to the east, your second segment must be vertically (or should i say longitudinally...) stretched so that the outer edge extends beyond that of the end of the first segment by twice the length of the first segment's outer edge (ie. if your first segment has an outer ledge that spans four squares, the second segment's outer edge should extend 8 squares beyond the north corner of the first edge). then you clip downwards so the inner edge ends up twice the length of the first segment's inner edge, and clip off the south-westerly corner.

then for the magic skew, you take the outer ledge of your second segment & stretch it westerly by 9/8ths. so if your segment spans 8 squares horizontally (or latitudinally, heh) then you'd extend it one square to the west. then skew the north edge to the east until it fits together. then clone, rotate by 90 & flip to get the other half.

i think that about covers it.. the 9/8ths is the only real key number to remember; the rest of the measurements largely depend on the size of the radius you're curving around.. it's just a case of each edge being twice as long as the initial segment (once the corner is clipped off) 
Holy Shit 
i just read that again and jesus christ if that wasn't the least clear explanation ever :|

these should help a bit more:

Aye, 9 8ths! If You Get Stuck Then... 
...curve several rows of whatever it is your trying to curve at the same time, at different radiuses! Then just keep the one you need...

Here are some prefabs I keep handy, nothing much but takes the sting out of doing it from scratch every time... 
..and Only Now Do I Notice Ricky Already Posted The Full Tut 
*crawls back into the corner* 
I Never Bothered To Remember 
those stretch amounts. I just eyeball it and undo if I was left short and do more. But thanks rj. 
this is one of the reasons why skew/shear for groups is very important in a map editor. 
bah just keep the sides parallel and no need for the additional wanking with scale on the ohther axis 
from what i can make of your tutorial, it doesn't look like it would work in WC. at the part where you "extend it and cut at 45 degree angle", the segment appears to get extended in the direction of the skew, which you can't do in WC without tedious amounts of vertex manipulation. whether you can achieve the same effect by extending first before skewing i don't know, but upscaling by 9/8ths is hardly a cumbersome task to want to work around. 
the problem with upscaling its not universal, while just keeping the sides parallel is - no matter what angle, shape, size or editor

I havent touched wc in 10 years so i cant say which way works better there 
Ah Cheers 
thanks a lot all, expecially RJ, those shots helped me figure it out pretty sharpish. Can you tell I haven't touched an editor for a while? 
You're my hero. 
So the UK approved hybrid embryos. That's pretty neat.

Does That Mean 
czg and kinn can have babies now. 
Do We Have A Civil Rights Thread 
Some hilarious stuff is going on in USA. 
I like how much they worry about the Democratic National Convention! 
Cause Everything Is Just Hunky Dory Every Where Else 
it isn't hunky dory everywhere else, of course it isn't.
The stuff I could tell and show you from here, some of it is quite funny too. 
2 New Map Reviews At The Site:

Katagean Redoubt (by Simulacrum)
Freaky Base (by Trinca) 
Trinca's Freaky Base review download is targetted and titled "" 
the scientific breakthrough of our lifetimes:

And of course it would not be Slashdot if the commentators did not spend the majority of the discussion on a pedantic flame on the existence of the letter 'H' in ancient times. If only Douglas Adams was still alive! 
I'll wait for more independant verifications from respected scientific bodies before I get excited about this though. Meanwhile I'm going to file this next to Steorn and the likes... 
Alpha Testers? 
i need one or two brave soulds who would alpha/beta test a two-day-work-90-monsters map, that still needs some polish - but I'd like to see others play it before I finetune way more... Oh, it's only available on hard skill, the exit is a few rooms early and i still got some packet overflows i need to fix ;). 
Email It Straight To Me 
and ill send you a demo withing 48hrs max (prob much shorter time ;-P ) 
You've got mail ;) 
I'd test also if you want, mail is in profile. 
I'd rather wait for a new version, though. i think i've got enough material for a new version, and i'd like to 'save up' on first impressions ;)

Thanks and i'll bug you later ;) ! 
Jesters` New Q2 Map 
"Death Blooms. Somewhat on the smaller side, should be good for 1v1 or small ffa." 
If you read his website "" theres a map called "House of the Flying Rabid Hamsters"!! Cool. 
Actual Page So You Can Download My Levels Again 
i finally put up a page so that you can find and download my levels and sources: 
You should really be ashamed for Antediluvian because it is fucking unfair and stuff!
Hilarious videos there. czg is a dick of a game designer too. ;)

Well, that guy uses Fuhquake (or ezquake) for playing sp maps so his opinion should no matter at all, ha! 
Is That The Guy Who Does The Voice Of 
the dude of the Simpsons who sells comics..... ? 
Running past every single monster to wake it up and then complain about hordes... right.

The scare moments in czg's maps are actually pretty cool. Like the Shambler telefrag in terra3 (as shown) or the crusher in some other map. 
Funny video. I don't know what he keeps whining about, he makes it look pretty damn easy. Wierdo. 
Well, taking down shamblers with the shotgun using peek-a-boo tactics is hard to categorize as "fun". 
His videos on Terra are pretty funny. Terra3 especially.

Should get him on Ruined Nation, see what he makes of that with all his poncy bunny-hopping gameplay... 
I Remember Disliking A Few Combats 
in antedeluvian but lack of ammo I don't think was a concern. someone should find the antedeluvian release thread and prove me wrong.

calling it an example of a "horrible" map is a little myopic though. 
You'll be wishing for this video to end.

Ain't that right. 
You Guys Realize 
he's not entirely serious there 
...he's obviously serious about CZG being a dick, right?


He plays it good. Good aim. 
...he's obviously serious about CZG being a dick, right?



Yeah, I mean there's some things you just don't joke about. 
those videos are funny. 
wtf? he complains about sparse ammo but skips over at least 3 ammo boxes. 
Dear Mr President

Wow Pink mis about to be censored :P 
and finishes with 96 shells 
Ah Crap 
I just spent several hours today encoding videos just to realise now that I captured in 640x512 instead of 640x480. DAMMIT! 
Radiant Used In Conan Development 
That's a wacky find alright. Very interesting indeed. 
Not that Conan, the other Conan

what's "that conan?" the only conan game i know of is the MMO they're talking about in that article. 
There was this other Conan game for consoles a few months back, pretty much like God of War. 
for some reason i missed that entirely :) 
Woot More Reviewage 
Ruined Nation (by Distrans)
Laboratory X (by Orl) 
15 Million Cooleness Points For Thom Yorke 
Nice review of distrans' map ! 
'Piracy Killed My Game,' Round 5: Valve's Gabe Advocates PC Gaming 
Wonder why? Answer: Steam. 
I think there's loads of PC's everywhere! Facebook etc means that loads of people want PC's, they've become mre accessible to the public lately because more and more "non-digitally-minded" socialites are buying into the idea of "modern communication", everyone being "groomed" into this idea along with the growth of the mobile cell-phone market. More and more people have cable... Digital cameras, easily sending media to freinds in a much more free-hand way... These are the reasons that PC's are being sold more and more! As for PC-Gaming, well people want it all! They buy consoles to go nicely with their flat-screen TV's, saving them the need to configure anything at their leisure! PC's are the tools used to make modern games, but people want to be able to play these games on their consoles.


There will always be a minority of people who don't buy consoles, but whom still have a platform to play games - their PC! So surely manufacturers will continue shipping titles to the PC, simple as to maximise their potential market..... ? 
There will always be a minority of people who don't buy consoles, but whom still have a platform to play games - their PC!

This is not a minority. This is the vast, vast majority.

This is why developers that target people who want to play games on computers that aren't made specifically for it are doing so well (basically popcap and WoW at this point). The PC gamer as we consider them is kind of a niche. 
Can relate to wuggas take on ant. Laugh. I played through chaos and rubicon yesterday (nice web page for the maps too) and they didn't drive me a little crazy like antedeluvian. Shit he can play though. 
"So surely manufacturers will continue shipping titles to the PC, simple as to maximise their potential market..... ?"

The answer is: maybe. Shipping on PC is a -LOT- more work than it is to ship on consoles. With consoles, once it works on your xbox at the office, it will work on everyone's xbox. With PCs, you have to enlist an army of compatibility testers and add tons of special case code to handle every possible permutation of hardware and driver issue. It adds a lot of overhead and fewer and fewer companies are willing to be bothered anymore.

The PCs greatest strength is also it's greatest weakness. 
The PCs greatest strength is also it's greatest weakness.

With great power comes great responsibility. 
Breaking Down The Incompatibilty Barriers... 
I would say that perhaps as we move into the future we will see technology reach a certain plateau....?

Already we would see that modern console games share the same technology as mid-high end graphics cards have to offer. The same technology which is used to power PC games and console games alike.

Admittedly there are compatibility problems at the moment with regards to PC gaming, but I would say that as hardware is pushed boldly and blindly into the future software is running to catch up, and it's a loosing battle. I would guess that ten or even five years down the line compatibility/hardware requirements become a much less significant issue with cross-platform games support as platforms having the power to run software becomes much less of a questionable issue...

Its true what some have said - buying a newer PC to play one or two key games (Crysis) is a strange thing to do - especially as the games arent that great other than appearance wise. And also let it be true that top selling games (WoW) do not necessarily have to be the ones with the best graphics, but the ones with the better gameplay. Surely a shift away from creating games which have "groundbreaking graphics" towards games which have "vastly appealing gameplay" in the future would result in perhaps a larger number of games, with more focus during development on the idea of "making a good game" rather than trying to "exploit new hardware to the max".

Imagine a game like World of Warcraft, which is supported by consoles and PC's which has ONE online network for all platforms - each platform available to utilize and access one online unified community. I would say this could be just around the corner.... 
It's a technology rockface. There's potentially some plateau at the top, but there's a million different ways to reach it. It may also be well beyond our lifetimes that any such plateau can even be imagined, let alone designed as a viable framework.

Possibly as OS's continue improve we'll see better cross-pollination, but I wouldn't bet on it. 
Shouldn't Nvidia and ATI have a strong interesting in making PC gaming interesting?
Their first step should be to make the drivers better (so programming gets easier), i guess.

CPU vendors share that interest, too. Where are the ueber-cool, free, resource-hog games that are sponsored by CPU vendors? If I were Intel, i'd sponsor all the free OpenSource engines out there, and maybe the mod scene, too. 
There's potentially some plateau at the top

yes it's called the NWO 
New World Order? 
Bah�'�s believe that it embodies God's divinely appointed plan for the unification of mankind in this age. 
I would say that perhaps as we move into the future we will see technology reach a certain plateau....?

shitting christ I hope not... 
I can't wait to have to build another new computer with a kilowatt power supply that puts out more heat than a camping stove so I can play games that are even more expensive and unoriginal.

Stay away, technology plateau! 
Looks Interesting: 
did you ever get my mail response? not that there was anything (terribly) important in it, i just want to know ;) 
No - Mail Response? 
Sorry - I haven't received anything... :O 
Can anyone recommend any good FTP programs for windows? 
Core Ftp Works 
of course, don't use ftp, it's unsecure use sftp. Same reason never use telnet but ssh. 
Hmm I Just Use Fireftp 
firefox add-on 
has great ftp support... 
Just click past the little popup about paying (you're not required if it's for personal use). 
This Made Me Lol...

This game has blatently ripped off ENTIRE LOCATIONS from Oblivion, UT2004, Thief 3 and perhaps other games also, and it is now on store shelves, I can smell a major lawsuit from the other side of the milky way...

the backgrounds in that adventure game are all screenshots.

This is interesting legal territory. They're not shipping assets from any of those games, they're using screenshots of them, which I think falls into the same legal territory as cover bands or sampling/remixing.

/me gets popcorn 
The Plot Thickens... 
Current games/movies ripped off for this adventure game

* Black & White 2
* Oblivion
* Morrowind
* Diablo (Skulls, Helm, the freakin' UI)
* Theif
* Silent Hill 3
* Painkiller
* Unreal Tournament 2003/2004
* Konami's Silent Hill series
* Troika's Vampire: The Masquerade - Bloodlines (PC)
* The 1997 film Spawn
* Pirates of the Caribbean

legal teams moving in:

ROFL! what drama! 
it would be an AWESOME failure of the copyright system if they can claim copyright on the screenshots. That could easily be the death of all sites like gamespot and the like, couldn't it? 
And Tomorrow 
BREAKING NEWS: They were all faked screenshots. 
Limbo Of The Lost 
haha, we were lolling at how awful that game looked in the trailer...

this ripping-off thing is just the icing on the cake 
Jesus Fucking Christ 
Current games/movies ripped off for this adventure game...

With this many games ripped off, it almost enters into the realm of artistic statement or meta-game commentary or something, except there doesn't seem to be any such lofty goals in this case.

it would be an AWESOME failure of the copyright system if they can claim copyright on the screenshots. That could easily be the death of all sites like gamespot and the like, couldn't it?

There's something called fair use. Putting screenshots on a game review site qualifies. Using screenshots as backdrops in an adventure game doesn't. There's no contradiction or inconsistency, this is not a failure of copyright. 

Tri Synergy Discontinues Limbo Of The Lost On Stolen Asset Allegations Following accusations that PC title Limbo of the Lost used assets taken from The Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion and Thief: Deadly Shadows, among other games, publisher Tri Synergy has discontinued distribution of the game.

The company claims it had no knowledge that developer Majestic Studios reused the level designs and artwork without permission.

The company claims that it is "shocked" by recent screenshot comparisons from gaming communities GamePlasma and NeoGAF that allegedly show Limbo of the Lost using level designs and artwork originally from a multitude of other games.

The adventure game, which uses 2D screenshots of environments for its backdrops, seems to include pictures of games including The Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion, The Elder Scrolls III: Morrowind, Thief: Deadly Shadows, Diablo II, Unreal Tournament 2004, Unreal Tournament 2003, Diablo II, Crysis, Silent Hill 4: The Room, Return to Castle Wolfenstein, World of Warcraft, Painkiller, Vampire: The Masquerade - Bloodlines, and other titles.

According to Tri Synergy, at no point during its dealings with Majestic Studios did the publisher have any knowledge of these similarities. Tri Synergy has states that it has contacted Majestic and that it is awaiting the studio's response. Tri Synergy plans to release another statement once they know more about the alleged asset theft.

UK-based developer and publisher G2 Games, Limbo of the Lost's publisher in Europe, has yet to comment on the accusations.

Somewhere in a Kentish pub, three old wankers are getting pissed up right now. 
I bet this is some giant hoax.
If it isn't, the whole "we had no idea" thing is bullshit, they publish games, if none of them was capable of recognising any of these screenshots, they shouldn't be in the business. 
I find it hard to believe that nobody at that publisher had played Oblivion or any of the other games that were ripped off. 
I find it more plausible that nobody at the office actually touched the game itself. 
I Find It Easy 
but then as a bitter developer of three long years I don't have a lot of faith in publishers 
3 whole years, huh? Just wait. :) 
Iv seen such games in russia (lame games re-using art from the other games)
even more so Iv had some communication with the ppl who do them. But thats Russia - the land of the free (from copyright laws) :) 
ask around about the lunaran bitter. if I were a microbrew I'd be an acquired taste. 
Somewhere in a Kentish pub, three old wankers are getting pissed up right now.

Bang on the money.

Lunaran, you develop bitter? Sounds like a cool job; games dev just makes you cynical and sarcastic. 
Lunaran is the bitterist motherfucker I know. 
"ask around about the lunaran bitter. if I were a microbrew I'd be an acquired taste."

You must also be pretty young. Because, after awhile, the bitter thing gets tiresome and you move on. ;) 
Can't Fuckin' Wait 
or you move out 
Looking For A Quake Level 
I only saw screenshots of it, and it was on some Quake mappers website. He had quite a lot of levels on there. I think his nickname started with "T"??

The levels in particular I'm interested in is the one(s) were he used that Scourge of Armagon big marble white brick texture.

Any ideas? 
Tyrann? Did Moonlight Assault use that white brick? 
click on the "author" link to sort by names. 
Wasn't him, but I managed to find a link to the person from the page you gave. It was Tronyn and the map was Coven Of Ebony. 
Intel Converts ET: Quake Wars To Ray-tracing 
And Makes It Look Shit And Run Slowly In The Process 
But who needs performance anyway, when you've got omg shiny shiny things? gg Intel, working hard on what matters most to gamers everywhere: gloss. 
raytracing is cool and nice and all, and just needs hw support. 

That may be missing the point somewhat. Realtime ray tracing would lead to a very unified looking world where everything is lit in exactly the same way, every reacts properly to lights, etc. It would lead to more immersion which I think would be hard to argue against as a negative. 
There's nothing to stop rasterising hardware from using a unified lighting model. See Doom 3 and Stalker.

Intel is pushing raytracing because they'd really love to sell a bunch of expensive hardware, and they can't compete with GPU performance and quality on traditional rasterising tasks. That shows very clearly in these shots: there's flat shading on the models, crappy texture filtering, terrible performance, and pathetic resolution.

There's also shiny things. Well, colour me unimpressed. 
Oh Actually, Resolution Isn't So Bad 
"There's nothing to stop rasterising hardware from using a unified lighting model. See Doom 3 and Stalker."

Ray tracing can bounce light. No current real time engine bounces light. And I will all but guarantee that Doom3 and STALKER are using lightmaps in many areas.

"That shows very clearly in these shots: there's flat shading on the models, crappy texture filtering, terrible performance, and pathetic resolution. "

Eh, that's art assets that were designed for a completely different lighting model. Once the technology is more solidified a killer art team would make it look great. 
I'm not getting into this discussion cause I have no clue, but having gone through most of the Doom3 source maps, no it does not use lightmaps. It actually takes some hacking about with the shaders to even get lightmaps in. 
Doom 3 was completely unified and realtime. Stalker used lightmaps on the world, but for occlusion and not lighting. It also implemented a limited form of bounced lighting, by the way. :)

As for the assets, I wonder if they aren't normalmapped in those shots because of issues getting the shading right or because of the extra performance hit (hgh quality texturing is expensive in a raytracer). 
It'd be awesome if doom3 had lightmap support of some sort. 
gaytracing is so far behind its not funny 
Hell Yes 
i WISH d3 had proper lightmap support. :\
if only to bake on ambient occlusion, ffs.

i'd be more impressed with realtime ambient occlusion, actually....... 
texturing slower in raytracing? why? at first glance, i'd guess you just need a texture lookup for each ray.

The nice thing about raytracing is that there's basically no hacks involved, much unlike rasterizing where everything is one giant hack ;)

global illumination raytracing isn't really realtime yet, i think. 
I Still Remember Playing Myst All Those Years Ago... 
... and thinking "when will this be real time?"

Though I guess original-Myst-level stuff has probably been possible in real time for a while now (though obv. I'm talking about ray tracing, not realMyst :) 
is at least one damn good reason to look forward to the development of raytracing, scalability:

One document especially grabbed my attention. It's titled: "State-of-the-Art in Interactive Ray Tracing", and was written by Wald & Slusallek. I highly recommend this paper. Basically, it summarizes recent efforts to improve the speed of raytracing, and adds a couple of tricks too. But it starts with a list of benefits of raytracing over rasterization-based algorithms. And one of those benefits is that when you go to extremes, raytracing is actually faster than rasterizing. And they prove it: Imagine a huge scene, consisting of, say, 50 million triangles. Toss it at a recent GeForce with enough memory to store all those triangles, and write down the frame rate. It will be in the vicinity of 2-5. If it isn't, double the triangle count. Now, raytrace the same scene. These guys report 8 frames per second on a dual PIII/800. Make that a quad PIII/800 and the speed doubles. Raytracing scales linearly with processing power, but only logarithmically with scene complexity. 
that... doesn't make sense. that means that with enough processing power, you could make a scene infinitely complex without any difference in performance... 
I Interperted The Last 
sentence to mean that the ray tracing algorithms will yield a stable product where the problem of rendering is only proportional to the size of the data set that it is handling. 
That Entire Series Is Fascinating 
One of the latter articles features an easy to fallow explanation of kd-trees. 
Fallow, Follow 
in monkey phonetics I trust 
Scalability My Ass 
everyone knows raytracing performance is much less dependant on polycount, much more on resolution

so throw 1600x1200 at it and cry 
Except Those Who Actually 
build ray tracers: Way to embarrass yourself, speeds:

The last scene from the previous article (the one with the sphere grid to show off the new refraction code) took almost 9 seconds to render on my pimpy 1.7Ghz Toshiba laptop with 1600x1200 screen (I know resolution has nothing to do with it, but I thought I would mention it anyway). And that's just for simple stuff. Later on we will add area lights, and to test the visibility of those, we will need lots of rays � for each pixel, that is.  
Because AFAIK, speeds is right: Every pixel adds one ray to be traced, so raytracing complexity is very much dependent on resolution. Can someone explain this? 
Umm Necros 
logarithmic means the time grows slower. It still goes to infinity when the polycount goes to infinity. 
of the advantage in size and speed you obtain when you use vector graphics as opposed to bit map graphics in web apps. The advantage comes from the fact the image is a sheer calculation that scales perfectly with the resolution whereas the bit map is a an indexed means of storage.

The advantage of ray tracing is similar:

The results are based upon sheer calculation whereas rasterization relies on spans of texturized pixels. The advantages will be more apparent when mega units of polygons are rendered with surfaces represented by polies instead of textures.

Rather old, but still relevant: 
BTW, I Think Both Bikker And Speeds 
are wrong, hence the first site I linked. It does have something to do with it, but that becomes less relevant with larger data streams. 
One Last Thing 
before I crawl into bed, this is what Bikker has been up to of late: 
I Really Don't Get How You Get 
smooth lighting with raytracing.
I mean if you trace from the eyes and not from the light sources, once you hit the first surface, your beam splits to a million different directions. And then again for the next bounce and then for the next. How much until the ray dies or goes to the sky?
It's a very hard problem and results in ugly and unphysical hacks that produce very stupid looking images. 
Rasterisers texture very quickly because the inner loop is a good match for hardware. Triangles go through the pipeline and wind up on the screen as scanlines, basically two endpoints with some associated attributes (texcoords, vertex colour, etc). Texturing the scanline is just a matter of interpolating those attributes between their two known values, which is very fast. Cache coherency is also good, since two adjacent pixels will be located close in the same texture (mipmapping ensures this).

In comparison when you fire off a ray, the hardware has no idea how that pixel will need to be shaded. 
Wii Port With Wiimote Aiming 
Err, Yes, 
but that's a large part of raytracing optimisation, making things run in a way that you can use coherency between rays. And, yeah, as long as we don't have gpu like computing power for raytracing... 
Ray Tracking 
Now I ain't much good at the internets, like some of you whizzkids, but does all this technologistic hocus-pocus mean that dem computering games goan be mighty purdy? 
Yeah Sure Will Pardner. 
Gameplay'll still suck some dem balls tho. 
"Gameplay'll still suck some dem balls tho."

Well, ray tracing doesn't really affect gameplay unless you're going to argue visibility of enemies in a unified lighting scheme or something. 
RE #14412 
Thats cool Spirit!! The screenshot is too dark tho....

Totally ruins everything in my life.... 
Go Ahead Beat A Dead Horse If You Will 
but atm raytracing stands no chance for realtime rendering vs "raseterizing", cause the later been advanced by the whole software and hardware industy for the last 10+ years and its not stopping. I think Carmack ok Sweeney, said that, not my words really.

tere is a joke that goes "Ray tracing is the technology of the future and it always will be!"
and in the future we`ll have a nice blend both
but so far there is no reason to get any excited 
It's nice to see research into other areas, that's all. It's not time wasted if something of value is learned - even if that something is that ray tracing isn't currently viable or what-have-you.

Pushing more and more triangles through the pipeline will likely reach a point of diminishing returns. 
You Are Right About Carmack 
being skeptical of the benefits of raytacing. Sweeny seems more interested in the idea as far as I can tell from the interviews I've read.


There is is an interesting correlation, at least in my mind, between the scalability raytracing offers and what is shown to occur with very high end theoretical languages like Haskell. Haskell is so theoretical versus practical a language that the designers had to apply monadic math theory just to achieve an interface for Input/output.

However, what research is showing these high level languages are performing better
at mega data sets than relatively low level languages like C++. The extra rigorous application of mathematics to their design makes their comparative performance more stable under stress tests. 
is way easier on multicore, as is raytracing. 
That Creature Creator is magic. Pure magic.

Research Is Great 
I would never object to an honest attempt to advance the field. But this isn't research, this is a commercial for Intel's new hardware. 
Bet He Is An Ancestor 
That Was 
very fascinating, HeadThump.
Without Hitler and Stalin fucking up Europe, where would we be now? 
So has anyone tried StreamMyGame ? As bizarre as it sounds and technically unfeasible as it sounds, it actually seems to work from what I've seen from YouTube videos, see one of Crysis here: 
I Had You In Mind, Bambuz 
when I asked myself if anyone would be interested in that article when I posted it :)

It is altogether possible that if web technology was developed in the 30's that it would have been centralized with limited access for the masses much like the stunted development of television, given most Western nations, including mine, had a strong authoritarian/bureaucratic bent at that time.

Consider the suppression of cable television as a medium. The technology was developed in the same time frame as broadcast, but because the doyens of our FCC believed it would be difficult to control content on cable to the extent they could on the three networks; it wasn't allowed to develop commercially for over thirty years.

We also had a similar stifling of innovation in telecommunications technology and commercial use with the (government granted) AT&T monopoly. It wasn't until the Bells were broken up in the mid eighties that long distance communication became cheap and affordable enough for your average Joe Middle-Class Blow to set up his own servers and for small start ups to build up there own net based servers.

So, it might have not made much difference, but that is just speculation. Without Hitler and Stalin as looming threats, it is also possible and likely that Europe would have developed along different lines, Managerialism (a term used by some political scientist in the 30's) would have lost its allure as a governing principle, and where leading technologist realized that at least in communications decentralization is a good thing. 
Laugh... HeadThump, if you're right about Haskell having similarities to Intel's ray tracing project - just like those functional languages - ray tracing in games will be good for f*** all in the real world.

But Intel shoving the thing down our throats may be another matter. 
I Think It's Hard To Overestimate The Effect WW2 Had 
on society, science, technology, politics... so much so that speculating on what might have been different seems a bit pointless to me.

OTOH, maybe all the things that came out of it would have happened anyway, and all that changed was the rate things happened. Who knows? :) 
But there is the school of thought that anything that happens in society is a product of it.

Meaning that Hitler and Stalin existed in the first place because there was something fundamentally wrong, which gave rise to the attitudes existing outside and so the control and nanny state culture.

Hindsight is a great thing - back then it almost certainly seemed the way forward. Governments exist to remove autonomous control, but they are necessary.

This same conversation will be had in ten years about technology n
Security And Privacy In The Digital Age 
I wonder how much demand there is for a site that is:

1) about security and privacy of communications in the digital age
2) with topics ranging from securing data stored locally on a computer, web browsing, email, IM, etc etc
3) is written in plain and easy to understand language
4) explains all the terms in simple language and gives examples of most common threats and how to identify them
5) introduces the reader to the most common solutions and concepts behind preventing privacy and data breaches
6) explaining why they should care in the first place

Any thoughts? 
Heh - I Dont Care About People Ripping Me Off 
People will always rip people off. Having said that I dont even know what GPL means, so YEAH! - A site like you describe could be very usefull! :P 
there are plenty of programmers in active studios pissing their pants thinking of what multi-threading will look like on the next series of Play Stations and X-boxes, and how that can be handled in a traditional imperative framework. 
But The GPL Has Nothing To Do With Security And Privacy... 
Well I've Got AVG.........? 
Jago - its a good idea!

You see there are a lot of people out there who know very little about such things. A computer is a "box what does stuff".
The internet is a "box what does stuff".

I mean are you talking about spyware? Or what? 
Not much unless you have a great marketing campaign. Actually I am sure there are several sites like that already but few know about them.
"Stupid generic" people are the ones that need such info yet since they have no idea they won't bother.

For example in german there is yet mostly people like me know it I guess. is mostly focused on search engines, surely worth adding to your feeds. 

Doom 3 source code might be released next year already according to John Carmack. At around 1:28:30 in 
yeah I listened to that last night but forgot to post (doh). Good news indeed.

I guess Carmack is going "doh" as the doom 3 engine never really took off like ue3... 
Looking For Quake1 Mappers here is the official post i did in the mapper section. i can be reached at 
When The D3 Code Is Out 
Hopefully someone can take all those cute little tweaks they did for Q4 and put them in, mebbe? That would be super-cool, thx ahead. 
new contest: release a map before i do.
Speaking Of Doom 
Cooooool :D 
I like it. Good lighting too - surely the D3 engine? 
even better - I'd say what you're seeing there is some serious idTech 5 action 
D3 source code next year?

That probably they are expecting RTCW2 to come out in the next 12 months, and that Prey2 will not be using the same engine as the original. 
will Prey 2 have a non-godmode option? 
Hey Zwifla How Does It Feel To Be Left Out In The Dark? 
Ok, Here's A Contest 
So our community is clearly rather small and not quite so active at the moment, reflective of a social group held together by a common interest more than a place where level design is constantly ongoing. Mapping still goes on, just not to the degree that a call for everyone to try something simultaneously can elicit a strong, viable response (see: speedmapping, etc).

The recent interest in 'experimental' gameplay, especially from a couple of Speedy's maps, seem to be the freshest source of mappery right now. So, here's my idea: the "contest" is to release something on your own with whatever parameters you want, whenever, but surprise everyone else with it. Have an idea and make it - there's clearly plenty of them still out there. If we can't muster group activity at the moment, let's focus on individual maps, just to keep things fresh. 
Not So Active? 
WTF, for Quake 1 at least there have been plenty of good, varied, interesting maps this year, from new mappers, old mappers, semi-retired mappers. I've been impressed for sure.

P.S. This contest sucks. 
Shhh otherwise he'll cancel it. 
I've been impressed for sure.

Right, so why not keep it up? I'm not saying that kind of thing isn't happening, my point is the lament over speedmapping and contests seems misplaced. 
Something I was just thinking most FPS engines running into the exterior corner of a wall will either make you go left or right of it depending on which side you're closest to instead of stopping you like it would if you ran into a flat wall.

I always wondered though if you lined your path up so that you hit it *exactly* at 45 degrees, how does the engine decide which way to force you? Is it randomized? Is it even possible to hit it at exactly 45 degrees? Will it actually make you stop if you accomplish it?

Has anyone ever looked into this on an engine level? Let me know :D

P.S this is what I spend my Saturdays thinking about 
the PS made that comment so awesome. 
you will never be able to hit it at exactly 45 degrees; see also: float precision

not that i checked, but aren't they shoving you right/left depending on your income angle?so that if you hit the edge in the way you described, you would almost stop? 
In Quake You Stop
Even if you are a bit off center, I guess that's some hull stuff. 
Well There We Go... - there we go Lun, maps all the time! 
Yeah, you generally stop. I've tried running into walls and trying to get myself exactly parallel. I stop dead generally if I get it right. 
I've tried running into walls and trying to get myself exactly parallel.

That in Quake, or just IRL? 
Need Some Tech Support! :) 
So I installed windows vista x64 yesterday, and set it all up, and it was working fine, in my ignorance to the new OS instead of turning off the pc I set it into hibernate mode, then I brought it back out of hibernate the pc froze and then blue screened.

After a reset the pc would not boot, it would start loading the OS selector screen (I was dual booting with xp) but then fail saying the boot sector was screwed (or something of that description).

So I popped in my xp cd and managed to repair the boot sector, but now the pc boots automatically to XP and I get no option to boot to vista at all. I am wondering how I get the dual boot OS selector back? As the vista directory is still fully intact!

I have tried searching the web a bit but im having trouble finding information regarding this issue specifically.

PS. This is a great story for all you vista haters ;) 
nevermind :) 
something like this? 
I'm Interested To Hear How You Solved It 
after some more digging around I learned that vista uses an updated method of handling the boot menus. Boot.ini simply does not work with vista.

Vista uses a BCD file to handle booting and there is handy application I found called Easybcd ( that can edit/restore vistas boot settings and write them to the BCD.

It was a simple matter of restoring the bcd and restarting the pc :) 
Back In The 70's 
No one but Richard Pryor was as good as this guy:

George Carlin mourned as a counterculture hero 
George :( 
patron saint of crabby old men :(

meanwhile, seen on the shack: 
Does Anyone Care... 
...about this.

I'm interested... 
it does mean they're working on a new radiant based on the 1.4 source... so that's kind of cool for people that didn't really like 1.5. 
""We appreciate what you guys have done over the years in building the popularity of [Quake 3]," said id CEO Todd Hollenshead. "We also like 'free.'" "

All due respect, Todd - but id likes 'free' now that the money has been made. Nothing wrong with that but let's not start painting ourselves as pure and altruistic suddenly. 
Opera 9.5 
is nice. Fast. Localized. Downloaded a nice theme. I put a weather and clock widget on too. 
Hmmm - Doom 4 + Quake Zero 
I hope they dont fuck them up! I played on ET - Quake Wars Demo and couldn't get it! 
What Is There Not To Get About ETQW? 
The Fun 
Classes and team work? If Carmack likes straight up death match, it's not hard to imagine him not getting something like ET. 
Turns Out To Be A Hoax, 
Except that nobody said they were lost. They said they were uncontacted which has a specific meaning in this situation.

There are hundreds of uncontacted tribes on the planet. 
Except that nobody said they were lost.

Except, that is exactly what was initialy claimed.

"We did the overflight to show their houses, to show they are there, to show they exist," said Jose Carlos dos Reis Meirelles, an expert on uncontacted tribes at Funai. "This is very important because there are some who doubt their existence."

You certainly don't go looking for the proof of the existence of 'found' things. 
The text you quoted specifically uses the word "uncontacted" and specifically does not use the word "lost".

Here's a quote from someone else I saw that sums it up decently:

"Saying it's a hoax doesn't really fit, imo. Yeah, they knew about the tribe, but the tribe is still uncontacted at this point, no? Reading up on it further, it seems like people knew about this tribe and others, but no contact really exists with them." 
what does lost in this context mean and why is it better than 'uncontacted' 
To me, 'lost' would mean that we once had them and then misplaced them while bringing in the groceries resulting in a 15 minute search the following morning before going to work and being late as a result. That's very different from 'uncontacted'. 
Regarding Quake Zero 
It isn't free, you pay with your eyeballs. 
Well I Bet The Tribes People Knew Where They Were 
the whole time!
Theyre not taking my eyeballs, I'll stick to UT3 if that's the case 
Quake Zero 
TF2 was the game that finally pulled me away from Q3 online. Quake Zero might be the game that draws me back...

I'm sick of being a team player. There is a unique joy in winning in an individualist deathmatch game.

And there is always Sauerbraten... 
Yeah, but playing in a web browser while ads dance and flash around the edges? No thanks. 
There are ad blockers and whatnot nowadays. 
the ads will be in-game, on tv screens and whatnot. 
It isn't free, you pay with your eyeballs.

Ha, that can be easily circumvented by playing with my eyes shut! 
Well that would explain Metl's legendary DM skillz then... 
Q3 was the game that irreversibly pushed me away from Q3 online... 
Shambler Get On IRC 
So we can make fun of your antiquated views again 
I don't disconnect every two minutes anymore.

I just thought I would share that update with you. 
Video Editing Software 
Can anyone recommend good video editing software? I just need simple cutting, no fancy effects or anything. 
Virtual Dub Worked Fine For Me 
Advertisers are going to sign on if you can promise them space where the audience is captive - something where you can promise them lots of eyeballs. More popular TV shows = more expensive commercial slots, etc.

Now, look at games like Quake3. If there's an ad on a TV screen in the level - who's paying attention to that? Nobody's going to stop and look, and any advertiser that has this game demoed to them won't be too enthused.

In the menus and web frontend, however - or even better, while the loading bar is crawling - that's where you're going to see advertising. 
It worked pretty well in the free, ad-supported versions of Far Cry, Prince of Persia and that other game.

Maybe they're going to add TV commercial-like sound bits and advertising slogans to QuakeLive with the first patch. 
"You Got The Pepsi(TM) Rocket Launcher" 
RL would be sponsored by Coca Cola surely?

GL seems far more Pepsi-y (I may be being influenced by Warsow's blue GL here tho) 
I'd Like To Apologise To The Community For Being A Complete Dick 
I'm leaving forever. 
Hooray!!! :D 
I mean, er.... , no. please dont 
Mr G 
noooooo don't go, terrafusion people LOVE DICK. 
please dont go, dont gooooooooo

you ass is needed!!! 
Where Are You Going? 
To Candyland 
Tronyn conducted an interview with Shambler, its now posted at my site: 
Great Interview 
But is it a two question interview? 
Next and final question plz. 
Apology REJECTED. 
I'd like to see a full map-for-map remake of the original Quake, following on from the remix maps released so far.

I have e3m1-e3m3 on final beta, e3m4-m6 on early beta and e3m7 blocked out. 
Good Interview 
Far Cry is the game that rocked me the most in recent years too. Many players complain about the setting, but it just makes me want to get back down to the tropics with white sandy beaches and clear water for miles. Oh, St Thomas why did I ever leave (oh yeah, to avoid poverty and starvation since I would have lost my job otherwise). 
2 question interviews are copyright 1997-2008 by Scampco Industries Limited Inc. LLC. Any unauthorized usage, reproduction, or public viewing of these interviews in prohibited. 
Are you sure that's legally binding? 
I Know 
it's legally banning... 
"public viewing" 
I've been thinking of some of the things you have said about the effect of piracy on the viability of the PC as a commercial game platform. It really sucks that Epic's policy is to consider PCs as a third tier market compared to the PS3 and Xbox for games that are not centered on the multiplayer mod market. Not casting dispersions. It sounds like you are facing market realities over there.

I have a question that I hope can be helpful, though it may just be naive on my part; how much can the size of a product discourage piracy? Would ten trig discourage all but the most valiant fanboi attempts?

Say, if and when Epic decides to sale GOW2 to the PC market, what if, you had a seperate DVD
that must be in the PC in order for the game to function and it was cram full of binary noise, nothing but noise, except for maybe a few thousand bytes scattered about the disk which the executable routinely searches out to insure the viability of the copy.

I recently spent an evening downloading the Knoppix disk, at 700MB I was a bit discouraged, but do you think the method I outlined would discourage the pirates? 
If the rest of it is random noise, then there is a good chacne that it could match substantial chunks of the real code. Which means that it would be possibly impossible to filter out the unnecessary bits. Plus that random noise disk is still copyable... 
It Would Not Necessarily 
have to be random, but as long as the executable knows where to look, what the filler material looks like would be unimportant. It would be futile for a hacker to separate the necessary stuff from this end. They would have to dissassemble the executable, and many barriers could be placed on that end to make that futile as well.

Of course it could still be copied, and made into an .ico file (or the dvd equivalent?), but the idea is to discourage digital distribution through raw size. Another example: Say if the size of the game could be fit on one DVD, but instead, you pad it out on
five separate DVD's with filler material and only the installer can distinguish between necessary and unnecessary data. At 8+ gigs a disk, you have over 40 gigs of data for any potential download. That would bring the bandlength of Pirate Bay to its knees!

Just trying to save the PC gaming market, for my own selfish, I wanna play a dozen Deus Ex, Quake, System Shock clones on it. that's all. 
That would bring the bandlength of Pirate Bay to its knees!

Through turrents Pirate Bay uses dispersed distribution, so that may not be a barrier in its self, though even dispersed, I imagine the size could be inhibiting to piracy. 
I'm all in favour of the opinion that goes around func routinely - that respecting end users is a better strategy than fucking them over on the off chance they want to rip off your game.

I remember a qoute for some reason - it was along the lines of anyone who tries to pirate a game and fails won'y buy it, because they never had any intention of paying for it in the first place.

Interesting idea, but I can imagine the logistical nightmare of installation - remember each game goes through many levels of idiot proof testing, and that's before it leaves the producer's office and goes to QA, legal and distribution. 
With Those Sort Of Barriers 
I wonder if it would make more sense as a quick and dirty solution for indies to use than the A title producers. 
Don't think so - any backed games company goes through the same process, since the money always comes from the same sorts of companies - the ones who ask;

What is a rar file? Can we put an advert frontend inside the gui? The loading screen is static apart from the moving bar for neary three seconds (we timed this!)

And indy companies aren't consolidated enough to worry about this sort of crap.

tbh I can't think of an application for it, but there almost definately is. But money = time, so to develop it is the real problem. The discs are cheap, so that's not a problem.

I've heard lots of suggestions when porting stuff from PC that we block maybe three or four features, then the "downloadable content" is basically a >128k bat file that unlocks the blocked stuff. In a similar way I think there is a corporate name for what you're suggesting, but without the extra discs.

Personally I get everything for PC from Steam, because it's me that owns the game, not the hardware, which is pretty cool. My wii I'm going to have chipped because I can't play my PAL gamecube games on it. Definately illegal, but as a good customer why should I have to cross the line.

Am I right that the only non-regional recent console is the DS - the one that's got a better turnover than free cake? 
"it was along the lines of anyone who tries to pirate a game and fails won'y buy it, because they never had any intention of paying for it in the first place. "

That's not entirely accurate. Many people will pirate the game if they can and buy it if they must.

As for the size suggestion - I'd say, personally, not really. Pirates don't care about bandwidth or storage. If they have to wait an extra day for the torrent to finish, they will. No skin off their nose. And the more likely outcome is that the crackers will simply spend the time to strip out as much of the noise as possible anyway.

And as far as GoW2 and the PC and Epics future plans - I'm sure you'll understand that I really can't make public comments on that sort of thing. Not my area and not my place. :) 
Diablo 3 
Wow... looks impressive ! 
No, shit, damn purple penguin thing.

One of the best pieces of viral hype I've seen in a while tho (the splash screen, the hidden jpegs, etc). in case you live under a rock 
there goes another hundred hours or so :) 
That should of course be 'no shit', not 'no, shit' 
That's Kool And The Gang 
And as far as GoW2 and the PC and Epics future plans - I'm sure you'll understand that I really can't make public comments on that sort of thing. Not my area and not my place. :)

Especially, if those methods involve mercenaries and Pirate Bay owner's heads on stakes as a warning to other pirates, mums the word on my end ;) Anything to get a vibrant PC game market back! 
just to address your earlier post,

i'm of the firm belief that if someone wants to crack a game, it *will* be cracked.

i look at games like the HL2 series or Bioshock. HL2 games all have the online authentication stuff with the steam integration, but there are copies of all 3 (HL2, Ep1 and Orange Box) with the steam portion removed.

and bioshock. remember all the stink that was raised about it's copy protection? there was a cracked version like a week after it was released.

the way i look at it, you waste your time putting fancy piracy protection. what should be aimed for is stopping casual piracy-- lending the game to a friend so he can copy the DVD or whatever. no one ever liked having to have a cd/dvd in the drive to play, and bringing it back is not going to win any points with your consumers.

i also don't think pure online distribution is the ticket either.
in canada at least, almost all ISPs here have download caps, and that puts a real damper on how much stuff i'd want to download esp. since i'm paying for the product essentially twice. 
Czg07 Needs A Health Warning 
thought this may be of general light interest/amusement. i just sent a mate completely batshit insane by showing him the following screenshot:

alcohol may have have had a part to play in things but alas. i've uploaded the messenger log.. i tried to offer some serious insight later on but in reality i was pissing myself laughing most of the way through: 
He doesn't play modern Q1 then?

Insomnia is sort of mild by now - some of the areas in Travail.

Poor sod probably woke up a few times in the night - judging from that transcript.

Reckon everyone who still plays / makes this game has their head a bit twisted. 
i don't think he's ever even played quake

travail did have some pretty twisted bits but i don't think anything will ever top the final level of zerstorer for pure evilness 
I reckon everyone remembers the bit where you enter the small shrine and hear the warbling idle sound of the troglodyte.

"You have a sense of pure evil" 
Quake Woah Moments 
there's plenty, czg being responsible for quite a few and nehahra a lot of the others.

I'd have to go through my maps cd to list teh rest but there is plenty, which is why I'm still playing it :) 
Mother Jesus 
diablo3 i already love you 
I somewhat agree with this image.

I wouldn't go AS far, but it does look a bit too colorful WoW compared with the dark ugliness of the old Diablos. 
I have to admit something...

I don't understand the point of Diablo. Isn't it just left click spam (I've tried playing it, I just... don't get it)

(And bear in mind I played WoW for 2 years) 
Blizzard is one of the last companies I would ever question on art direction. They have some of the most consistent and high quality artwork among game companies. Watching those D3 videos is proof of that again. Nothing looks out of place, everything looks like it fits together and you totally believe the world.

Fantastic work. 
I would have prefered a darker tone, it boils down to a matter of taste though, not poor art direction.
It'll probably change as they work on it anyways, they recently added quite a bit of grit to the Starcraft2 stuff, which makes it look alot better in my opinion. 
A Guess A Simple Fix 
would be to include some sort of different post processing options like gears/ut3 so you change the overall look for default to "gritty" and so on.

Would please both crowds :) 
I'd have preferred a bit less WoW too. Hopefully the gore will make up for it. 
Does have a good bit of WoW-ness to it, which kinda sucks. Honestly I was hoping for something dingy and more detailed like Hellgate -- but that's another camp, I guess. 
Looking at the image again and thinking more on the subject, I'm starting to come around to blizzard's direction. Each area on the left side looks completely unique and memorable. On the right, the dungeon and the exterior world may as well be the same place, the effects are the only thing to draw your eyes. The left feels like a world, the right looks like a backdrop. 
I think it's because that 30 second "noise overlay" example is bad. When done by a good artist, "Gritty" can look just as unique and memorable as "Clownboots Rainbow Lollipop Land". 
I don't know why people are so against color these days. I think Diablo 3 looks fantastic. Lush, vibrant colors FTW. 
Hmmm. Doesn't look as vomituously bad as most Quake visual tweaks to be honest. 
Bloom1 = Myopia 
I Hate Bloom 
It's cheap and nasty.

It makes games look like those soft-focus airbrushed glamour portraits that fat insecure single women get done to post on internet matchmaking sites.

It basically says "This game has serious self-esteem issues and will eat all your chocolate biscuits when it thinks you're not looking". 
Bloom1 (like the screenshot) is rendered from the backbuffer and so is very cheap in FPS, but applied to everything - it's the most common option.

Bloom3 is applied per object and looks great. Eg. All fire shaders, but no matte shaders. Problem is it destroys framerate, usually. 
always makes an area look humid... 
Co-op Game 
Anyone interested in meeting for a coop Quake game? 

Seems more people agree Diablo III looks too happy and shiney. 
I Dunno 
i don't really get what the fuss about it is. to me it looks like they translated the feel of the 2d diablo art into 3d pretty well. the different areas look distinct and visually interesting. what more can you want? 
It looks fantastic. People are idiots. Besides, Blizzard is not going to go back and redo all of the art because of a petition. 
It�s from blizzard so it�ll look good. If some people don�t like the style others will. Nobody will ever hit the middleground.

There�s alot of complaining but it seems to be from people who will buy it regardless. 
I'm With The Idiots 
The first Diablo at least had a very distinct, creepy look. This seems too close to "generic 3d fantasy rpg" (not that that is all that bad, it's just not as distinct/atmospheric).

lol @ 14560 
As far as I can tell most of the changes they want in that petition could be achieved by dropping the colour/brightness and increasing the contrast on their monitors... 
Wolfenstein Enemy Territory Source Maps Released 
under Limited Use Licence, after the game's fifth birthday: 
There is that thing called "taste" and it is different from person to person. 
I think it's the hyperbole that gets to me. It's not "I think it's too colorful" - it's "it's fantasy elf faggot disco colored!!!1!!111!". Relax. 
Cynicism +1 D6 
post #14573 ftw 
It reflects exactly the fact it is not possible to please all player...
...and indeed ROFLMAO ! 
Kinn's name is short for Kinnschmerzen, which is german for "chin ache."

You're such a chin-head.

Jesus Lun 
have you been doing some internet detective work? I haven't gone by that name since...well, since a long time.

It was my schoolboy nickname fyi :)

(Where did you find out?) 
I'll Answer That:: 
Lunaran, in true slacker form, decided that rather than WORK today, he'd read the screenshots thread from start to finish. 
So, I was reading this today;

Seems somehow relevant ;p 
No Crunch! 
Look at the games they're making -- trivia games and karaoke shovelware. You can work 35 hour weeks when you're churning out shit like that. I mean if that's what you want to do as a company more power to you, but crunch is inevitable when you're making a game that strives for visual fidelity, compelling narrative, etc. etc. There's simply too much you can't plan for. 
We're crunching on Gears2. There's just too much to do at the end of the project. You have to crunch at least for a few weeks if you're going to get a product of any kind of scope completed on time.

Granted, I don't LIKE crunch - but at least we're compensated well for it at Epic. I understand that it sucks a lot more at companies where they crunch you mercilessly and then give you a hearty handshake at the end. 
Keep crunching 'til you get that PC port out, buddy ;D 
Speaking Of Gears PC 
Is it worth getting for 19 eur from the bargain bin? Now that I am getting into UE3 tech a bit, I am somewhat curious about dabbling into UE3 singleplayer mapping since I've always generally found SP mapping to be more interesting than making multiplayer maps and I really loved the console GoW which I had finished before I sold my 360.

How well does the game run compared to UT3? I am playing UT3 on a C2D E6600, 2gb ram, 8600GT at 1280 x something at maxdetail and it runs pretty damn well, with only noticable slowdowns happening on DM-Deck. Should I expect the same level of perfomance from GoW PC or is it better/worse?

How big/small is the GoW editing community? I understand it wasn't that popular of a game on PC, since anyone who really really wanted to play it, had already played it on the 360, but just how popular is it? Smaller than say, Q3? Smaller than Quake? 
Sooner Or Later 
Game development will start resembling real industry.
Although, software industry in general should start that first. 
Yes and no. There's something about a creative process that requires an extra push at the end. It's generally what happens during that final push that makes the difference between an OK game and a great game.

As I said, I don't LIKE crunch, but I accept small amounts of it. A few months is fine. If it goes on longer than that, that's when you start hurting your product.

If games were produced completely crunch free you would very likely have an industry of cookie cutter safe games with nobody trying to push limits lest they overshoot the schedule. 
And I know the obvious snarky comment is coming regarding cookie cutter safe games but believe me ... things would be FAR worse if, say, we had unions that made sure nobody crunched or worked over time. 
Why do you think crunch is required to produce a great envelope-pushing game? 
"things would be FAR worse if, say, we had unions that made sure nobody crunched or worked over time"

Or maybe, just maybe, game companies would have to start hiring managers capable of doing their job. 
. . . would have to start hiring managers capable of doing their job

That's it, for me. A manager who actually knows how his company works.

I reckon most games are able to be made with very small crunch times - less than a month - but with bad communication and stupid planning crunch becomes a necessity. All too often some tosser in management hands down a decree that's taken as gospel, when it turns out it was an idea he had over his morning coffee and he's never worked in dev.

Then months later when the team is struggling with Multiplayer and Physics, that unfeasible idea has been agreed to and set in stone, and must be addressed.

Which hurts morale and leads to the team sitting around chatting, playing stupid flash games and not being very productive. 
"Crunch" is a synonym for "extra effort and working more than you are scheduled for". It doesn't have to happen at the end of the project but can happen many times along the way.

Any creative endeavor takes iteration and iteration takes time. Thinking that you can plan every single detail ahead of time is to be naive about the process.

Often times, things need to change. What you planned to do turns out to not be fun or it needs revisions or something new needs to be done instead. That's the sort of thing that throws a carefully laid schedule out the window.

Look, I'm not arguing FOR crunch. Do I want to be sitting here on July 4th hooking up shit in my level? No, but I'm here just the same. The work needs to get done. 
What's The Difference? 
What exactly is so special about the game development process that warrants crunch? There are fucktons of other fields of work which involve long creativity-based projects (movies come to mind) where somehow, people manage to do without. 
And Yes 
I well realise that some crunch is present in the movie-making industry, but not on a scale anywhere close to that of game development, where having crunch periods is more of a rule, rather than exception. 
It's More 
To do with the type of people that tend to work in games than, say, movies - I think.

There's always more to do - and nobody wants the final result to not be up to their own standards. 
It's Also Probably Got A Lot To Do With The Fact That 
software industry and games industry especially have lots of young people who don't have families or enough knowledge or self confidence to demand better so they go with the crunch culture.

Of course, it's not easy to avoid "crunches" from the top down either. You get delays and cancellations. You have to have a lot of slack in the time tables and still tolerate them going over. 
Uh, crunch in movies is probably just as bad as in games, for CG anyways. Pulling all nighters, and sleeping 5 minutes with an alarm clock while a test frame renders isn't so uncommon in post-processing jobs (post-processing is always the worst obviously since it's at the end of the chain).

I don't think crunch is in any way necessary, but yeah it's unfortunatly really hard to avoid, even with good management. 
"software industry and games industry especially have lots of young people who don't have families or enough knowledge or self confidence to demand better so they go with the crunch culture."

This is, again, somewhat naive. I mean, sure, you can say, "Yeah just stand up and leave." But when the project is over and they can afford to replace you with any one of the 1000s of people lined up outside the office - they will. That's not a threat and I'm not saying that to be mean, but it's the truth.

At the same time, there needs to be something at the end of the crunch for the employee. At Epic, we have an amazing profit sharing plan and that more than covers my pain and suffering. But at most companies, crunch is a pretty raw deal because generally at the end - you get laid off or the company closes or whatever. It's a harsh industry if you're not employed at one of the top players. 
There's something about a creative process that requires an extra push at the end.
That's the sort of thing that throws a carefully laid schedule out the window.

Seems to me, extra time needed is pretty predictable and easy to plan for. You just have to live with the fact that you can't account what you use that time for yet. Isn't there this rule: "take what the programmer says how long it takes, double it, and make it use the next larger unit" ? ;) 
GoW Pc 
in terms of performance it runs a lot faster than ut3, my guess is its less visually complex from its 360 origins, so I would not worry about performance.

The added single player segments are nice too :)

Single player co-op is great fun but you need games for windows live from microshaft to able to play online, and you guessed it. games for windows live BLOWS ASS CHUNKS :) 
Yes, it can be read as naive since it's a very short and simplified description of one hand of the whole affair.

It's one of those things where the whole unions, strikes, worker safety and an eight hour five day work week and communism started, ie that you can't just grab the next guy off the street.

Besides, in more complex jobs, people are actually worth something and it takes quite a lot of time to bring new guys up to speed. Not that management would often understand that though. 
Is really cool, was so thrilled when it finally came out and I didn't have to get a 360 to play it. I know the gameplay is repetitive, but the immersion is high, and the variances in setting are neat, as well as the whole group vibe. And I bust out laughing nearly every time Dom says "NICE!" 
Doms best line: 'sup bitches! 
Whats The Vsync Command In 
aguire quake? 
Never Mind 
got it, I thought it was different to regular glquake like in fitz.

But, what about half life 1? is there a vsync command there? 
you could set fps_max to your refreshrate, dunno about v-sync (except in vid card options under windows). 
this seems to be totally not-backed up bullshit: 
That's Because It's A Gamasutra Article 
They print a lot of shite. 
And With These Attitudes... 
... some people still wonder why Wii is outselling both 360 and PS3 combined. 
John Rose. 
I'm glad I spawned this whole discussion but I was waiting for maps to render and it was the day before a day off and the office was half empty and my CPUs were maxed and there wasn't a spare machine to do it on and I was just exceedingly bored. 
I sort of agree with his main point, but yeah, not well written. Oh well. 
I've worked no higher than manual labourer /item librarian/loader/clerk/assurer and I will tell you it is fucking chronic that management knows nothing about actual production.

By all means, the highest boss of production will know everything about production, will be reasonable, and cool, and intelligent (and have no percentage btw)... but higher than that, reasonability will not exist. Highest boss of production will himself flip off those higher than him (I've admired no one more in my life than seeing this), and it SHALT BE CALLED FOR.

Fatass White God, if ye have any mercy, give me a big fat scholarship next year so I don't have to go back...

In fact we all know (as foremen do) that the highest guy pays a slightly higher percentage if you can screw the guy below you. That is business. I understand how fair and intelligible it is. But I'm not in for 100 years of it. This whole percentages thing is not what I am in for. 
Ah, The Industry 
millions of people looking through a glass window at a massive banquet and ball where everyone's beautiful and rich, pounding on the glass wanting in, and thousands of people on the other side doing exactly the same thing. 
fuck you talking about? I'm beautiful and rich. 
no way y�re fat ugly and poor 
You're also impaled on a pitchfork in a well known picture. 
You're Also 
Fishy, but not quite fish.

Though you are golden as well. 
"percentage" -- what do you mean? 
shambler's email is corrupted its only adress is Transalvania,
where it managed to set the church on fire. 
Another License Question 
I'm sure this has been brought up back in 1999 or something, but since I wasn't around, I have to ask again...

Let's say I have a mod based on Quake2/CTF/mission pack code. Somehow the license has been lost or there was never one included etc. To really complicate it, I've taken a few bits from other mods which by now are (rightly or wrongly) under the GPL.

Now I'd like to do The Right Thing (TM) and reinclude a license in the next release. Which one?

Is my "Modified copy" still covered by the id license? Or was that just for the "authorized copy"? I have some problems with this lawyer-speak...

I know nobody will probably care, I'd just like to get this off the list... and if no license applies anymore, I'd choose GPL...

*scratches head* 
That is very similar to my own conundrum concerning releasing some content ;). I don't have an easy answer, and in my case, I'm just creating code that is compatible with pre-GPL released sources in functionality while trying to avoid copying the methods used. 

The GPL code is pretty general... it's practically only modified pre-GPL code... it's probably contained in several mods under several licenses, where one copied from the other... then someone put the GPL stamp on it, which is, well, nice, but questionable (I think.)

Parts are also "public domain" as per hearsay from people who knew someone who knew the mod author... *g* It's pretty weird.

Perhaps a mail to Todd Hollenshead or something?

I just don't fully understand the original id license (CTF/Xatrix etc license.) It's not very clear about the status of "modified copies" and copies thereof (and copies of... well you get the point...)

bleh. :-/ 
JC Tenton 
I just mean the amount they personally make is related to how much the company makes overall. Yeah they get a flat rate, but there's commission/bonuses/etc on top of that. All the way up to the foreman where I worked none of that applied, the foreman could (and did) make a shitload doing overtime, but overtime is just another flat rate, it isn't related to how much of a killing the company as a whole is making. What was a particular pain in the ass was being expected to squeeze more work into the same amount of hours, without getting paid any more, because people with commission were setting it up that way. Overtime is a good way to make money, but people with commission never even work overtime. Anyway, maybe with two useless degrees instead of one I'll be able to get something better next time, lol. 
Ah, I see -- are you talking about stock? Also, I suggest joining a labor union in the area! 
Willem - UT3 PS3 
Is the PS3 version of UT3 any good? I enjoy mapping for UT3 on my PC, but for the past months I've been drifting more and more towards gaming just on my PS3. I know that UT3 PS3 supports custom content so I could even playtest my maps on it if I wanted to. So the question is, is the PS3 version of the game actually good? 

If you like shooters on consoles, it's good. I liked it a lot and I know it's gotten great reviews.

I dunno, I think the 360 version is probably superior but I only say that because I like the 360 controller more. In terms of the game itself, they're basically identical in terms of feel. 
Dawn Of War 2 Website Live

It has one of those frustrating age gates, which I have to scroll downwards through a little more every year, how depressing!

Game looks nice tho! 
I always choose 1900 as a "fuck you" the whole inane process. 
The default way really... 
How does the control system work with the complexity of UT3 on console?

I normally play CoD4 on the consoles due (in part) to the 'simplicity' (I believe this is also part of the incomprehendable success of the Halo series). I'm not condoning the doctrine that complexity in games is a bad thing, but I'm not sure how scrolling through a dozen weapons with different fire modes on a pad would work in a fast fps... 
And I always choose my actual birthdate, it's just too cool not to 
The weapon switching is pretty smooth once you get used to it - we use a pop-up wheel approach. Once you know where the weapons are on it (they don't move and have static slots), it's easy.

"And I always choose my actual birthdate, it's just too cool not to"

I guess I'll just move this along then since it seems to be stuck ... Hey, what's your birth date?! 
Max Payne Movie 
Mark Wahlberg is a reasonably decent choice for Max Payne, and the movie doesn't look all that bad for a slow-mo shoot em up. They even have cool angels pulling Mr. Payne during some of his more acrobatic jumping sequences, which I think is a nice touch and quite refreshing. Trailer @, possibly others. 
Mark Wahlberg.

"omg, something is HAPPENING!"

He might be a decent action movie guy, actually come to think of it it's not his fault he was cast in yet another pretentious, preachy, artsy, condescending shamylan flick.

Anyone read "What if Michael Bay had written The Dark Knight" btw, on the subject of mocking directors? What's hilarious is how little of an exaggeration that actually was. 
yeah, i read that "rejected michael bay batman script" thing. funny. 
But Shamylanyshama 
isn't directing that movie! 
Clive Owen 
that would be a perfect max payne. 
Damn Right There 
Clive Owen, Good Actor 
but too British for Max, I haven't seen him pull off an American role the way Bale or Hugh Laurie (who uses an interesting mix of prep school and Mid-Atlantic in his accent for House). Max Payne is a young Mickey Rourke, but unfortunately no time machines exist, so I guess Wahlberg is a fine substitute.

Mila Kunis as Mona Sax? Drop dead Gorgeous face, but lacks the long legs and husky voice necessary for the roll. She is in her mid to late twenties now, so maybe she can adjust that voice (think Meg on Family Guy if you are not familiar with her) to pull it off and she would have to wear stilettos for a femme fatale roll, anyway. 
What Was That Film He Did? 
Sniper, he starts of as a Sniper and his partner (sniper) gets killed in Iraq and he just gets out, then they try to fram him for an assasination attempt!

Good movie, very 80's action flick 
His Best Work IMHO 
was in The Departed and Boogie Nights

I believe in miracles, woo hoo! . .  
you're thinking of Shooter 
Thanks Man 
that was bugging the hell out of me! 
we miss you in tf :( 
Improved Classic Theme For WinXP And Vista 
Thought I'd share a slightly improved version of the Classic theme for Windows XP and Vista with the rest of you as I think it's a lot more pleasing to the eye:


Unzip the archive, move the *.ttf files into C:\Windows\Fonts and the *.theme files into C:\Windows\Resources\Themes Double-click on one of the *.theme files (the screenshot shows the Calibri version) and accept the change. The only difference between the 2 files is the font being used. 
look nice 
Of Course... 
They should've gone with Sam Lake as Max Payne. 
Okay, so if you don't want to release all of the quoth2 source, that's fine.

Could you at least release world.qc, trigger.qc, you know, all the stuff with the really handy utilitarian mapper assists / model saving coolness / etc that doesn't involve quoth content? They're awesome, but other mappers who want to use them for their own mod being forced to reinvent all those wheels is a little stupid. 

what is aglquake and where download? (gogle dont know)

just played supercoop+e1m1rmx+skill3
click on the "people" tab at the top of the screen. Then click on "AguirRe". Then click on his homepage. There is loads of cool stuff there including "modified GlQuake for mappers". Thats is AGlQuake!!!

i cant find "AguirRe" in peoples .(( 
Find In Gogle 
"This is the homepage of Bengt Jardrup"
it is it? 
Oh Shit - Sorry! 
Yeah - Bengt Yardrup - that's the one.

AguirRe - Have you been inactive on func for thelast 30 days?!??!

His name is normally at the top of that list. 
You left irc like a little wanker; I wanted to tell you that I really enjoyed that link :* 
I needed sleep. And I did not wank! 
Speaking Of Things Tangentially Related To Quake 
You've heard of elder things but have you encountered ... elder thongs? 
Zombie Garden 
Everyone loves zombies, right?

Our garden is now complete. 
zombies do sound like a head of cabbage being chopped in half when they gib, so maybe growing a few in the garden is not a bad idea. 
Is fucking amazing 
Happy Tromping On Tennis Courts Day 
to Bal, Mad Fox, JPL, and anyone else from the Gaul. 
What ?? 
Following Bastille, 
...deus, I think you thumped your head somewhere.... 
OK, I see, I didn't capture the historical reference there ;) 
Madfox, Did You Just Call Me God? 
JPL, my first version was Happy Off With Their Heads Day, but I thought a more direct reference to Bastille would be less obscure! 
God, Did You Just Call Me Madfox? 
...carrots don't seem to be franchise...

and I ain't even frenche, you chauvenist! 
My Apologies To The People Of France 
My Apolo Cheese 2 
CharlesVII, who burnt the poor child after she had returned his crown without lending her a hand.

or Charles, who conceiled the Army of Foreigners lending them all a chance to cover up their past 
While You Are At It 
don't forget to add Antoine de Saint Exup�ry to your list. 
They Should've Gone With Sam Lake As Max Payne. 
agreed, thats would good choice 
JPL, my first version was Happy Off With Their Heads Day, but I thought a more direct reference to Bastille would be less obscure!

Indeed... BTW, excuse accepted, no problem ;) 
I am indifferent without a context with which to think of it. 
Its Arms Are Short 
is it not meant to be a useful robot? 
Cant Determine The Sex 
without being able to hear the voice....

seriously it looks like part male part female!!! 
Looks a bit stiff and inflexible. 
No, Please Dear God, No 
Does someone have the mentioned CD:
They look a bit, er...... 
But I do have a coat made from rusty barbed wire you can wear. 
I Reckon 
There's archiving dedication and then theres collecting stuff like that.

Only available on cd? Damn. 
Look What I Found! 
Give Me That Spider 
good to see TF still going strong :) 
Q2DM Mapping Contest 
They're running another Q2DM mapping contest at the Q2Cafe some time in August:
Too bad it's focused on DM. Would be nice if they combined it with the QExpo, though I doubt they even know about it. 
lol people keep playing Q2DM? roulffff...

For Trinca To Post At These Occasions 
lol people keep playing [^q](.*)?DM? roulffff...

How do you usually cope with different levels of perfectionism in the art dept.?

ATM i have this weird situtation, where:
0) it's a freetime project with no roles/responsibilities defined
1) i'm the only guy who ever did anytyhing game related art-wise
2) we have a modeler who's surprisingly good at things he never did before, but still 'has potential' as i see it
3) me saying 'hey tweak it there, and here' (design things)
4) some other guy (who already didn't agree with the one art decision we made) arguing against virtually every single thing i say 'could be worked upon' to. At first he complained about stylistic things, now he complains that i want too much, that we don't have the ressources to be any better and that we should get it over with and start the next model, so we at least have a few.

There's no deadline involved, and our first model took about a day or so of time for the modeler, total time about a week max, which i found surprisingly fast.

What do i do? That other guy just thinks 'it's good enough', while i think 'could be better' - and i'm tired of arguing against him. All the other guys didn't give their opinion on things. My view is that we need to perfect the first model as much as we can (within reasonable time & ressources) to nail down the style and skill level, so all the next models aren't wasted at the end.

What makes this a bit complicated is that the model is more a fit to the other guys views than to what we laid down, so he naturally thinks of it better as it is. I told him to recreate a discussion about design style guides if he's unsatisfied with the current one or otherwise try to hold his opinion back and just take the guide as a basis for criticism, but that just lead to a disasterous argument just now ;) 
It sounds like you don't have a project leader who has the authority to make decisions. Design by comittee rarely works out in then long run. I say decide on someone to be the leader or suffer more of this in the future. :) 
megaman :) is becouse Q2DM is so so very slow :\

i play 2 or 3 times and got bored real fast 
Everything was fine until #4. Someone has to be able to lay down the law. seeing as it's a freetime project this will probably piss off dude #4 who will leave, so be ready for that. has he contributed anything besides a contrary attitude? 
Someone Has To Be The "nazi" 
in any team. And "players" must have the gift of humility. And ultimately trust the nazi.

I mean in any artistic team-based project there has to be one guy who is able to make descisions/talk down to people. Although that figure must be able to be reasonable too..... 
Oh Man 
what an awesome life lesson, "Somebody has to be the Nazi." 
Logically then, someone else has to be the Jew. 
You Know What They Say 
some days you're the nazi, some days you're the jew 
Yeah :( 
it's sad, but atm it looks like we need hierarchy. Establishing a leader now will be very difficult though...

No, the other guy hasn't really contributed much, so that won't be that much of a problem.

More opinions, experiences, advice, etc. appreciated. 
No man or woman is worth your tears,and the one who is ,won't make you cry.
�żҽ�����<br />
�żҽ����ξ���<br />
�Լ���<br />
�żҽ���<br />
����<br />
�żҽ������������<br /> 
Excellent Effort Spammy McDouche 
HeadThump* erases the two thousand words of advice on love and trust he wrote over the last hour that he was about to give to yet another spambot.

* not a reliable gauge on Turing Test matters. 
spambots are attracted to aphorisms 
Lun Stole My Title :( 
Madfox Continues To Astound And Amaze 
I Read Somewhere 
that Adam Foster has been hied by Valve. That's pretty cool, his HL stuff was quite impressive and from the sounds of it, so was his HL2 episode. 
Lun, That Makes Me Wonder 
That first 20+ set of maps he did had an extreme randomness to it and also given his constant use of rhyme back in '04, at the time, I considered the possibility, MadFox was some university student's sociological experiment using a mod niche as test subjects. But then his mapping improved, and he would break character to call me a Butthead every time I pissed him off, so I dismissed the idea. Also, when I play tested a level last year for him, the exchanges were fairly intelligible, so I don't know. 
MadFox's Post Of Self-awareness 
This entire idea is awesome

someone should make a speedmapping contest, of "What MADFOX makes upon becoming self-aware." 
I dont like to stress the fact that madfox rocks, but he jus does,So, for all you staff users out there, feel free to come in and post, my staff is a good one, but here is how it goes

1. post message in the room
3. dont report anything, i might get in trouble :)
and 4. Have fun!!! 
That Madfox Thing Just Blew My Mind 
Part of the reason I never got into advanced philosphy. 
For Serious. 
But then his mapping improved, and he would break character to call me a Butthead every time I pissed him off, so I dismissed the idea.

I told you guys, the AI is learning
Can An AI Produce This?

I think this video of his must hold at least a few keys. 
that was one trippy irc log.

out of interest i tried running the content of the last 100 posts of GA through a mark v shaney generator, some of the results:

- Does someone have the ressources to be the leader or suffer more of this in the garden is not a reliable gauge on Turing Test matters.
- spambots are attracted to aphorisms <3 seriously wtf that Adam Foster has been brought up back in '04, at the time, I considered the possibility, MadFox was some university student's sociological experiment using a mod niche as test subjects.
- But then his mapping improved, and he would break character to call me a Butthead every time I pissed him off, so I could even playtest my maps on it if I wanted to.
- His name is normally at the top of the game itself, they're basically identical in terms of feel.
- It has one of the quoth2 source, that's fine.
- Could you at least a few bits from other mods which by now are (rightly or wrongly) under the GPL.
- Now I'd like to stress the fact that madfox rocks, but he jus does,So, for all you staff users out there, feel free to come in and post, my staff is a fine substitute. 
#1407 lunaran > that's not me! My use of language is much poor than that balsh! The stupid nonsense I'm supposed to use there should make you think why there aren't that much misspells...sorry...nicked.

#14709 headthump > I may be food for psygoligists...reason I never consult one.
You're not a buthead, I just have enormous guilts understanding you americans (?!).

#14710 lurker > you're right! lol for me and everyone with an creative mind and how to get along with it. I establish the link to virtual pizza's!

#14712 necros > still thanks for your qc help with my rat model, I'm much further now!

#14713 neg!ke > it is not so much as philosopy,
(Plato's dialogs are terrific!) as well that I hate numbers and pronounciation marks in reading text.

#14714 lunaran > part of me is crazy, but youre nick is lune-a-ran.

#141715 bear > thanks, you may now go on watching the radiotube for more of edison's treasures... at least you could have givven me a vote.

#14714 rj > so again, that's not me, but you can use my babbelfish for text generators.

#14717 madfox > cool down, man. take my easytune I lately made...
set speaker low. 
A Stunning End 
to a hilarious debate!

Madfox, you could have trailed a few more breadcrumbs, it was just getting interesting! :) 
I still think he's a computer! 
in doom3, the files in the glprogs folder (with the *.vfp extension)... are those shaders like cg or hlsl? 
Did you write "Python Programming on Win32"? 
I'm Glad That Wasn't You, MadFox 
As Bobby Fischer once said, 'I don't believe in psychology, I believe in good moves.'

But then again, he was certifiably nuts. 
So Seriously 
who ran luna?

roughly it takes 3years and 3 months to walk to the moon at an average speed of 8km/houre.

still it won't stop the average turnspeed of earth, which is 15meters/second when standing still. 
No, that was Mark Hammond. 
assembly. cg and hlsl both get compiled into asm vertex/fragment progs. 
for the info :) 
Something Awesome Re: That 
I tinkered with the doom lighting vfp and found that light color is supplied as a vec4, with alpha, and alpha isn't regarded at all. So I tinkered more and turned shaderparm3 on lights (alpha) into a diffuse-ness measure that scales/biases the shading dot product to 'fill' lighting on surfaces a bit more. It looks really sweem using doom3's original sharp lighting for a keylight, and this fuzzy light for a bounced fill. 
screens or it didn't happen 
I Looked 
I guess it didn't happen 
I found this but it doesn't show it off too well 
Really neat, Lun. 
Lun created an alternative to fullbright.

Weekend well spent. 
This Point Goes To 

I'd be interested what you did though, care to post the shader? 
I carried it a little further, and started putting ambient occlusion maps in the alpha of the diffuse (and if I wanted an alphamasked texture I'd use alpha in the normal map or somwot instead), and multiplying that into the result by an inverse proportion, so that the direct light looks direct and the diffuse light looks diffuse, and halfway values look good too. [12 mega-bytes]

Including some of those textures in the pak. I had planned on doing the whole ship with just a couple of big utility textures so I could have brushwork all over that would share a material and thus batch really well, so I wouldn't have to be so stingy with lights. Then there were dirty engineering versions and clean upper-level versions to unify the look of the ship and ... ahh, Byzantine. I wish I knew how to finish you. 
Its Like Carmack... 
I dont understand a thing you just said, but it sounds like it will melt eyes... ;) 
I Should Be Banned From Making Posts. 
That's Pretty Cool Lun 
But supertrim and superpanels are missing their localmaps? 
Oh Uh 
are they?

Oh, damn, I know what I did. I'll update the file when I get home.

also, scampie figured out the correct solution to our game in #tf from earlier: the United Nations International Bureau of Really Oversized Weapons. 
Do you know UT3 (pc) supports voice chat? Me and the guys have been using vent, but it's kinda annoying. 
Just throwing it out there, anyone ever make a Quake mod in isotropic perspective for a Quake tactics kind of game? 
file updated. enjoy the fru-its of my labours! 
I See What You Did There 
Func's colors at least vaguely hint at Quake, whereas Qboard looks more like Deus Ex. Go figure. 
Kinda frozen and not a tactics game though. 
I'm Sure I've Asked This Before 
but is there some setting i dont have right in q3? Textures in certain maps appear to be splotchy, like pjw3dm5 and unitooldm6 (a cel shaded map). It's where there's shadows cast from the lightmaps I think. 
Map Tracker! 
great idea, eh Metl ;) 
Wasn't there a mod by Harbinger of Fish that had an isometric view and lots of RTS elements? 
i like the cut of your gib, good sire.

i guess this new thing would improve the sort of lighting you can do in outdoor areas? 
I was thinking about the phrase "I like the cut of your gib" over and over today for some reason. Couldn't get it out of my head. I became obsessed with it. Now I guess I know why.

*Marcher Fortress 2, Marcher Fortress 2, Marcher Fortress 2...* 

Wow those Qboard pages bring back memories. Forgotten about so many of those guys, like seth and c0ld. Miss 'em, and of course Headshot and Mr. Clean and the rest. Good times =D 

My plan was to combine it with custom-painted light-projection images for pretty much every room, like I did in Strombine.

If you knock me up a neat outdoor area I'll light it, howsat? 
Maps I Made doesn't work :( 

1) lawl. Zan.

2) The no words design thread is surprisingly precient 
Dagnammit. I can't read input box titles.

Sorry for the triple post :( 
Now post that in the mapping help thread with a description and maybe a screenshot and somebody will probably help you fix it.

Or smoke some chronic, maybe watch tv for a while. 
I just looked through the Shub-Hub logs and noticed

7705 hits so far. 
cool! :D

(also im getting my popcorn ready) 

If you knock me up a neat outdoor area I'll light it, howsat?

I would say that's an offer I can't refuse :) I'll definately have something ready at some point for my D3 "Tharsis" project - can't give an ETA right now though :{ 
Do It Before I Lose Interest! 
quick! quickly! 
Fucking Computers 
computer are shit.

My computer overheated (by the looks of things) the other day and now some important element (either the cpu or gpu) seems to be completely fucked. Actually, I've no idea what really happened, but the damn thing has always run ridiculously hot and it's currently the middle of a hot summer in Japan so I'm assuming it overheated. Basically I was just browsing the web and suddenly the screen went corrupt so I turned it off and left it. The next day I tried to use it and it made some normal sounding noises but it never seemed to start up. The hdd light was flashing and the fans were on, but the monitor never displayed an image.

It's a 3 year old dell xps2 with a pentium-m 2ghz and nvidia gf6800 go ultra. Still a reasonable machine that I could use for what I need if it hadn't just bust. SO glad I didn't burn money on the 3 year extended warranty, as it would have just expired :)

Anyway, if anyone knows what the problem might be or has had any previous experience with this kind of crap, please help. I haven't yet tried calling dell customer service because it's expensive and I can't use skype anymore. Pretty sure there is no email helpline, but I'll have a look. 
I've had the same problem with my Dell on and off for almost a year now. I would get decent performance for a few weeks and then I out of nowhere the screen would start blinking, and then it would either freeze up or give a Blue Screen of Death warning (Paged in unpaged area, IRQ conflict with video driver). However, I have good reason to believe the problem has been solved. I cashed in a favor my bro owed me, and got him to work on it.

He found the power supply box to be barely adequate for the requirements of the machine. A small slip in its performance would be enough to effect the stability of the machine.

He replaced the box; unfortunately, Dells boxes are slightly non standard. There is no slot in the outer plate for the (0 -) button that is standard with boxes that come off the shelf. So it's necessary to keep the machine open, with the power supply outside of it.

Last winter I had to give up on my Radeon AGP 9700 because the computer simply would not run with it installed, but now I have reinstalled
it with no performance problems, testing it with Far Cry, Fear, Doom III and Quake IV.

Before the power supply replacement, I used an old Geforce 4 MX PCI card and I didn't even dare to run Quake III with it because of the certitude it would cause a lock up.

I hope the problem you are having is as simple a fix as this. I chased down a number of possibilities, but the instable power supply was causing false flags to be spat out. 
GPU => Power Supply => Motherboard => CPU.

In that particular order, are the most likely causes of your problem. These days, you have to try really really hard to actually fry a CPU before it manages to autoshutdown. 
bolt cutters would fix that right up! 
Yeah With Jago 
I had a similar situation and managed to work out it was the GPU.

If you have onboard video, try disabling video card and see if the MB video loads up? 
Than, On A Sidenote 
"a 3 year old dell xps2 with a pentium-m 2ghz and nvidia gf6800"

Instead of troubleshooting (unless you are lucky and get the problem nailed down fast), I would just go and buy a new PC. 600 euros will easily get you a PC twice as fast as your current one (assuming you hand-pick components instead of buying outrageously overpriced brand PCs). 
If You're In The UK Try:

These guys are the guys I got mine from. Which was problematic, but they did eventually deliver. I only bring this up because they really do offer fantastic value for money!!

On another note, I hear thay the new ATI card is the dogs bollocks, the 4870 I think?

Supposed to be on par with the new NVidia GTX260 (or was it even the 280!?) but for a lot less money INDEED. As in they now will own the market share... 
Quake Input Lag 
I'm getting horrible input lag in fitzquake/winquake/glquake which makes them all unusable. The lag time varies but can be up to a second or more. This is on a laptop running windows XP that didn't use to have this problem in the past, using "-dinput" makes no difference.

SDLfitzquake and ezquake works fine so I at least can play quake but with a limited engine choice.

Any ideas to what might cause this? 
a little far fetched, but have you tried disabling any antivirus software you have running in the background and checking whether that makes any difference? 
If you're on Windows, try using -dinput or its equivalent in NQ engines. The D stands for Direct, I think it's a Microsoft thing. 
Er Bear 
Me has un brain farte. 

I thought this style of documentation was windows help (nobody uses, ever) only :(

They only describe the GUI, not what the application is actually doing. 
It's a notebook pc so there wasn't really any self-build option around and the dell seemed like the most affordable machine of the spec I wanted at the time. If I get a desktop or mini-desktop, I'll probably just build it myself.

Anyway, I can't get into Windows to disable any AV software and I'm 100% sure AVG is not causing the problem. The machine turns on, the monitor backlight turns on with it, the HDD whirs, no bios beep errors occur, the HDD seems to work as normal, but after a few seconds the monitor backlight turns off as if there is no signal whilst HDD activity continues as if it were botting. I unplugged the HDD to see if it would make any beep when I booted and there were two beeps. I think the gpu is borked, though whether it overheated I don't know - the max operating temperature of the machine is a pathetic 35C so I don't have any trouble believing overheating could have caused the problem since it's consistently about 35C at the moment outside and the machine has always run ridiculously hot.

I've sent a mail off to dell customer support, but I have a strong feeling they are going to be completely useless bastards. 
Can we please all stay honest, bad mouthed and unfiltered? The 'wow, that's great' attitude Ricky and some others are spreading sucks. Read q3w or d3w for a while to see why.

I want honest people. This is about the only place where most people care enough to complain. If i'm shitmouthed every time i'm honest, i will stop being honest and lie to you how great your stuff is. 
somebody has to be the nazi

fuck you megaman you suck there see happy now i've told you so? feel obliged to master yourself? do you feel your creative output is ready to be expanded, innovated?

you seem very sinical. do you have a miserable time? maybe just a rough lifestyle. full of pure grit and an omniscient ressiliance to lifes labours.

who am I to say. just out of curiousity though, what is this "q3w" and "d3w" of which you speak? forgive me but I'm unfamiliar with your shorthand. it might help your case a little if you perhaps relay some sort of example of this evidence of which you speak

If i'm shitmouthed every time i'm honest

if you take "artistic journalistic libertys" everytime you're honest, at someones expense.
it should be possible to be honest without causing an argument, or I bid thee rise above it 
I like you but would you calm the fuck down already 

"Ricky I like you but"

love is in the air

la la la la

love is in the air

la la la la


and ricky say to me rocket in arse? :) hehe 
You On The Other Hand 
need to go back to being retired 
true i�m getting real old :( 
You're too pissy
You're not pissy enough
You're too nice
You're not nice enough

It's like a soap opera cycle of prima donna bullshit. 
I'm starting loving you all....ready?

I was watching a docu about Spartacus and how he honourfull tried to lead the slaves against the Romans, but as he had no clear politics he had to loose it afterall. Saw him die his tragic death and the Romans sculptured their way to Rome with scornfull crosses with tortued slaves.

Then I went to bad and had tis strange dream.
I was in the land of Quake with some of my best friends. In some strange way I knew, although I was dreaming, that it couldn't be real... the land of Quake...hah! So I told my friends they don't had to be serious with the craetures they would met.
And as example I went to the first one I met. someone that looked like an army officer and the look-a-likes of carmack, took a big stone from the ground and started beating it on his head. To my surprise his head became like a bublegum, clunching up all sides and slowly I lost the fun in doing so. Then I saw my friends getting killed and I really got scared, because I was the one who told them not to be frightened.
Suddenly another army agent came up to me with a big stone aiming to my head, and the only thing I could feel was his groaning question:

H� farmerboy, have you seen that armyofficer?

which I know is an old greece parabel about te god Mercurious trying to see how faithfull the
slave would be. 
madfox saved the thread. 
Never change. 
no one's going to top that... 
Just Watch It 
more delicious food for MadFoxBot

About 17.6 different types of awesome. 
Genius, grim genius.

They should show that on children's TV. 
Quake Live

Apparently I was wrong and the ads WILL be in game on giant billboards. Carmack states that Q3A suits giant ads in-game just fine because Quake's got a very tournamenty gamey feel anyway.

which also doesn't suit my style of design at all, so, I guess I won't be revisiting any of my old maps or making any new ones for Quake Live. 
I haven't rtfa yet, but doesn't that pretty much mean that custom maps won't be possible? =\
Yeah I'm seriously dissapointed about this. 
I imagine they would be possible, just have a criteria that X amount of adverts at X variety of sizes must be placed prominently in a map. Maybe it's too hard to enforce so they won't allow custom content but in theory the criteria is pretty easy and mappers could easily incorporate them....and I think it would be fair to accept the need to include ads...

I also agree with Carmack's reasoning about a very tourney game and exactly the same thing would apply to UTX for example. 
A fair point, and could be integrated well so not to intrude on gameplay.

The real problem is the back and forth pissing about that it'll almost certainly create - advertiser X doesn't think that their jpg is shown enough because it's dark and so is the lighting, or it's a shade of grey and becomes washed out. Or its a 1000x2 texture and becomes warped etc. etc.

Which adds guff to development time, taking away from what the designers are able to put into the game itself. Probably negligible, but even so. 
That isn't an easy solution at all, I doubt any developer would consider that.

I don't like ads in tourney games, even if they try to make them fit with the setting etc, it won't stop me from playing a game if it's good though. But with this, I'm just worried it means NO to custom maps, they pretty much said mods would not be possible, and to them, custom maps = mods probably. 
I Think 
I did read somewhere that "fresh off the compiler" maps wont be possible in live, but id will be releasing regular map packs (im guessing they will use community maps but set rules like x billboards etc).

Because its an ad-supported game, what if everyone just played the good custom maps with no billboards? Epic fail :)

Im also pretty sure that there will be standards for the ads themselves, im sure they will use a shader that makes them appear backlit/fullbright so "my ad is too dark" wont be an issue.

Still im wondering why they are using the stock q3 maps, 90% of them were utter shit or gimmick maps... Surely it would have been wiser to use the best x number of community q3 maps and pay a royalty to the mapper of each one... 
Quake Live 
I think Carmack said something (in a previous shacknews interview) that they might have some kind of competitions/screening process for custom maps with the best ending up in a map pack.

Ads will probably come in the form of one or more ad shaders that will be responsible for showing the current ads, having fixed ad textures seems very unlikely. 
You have shader/advert1 - 3 (or whatever) and the server loads up whatever is the currently posted advert on map start. I've integrated one for a splash screen. 
To Be Fair 
in a fair few q3dm maps there are "mapper ads" on the walls already, which show the map name and/or author and they don't really look out of place in an arena game, so they won't really bother me that much :) 
Ads Could Be Fun And Quirky 
But it is man's sociological nature that gloriously bent advertisement will eventually be replaced with degenerate PSA's (Public Service Announcements). Having fun in the Arena? Maybe you are having too much fun. If you are having too much fun, seek the advice of a professional.

I remember a time when riding in the morning to work, listening to FM disc jockies, the commercials were all silly, sick and full of adolescent humor. Now, turning on the same stations, all you get is paternalistic advice telling you to quit smoking, seek help for your depression, practice safe sex to avoid AIDS, don't judge others, avoid fatty foods, and don't swerve into traffic because the onslaught of publicly financed PSA's is really pissing you off. 
Still im wondering why they are using the stock q3 maps, 90% of them were utter shit or gimmick maps...

Because they made them and they can't tell.

Remember the Tim Willits multiplayer map advice I posted? He reccomends gimmick maps. 
but for casual players, gimmick maps are actually fun. The depth of a good "serious" map is not discernible to people that don't have a deep understanding of the game. So they don't miss the lack of depth in a gimmick map, but they do notice the gimmick, which is fun and interesting. You'd have to be a more seious player to notice that the gimmick overshadows the other game mechanics and distorts or breaks their usual balance. 
Take the 10% of gamers who bother to complete a game.

Remove from that the 80% with no aptitude.

Remove from that the 90% who prefer not to sit in a darkened office on the weekend, pissing about with new problem n.

There you have a game developer, probably the only people who can tell.

And most of the Q3 mappers can tell, but their bosses don't care if they're complaining, because they're not in that hallowed (socially misfit) group.

At least it pays the way. 
Been Drinkin' 
But what I mean is that the publishers want a few bells and whistles, some flashy visuals (not necessarily the latest graphics engine) and mediochre gameplay, because that appeases marketing, and they think that it'll sell.

And they're fucking right.

That's why there's so many people still playing and mapping / modding for this ancient game, and not a few developers. Its basically the inverse of the list above. 
The Average Person Is A Dumbass 
and the rest of us (that is the minority) have to deal with that.

Although, surely id can tell BY NOW that most stock q3 maps were crap. It's actually amazing that they built such a compelling, efficient gameplay with so few good maps to test it in... 
Define Gimmick Map 
Any Of Your Speedmaps 
A Gimmick Map 
is like crossfire in half life - that annoying map where it's a big normal open map with a bunker at one end, and whenever some idiot presses the button there's an alarm and anybody who isn't in the bunker when the doors shut gets nuked. Or there's a chamber with an item in it and when some other idiot hits the button you get trapped in it and it fills with lava or something. Or the map is a maze with spawns at the edges, and whoever gets to the middle first hits the button that makes the floor drop out and fall into spikes or whatever other kind of contrived shenanigans that go above just the simple interaction of players, items, and layout, usually breaking the aforementioned in the process because now all anyone wants to do is camp the button.

At least, that's in multiplayer. I guess part of the whole tumult we've had recently here is a dearth of good single player gimmick maps. 
Crossfire was actually a nice map. The gimmick would work only every 5 minutes or so, which made it pretty balanced, and quite interesting. Most often turned the tables.

Agree on the other gimmicks ;) q3dm17 ftw 
Carmack Keynote 
Does anyone know if there exists video of it? i can't find anything anywhere :( And reading some dumbass reporters 'main points' isn't quite the same. 
q1 dm2 would be a gimmick map I guess. And just look how great it is.
A map can only be as good as the players play it and vice-versa. Who would give e1m2 or dm6 a first look and say they are good? 
And for the other 4 minutes and 30 seconds everyone clustered around the button waiting for it. 2/3 of the map was empty except for people who'd spawned out there and had to walk back to where the 'gameplay' actually was. 
hm, my games never were like that. all the action always is in the atrium. That's where i get the most frags, and every now and then someone pushes the button so all my powerups and weapons aren't that useful anymore and i need to actually move my arse ;) 
Are You Talking About The HL1 Deathmatch Map? 
That map's weird. There's a cool secret area I found once. I like it inside the buildings because it's quite cramped and in a lot of places you really can't see very much at all. 
Woo Yeah! 
secret areas in DM maps! those are great for seperating the men from the noobs. 
Secret Traps 
Shoot something that doesn't look like a button and the RA area turns into a pit of death - thats the business.

Was it Deadmeat maps that did that? 
I agree some of those things are annoying in DM, although I'm not against certain unusual elements/features (eg. Quad trap) as long as they're not the main focus of the map that distracts from proper gameplay.

Which Q3A maps in particular qualify as gimmick maps then? I can't really think of any, except maybe the grenade shooter in the Quad room of one map, and maybe the crusher in that space tourney map.

Bler: You can't be seriously considering dancing monsters, exploding scenery, the goatse guy, happy textures, or silly centerprints as gimmicky... :P 
I Guess... 
these guys think the space maps are all gimmick maps... i'd say they are just a genre of map, that happens to be shallower in some incarnations (but non-space maps can be shallow too) 
The Longest Yard 
qualifies as a gimmick map. I recall the day the demo of Q3Arena was released, my brother invited me over to play. He had been practicing with bots for several hours before I got there, and I doubt I have to spell it out to anyone how he dominated my ass on that map. 
I agree with Metl, I don't think q3dm17 is really a gimmick map, and yeah even if it's totally overplayed, and forces a specific kind of gameplay onto the players, I still think it plays ok, and is one of the better maps in q3.

On the other hand some of the other space maps in q3 were more gimmicky in my opinion, like q3dm19 and it's stupid moving platforms. 
I Agree With Bal And Metlslime 
but only because they're my friends! 
Rotating Birds Are Gimmicks. 
Quake Portal Gun Mod 
I'm Robert and I'm co-developing new quake1 project - portal gun mod (see wiki record: Portal_(video_game))
We already have portal gun and models of portal gates, but the main thing is still open: levels.
Could anybody who likes idea of portal gun AND making levels, help us? Just please send me mail on
The project is OpenSource.

Edit: Post in the mappers wanted thread. 
To Get People Interested 
Post your work-in-progress mod. Or at least screenshots/video.

Btw there are 2 (3?) quick portal mods for Quake already. They all have some quirks though. 
I Would Say 
That Spirit is wize (and old), but in view of recent posts, I would say this warrants its own thread!

Create yourself an account and post it as a discussion thread. I bet loads of people express interest. I express interest!

I must tell you though, I would need basic entity information and a compiled progs to do anything here - I only really know how to map, not program.... 
Diablo II Sales 
I seriously don't get this: Blizzard announced Diablo 3 and now Diablo 2, a 7 year old game, has been in the Top10 PC Games sales chart for like 4 or 5 weeks straight. What's even more funny/ridiculous is that Blizzard had 4 titles in the Top10 of last week:

4: World Of Warcraft: Battle Chest
6: Diablo Battle Chest
7: World Of Warcraft
8: World Of Warcraft: Burning Crusade Expansion Pack 
One More Reason 
Diablo 2 is actually one of the games still available in stores after such a long time. 
You don't get why one of the greatest games of all time, and what is clearly still the best action RPG ever created with nothing that even comes close, is selling well?

I guess it IS surprising that people are actually buying it, since you'd figure most people would still have their old versions lying around. Maybe it's people who have lost their discs, or encouraging friends to try it, etc.

Then again another factor you may not have considered is that they only just started offering the game for purchase/digital download in their online store (this coincided with the D3 news). If those sales figures are counting the downloadable version, it's easier to see why the sales figures are higher than you'd usually expect.

Not that finding a physical copy is difficult, it's always available! 
Does Lun Write On Slashdot? 
The "game industry" is largely a cult of managers, where imagination dies and talent is unrewarded.

That's pretty full of itself as a statement, but the cult of managers thing is spot on the money. 
I Want To Be One 
Perserverance Is Key IMO 
Cs_starling Public Beta 01 
I'm crossposting this from the beta-thread. Partly to drum up some downloads, but mostly because I'm an asshole.

Cubemaps might be fucked, lighting might be fucked, the whole damn map is most probably fucked.

If there is no func_ cs:s server running custom maps, I might be able to host something for us to playtest maps on. Might.

Comments are unwelcome, expected, probable, and will of course go ignored. 
404...looks like the link got mangled 
no I don't, you can tell because there's no sarcasm in what you linked, but IAWTP. 
I Was Bored... 
So I thought I would share this with you all...

The dazsp3 easter egg that no-one ever noticed despite an on-screen hint ;) 
Yeah Baby 
Should have been a news submission :P 
I Still Don't Understand This. 
Are Daz and Dranz the same person or not?!? 
Oh, And 
What about Drannerz? Or is that just another name for Dranz (and possibly Daz)? 
Ok, Here It Comes 
Daz / dazerz = me

Dranz / Drannerz = Chris Dransfield

We were both friends in school / college and got into mapping at around the same time and figured a joint site would be fun to do.

So yeah, we are different people :)

You just need to look at a dranz map to see I didn't make it :) 
hehe Daz, yes Dranz was a exclent mapper one of the best dm maps i ever saw in Quake!

does he still map? the guy had imaginacion and a lot of fingers to choose textures.

hope he get a job in the industry of gaming becouse he is really really good.

P.s.-> you rock to :) but in that stage that you both were mapping he was a few years ahead... 
Quake Towers 
Is one of the best Q2 maps ever made. 
Fuck Youfuck Youfuck Youfuck Youfuck Youfuck Youfuck Youfuck You 
south park websites are fucking shit they do not work fucsouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck youk you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they south park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck youdo not work south park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck youfucksouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck you you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they dsouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck youo not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck you 
Fuck Youfuck Youfuck Youfuck Youfuck Youfuck Youfuck Youfuck You 
south park websites are fucking shit they do not work fucsouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck youk you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they south park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck youdo not work south park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck youfucksouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck you you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they dsouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck youo not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck you 
Fuck Youfuck Youfuck Youfuck Youfuck Youfuck Youfuck Youfuck You 
south park websites are fucking shit they do not work fucsouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck youk you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they south park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck youdo not work south park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck youfucksouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck you you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they dsouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck youo not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck yousouth park websites are fucking shit they do not work fuck you lasy baterds fuck you 
Please Calm Down Czg. 
you're not running one, eh metslime ;)

Ah, the darkened trough of shit that is the internet. 
I like the fact they only capitalised the you in the title.

Good god damn and other such phrases... 
You Guys Need To Read Between The Lines 
it's really quite profound :} 
Should Have Been A News Submission Too. 
Not A News Submission 
Someone almost got killed in a fight by getting frozen lasy aigna to his head.

Italian beaches support blow-up churches because they are easy supported.
Everyone left the beach with a balloon god. 
I Want A Balloon God 
(me too) 
You've probably already seen this . . . 
the balloon was well textured
actually a text balloon. 
Fuck YES 
I rock.

I had this pretty cool room with nifty detailing that I had some real trouble editing due to seriously messy brushwork and it was a bit too small, so I remade the entire damn thing. Now its a breeze to edit and the new scale is exactly what was needed, took like 3 hours, but was totally worth it. 
Jago Discovers Mapping 
Ijed: he probably won't see your post though. haven't seen him since he took kinn personally and left in a huff. 
I Thought Warren Was Joking 
with the 'fuck this shit, I'm out of here' response, but like you said, he hasn't posted since then so either that was fo' real or he is on double secret crunch duty. 
If he's saved from the stony-face inducing tedium that masquerades as a "comic" in Penny Arcade, good for him. 
negke can you correct your current email? the one you got is not correct...

Trinca: Nice Shoes! 
The appron fits well, too. 
negke gime your fucking email or me and all Portuguese will invade Germany and make a lot of Portugermans kids!!!

your womens will love our great Portuguese cocks!!!

and pure blonde blue eyes will vanish from the face of the earth!!! 
Omg Nooo! 
It's in my profile. 
To be on the safe side, just don't click any links that I post. 
Will try to remember ;).

P.S. Where the hell is Portugal anyway?? 
Shambler the country that almost invade UK to bad the ships were comanded by Spanish :p or you english were talking PT/ES :) 
Jugando con fuego Trinca. 
Kinn? I thought I baited him into leaving?

I wouldn't demand credit but I'm trying to achieve a balance, currently it's people made to leave the 'community' in a sulk; 3, times I've 'quit' in an ott, unreasonable sulk; 4.

So... who can I insult today? ;) 
nonentity me!!! i said bad stuff of Spanish :) 
You quit every other week, that doesn't count (and is just too easy)

poor me :( nobody hates me... 
I Hate You Trinc 
RickyT23 fucking yeeeee

love and hate are connected!!! 
Kids, Learn From The Master Of Making People Quit 
ricky and trinca: get a fucking room you worthless wastes of space. it's not like either of you can map, so quit wasting our fucking time.

nonspire: kill yourself

Shambler: no one cares what you think anymore, you don't map and you don't stroke people's egos with your elitist reviews, piss off.

Madfox: you r4wk.

Kinn: besides fucking czg in the ass, what exactly do you even do?

Headthump: you know everyone ignores you, right?

Bal: I love u! <3 
Scampie loves Bal \o/ or Bal loves Scampie \o/

hummm i�m fucking confuse!!!

make maps not...

|_ __o
|\ |\ \

with one is who? 
Simon FitzPatrick 
and Patrick FitzSimon

Two irish mappers 
I quit. 
Did Someone Say Something... 
Ijed If You Quit I Will 
He'll never love you shrimp, he just steals all your chicken and runs away :(

Anyway, I thought you just kickbanned people from #tf to make them quit? 
I wish I knew how to quit you.

(Brokeback quote for added homoerotic effect.) 
Don't Know 
If I can acknowledge your post whilst maintaining my quitter status, Ricky. 
Somebody Please Change The Subject Now... 
I cant look anymore 
*eats Popcorn* 
|_ __o
|\ |\ \

with one is who?

Likely, Scampie moves in with Bal because he already has his shit packed. 
*MY EYES" !!! 
BTW, Scamps 
How can you speak for everyone when nobody like you? 
Everybody loves Bal :) 
'tis True 
I even hated myself a bit for using Bal in the example above, but otherwise it would not have worked. 
zommgggg these conversacion are so refreshing! roulf made me will to map!

later on girls!!! 
The Darker Side of the Quake Community

Certain web sites dedicated to providing information on Quake, have instead become id's and any other mod author's, bitch. As a result, the info on the site can no longer be trusted as accurate or unbiased. 
Anyone know how to make Ramshackle work?

I know the links were broken for a while, but you could still look in the source to find the correct URLs for the reviews. Now there's some strange holding page thing; 
Eh What? 
Who is that non-person and what are they prattling on about? 
Reaper bots I think, I read the entire thing and still didn't understand.

But they took their campaign against Steve Polge all the way to Blue's (and in fact there's a response from a young Willem in there).

I think this was suppressed as part of the Inside3D/mod community Omicron conspiracy, we must let the truth out! 
It's Whoever It Was 
who didnt get the job working on Unreal. I sense a real bitterness there.

Serously though - he goes on about people in the Quake community writing nice things about ID software like its a disgrace. Hello-O!!! Quake community!!! (moron) 
That proves the Inside3D crowd were elitist jerks too, just like Func. There goes your white vest, modders! 
when planetquake made every hosted site manually move themselves from to any site that wasn't actively maintained obviously didn't make the transition and thus effectively disappeared. Lots and lots of fantastic resources are gone now. 
nine years I had to screw my money to keep my internet account exposeable it has been beaten with the abandon-mod and cost me 35Mb on webspace.

finally I am released of this quest by being hosted by fileplanet, who has been kind to offer me space to dump this on the net. And don't blame fileplanet, you free share downloaders.

the same file I got screwed on when I entered this board on 2003 and now looking for my post New QUake Single Pack in the NewsBulletin it has got lost in the last server switch.

But nevermind, I'm still working on it with all changes like scripting, orb factory, storybook. Only my intention changed, I mean, uh let's stick together.. for a map or half.
Here it goes ... abandon ~ light ~on the rocks ~. 
Go To Bed Already 
Wasn't There... 
wasn't there at one point an "ultimate wad collection" somewhere? does that still exist? 
yeah, that's the one!

I keep up with things real well 
Ultimate twat collection. 
I can't resist the awesome implications of such an idea

...every classic asshole, every style of retard, every aspect of being unpleasant for whatever reason (design attitude).. all collected in one collection of jackasses... the most accurate and powerful collection in history of random gay assholeness 
Great Pic 
Speaking Of Newscientist 
That explains it. Secret experiments to give rodents control of computer systems. Codename; Madfox 
I'm waiting for the collectable card edition. 
Q1SP: Soul Of Evil: Indian Summer Released! 
Well, QEXPO may not be quite up and running just yet, but it's August 15th, so here it is:

Soul of Evil: Indian Summer (23 MB)

A custom engine is required - aguirReQuake or Darkplaces.

This is a standalone fantasy-themed Q1SP episode, with many new features programmed by Patrick Martin. It contains nonlinear gameplay, horde combat, and new and modified enemies with new and modified attacks, making it a big challenge. Major thanks to aguiRe, ijed, Trinca and Zwiffle.

Further information in the readme:


I'm also releasing packages of hires skins for SOE created by aguiRe: for the aguirReQuake version, is the Dark Places version.

Devkit will be released sometime during QEXPO. 
but why didn't you submit it as a news post? 
I dunno, figured some moderator would move it. 
It Has After All 
been three years since I had anything newsworthy to submit; I'm claiming the right to be dumb based on that.

PS: update at my site (, pretty much the same info/links as here. 
Interesting Talk By Jon Olick (a Programmer At Id)

He goes into some of the stuff they do to approach many-core parallelism, including some details about the infinite-geometry stuff Carmack has being waffling on about.

It's missing a lot of context and is pretty hard to follow, but interesting regardless. 
I couldn't message back to you, but that site, despite having part of my address name has no affiliation with me. It goes against my 'under the radar' belief system to have something out there like that. I don't recommend clicking on it, it looks like a Target marketing gimmick at best, or a depository of viruses at worst. 
Elderworld or Elder World? 
According To Quake 
Episode 4: The Elder World 
16MB Graphics Card 
I've asked a similar question before, but I never got an answer:

How can I get Fitzquake to run well on a 16mb graphics card?

- jengle 
According To Quake
Episode 4: The Elder World

it's ugly that way though, isn't it? :P~ 
blow me 
My God 
If you check the last 30 days of active peeps, Ricky has not been around. It doesn't seem that long. Where the hell is Ricky? 
My God 
Checking the log of all those who ever signed into the func_board, Ricky never existed! . Like he was the figment of my imagination or something. 
he changed his name to SadGitNerdFace. 
some ways to reduce memory usage in any engine:

- run in 16 bpp mode. This requires only half the texture memory that 32 bpp mode uses.

- set gl_max_size to e.g. 256 (this will only downsample the largest images, and leave the rest looking normal. Unfortunately, many monster skins and player skins would be among those affected.)

- set gl_picmip to 1 (or even 2, though that would be really blurry)

- run in a lower resolution (framebuffer takes up video memory)

Here are some fitzquake-specific things that might reduce texture thrashing:

- set gl_fullbrights to 0 (textures will still be loaded, but won't be used and therefore will stay out of video memory after the first thrash.)

- set r_oldwater to 1 (again, textures will be loaded, but then not used and therefore will get bumped out of memory permanently.) 
Downgrade Your OS ? 
I was being cheeky because Ricky didn't change the color of his (or, maybe, her) font. 
Like The New Color! 
I'm still heading my tumb which flic pimpt me on my luuny ran to IRC. 
Hexen II, Anyone? 
Have a look at this engine here - pretty good. 
all those changes combined made only a minimal difference; it's still *way* doggy. anything else i can do? 
It's also possible you are limited by heapsize, not video memory. A larger heap would prevent re-caching of models (this happens in cases where you are using close to 100% of the heap, and it constantly juggles models in and out of it)

does it run badly on any map, or just large or just single-player maps? 
I Found A Favorite Article 
Don't think I have ever posted this before, but if so, shoot me. If you have not had a good ten minute hate today, this one will surely fit the bill if you hate what comics devolved into during
the nineties as much as i do:

The 40 Worst Rob Liefeld Drawings 
Thanks for that. 
I Enjoyed The Read 
Even if I know less than most people about comics. I do like a good bit of vitriol though. 
Dear Scampie 
Play less Engineer. Seriously. It's mindboggling. Go play Soldier or something fun!

I do enjoy engineer (not as much as the stats might suggest), but I've banned myself from playing it for a while because it really is getting a bit silly looking at those stats, yes...

Simple and obvious explanation is that when you're on that class, you tend to stay on it, because your team is relying on your sentry, teleporters etc.

As for soldier being fun, well, he's easily one of my most effective classes, and it is fun, but I don't enjoy it as much as I should because a) it's so easy that it feels wrong and b) too slow (movement AND rocket speed, remember I'm a proper Quake fan).

If you really care the stats actually lie because they got partially reset at one point... all my medic, soldier and pyro time got reset to 0 (Pyro and Soldier were at 20-30 hours at the time).

p.s. I'm not alone: 
Play Heavy 
I crush many little men.

Can't decide what classes I prefer, changes alot, these days Pyro Spy and Heavy are my favorites, got bored of Soldier for the reasons Frib stated. 
Bal destroys cowards! 
Did You Know? 
Bomb cart will not push self!

I have to say, TF2 has been the most enjoyable online FPS game I've played since Q1. Going to map for it sometime, and kinda suprised no one else in our little community has. Only thing that holds me back is Worldcraft being the shitty editor it is. 
It's Lunaran's birthday!

Happy Birthday Lun! 
Yeah agreed, best multiplayer FPS in a long time for me.
I've tried making maps, I still plan on finishing one. czg has some maps too i bet, but he'll never finish them cause he hates us.
Zwiffle is working on one that looks off to a good start. 
Happy Birthday Lun 
Scampie: we need to hang out 
no you smell 
I Smell 
Like lilacs (my cologne.)

Just for you. 
For Those 
who do image editing: 
Very Nice! 
It runs poorly the second the game boots up. I'm using a computer with 512mb RAM and a 16mb graphics card. Even when all the main applications are closed, it's still *way* doggy. I don't know what to do. 
I've been making a TF2 map (though really only just playing around and getting used to the editor right now). It's better than I remember, to be honest (the editor...) mind you I haven't used it since the WorldCrash days. 
-heapsize 64000

In the commandline. 
Perhaps we can map-swap sometimes or somesuch. (TF2 maps I mean.) 
Yay! Send beta when it's playable. =)

btw, fuck yeah:
Finally a new TF2 map theme, and it looks really nice, that painted skybox looks gorgeous, I'll definitely try to make a map with this theme when the update is out. 
i guess when i get around to making my "sawmill" map, i wont have to do any texture work. Or maybe i don't need to make the map at all, now that the theme won't be fresh and revolutionary. 
I'll need help/testing when the time comes, but it'll be a long way off (too busy with work and playing TF2 :)

I actually just blocked out a few CP areas without much thought as to overall map layout or what style of map I wanted to make (since there's several variants of the CP thing).

To be honest, I was expecting Hammer to be crap and I figured I'd spit the dummy long before I finished any map. As much as it surprises me to acknowledge it though, the editor seems not only bearable but perhaps actually enjoyable to use (!) 
Anyone making any map for any game, make sure you finish it before Diablo 3 comes out... 
I'm Not Worried About D3 
I'm worried about Warhammer Online. Been downloading for about 12 hours now, 10 minutes left to go on the preload. Woot! 
FarCry 2 Map Editor Preview

Take a look. Paint your map. The narrator sounds like Atlas from Bioshock. 
[Kona] Needs Quake Textures 
For the first time in 6-7 years, [Kona] has loaded up Worldcraft. "Looks pretty basic, I'll get the hang of it pretty quick again," said the prolific and legendary map author shortly after his return to the community.

He has expressed interest in doing something metal or gothic, "like Autumn Haunting, only bigger and more epic." He's currently taking submissions of "awesome" Quake texture sets to base the map on.

He's also redesigned his website, now hosted at after Telefragged/Atomic Gamer shut down his old site for hosting porn.

[Editor's note: rejected as news, but this would make an awesome discussion thread] 
Re: [Kona] Needs Quake Textures 
Legendary mapper unzips fly; Mapping community opens collective mouths to suckle. 
I like that fact it was posted with the flame icon. Also, kekeke Lun 
Rejected As News 
Try knitting work for your destructive boredom issues. 
congrats on that spacehulk prize, that looks awesome! 
Well Happy 
Just a shame there weren't more maps I spose. archive update once again: 
COD4 Is Really Cool. 
It's even got Jack Bauer in it! Well, his voice anyways. 
Yeah....... :) 
Whos Jack Bower? 
I Mean Bauer 
He's The Guy Whose Negligence 
got Shelbyville nuked in the cliffhanger finale of the '07 season of the Simpsons. Funny they have never addressed this in the '07-'08 season. I mean, your neighboring city is nuked, that's huuuuge! 
Which Character In Cod4 Does He Voice? 
Shelbyville got an option other than 4? 
Thinking About It 
there are some episodes of the 07-08 season that I did not see. Perhaps, in one of those it was explained that Shelbyville was decimated by the wrath of God for being a town of cousin humpers. 
Since no one has given a straight answer, and though mine my help if you have seen that episode, I'll fill in. Bauer is the dude on 24 who knows judo and who likes to pistol whip suspected terrorist. I followed it for a half of a season some years back and found the plot to be springing far too many inexplicable holes for me to bother finishing the season.

Speaking of leaky plots, to the dude who e-mailed about it, I'm aware that The Simpsons has very little actual continuity. That was the point of my jibe ;) 
I Remember 
The Futurama What-if? machine was pretty good, just an excuse to throw a load of random storylines together.

Bender becoming human was great.

"You watched it; you can't un-watch it" 
I Know Judo 
found the plot to be springing far too many inexplicable holes for me to bother

junk food for the brain. dont like "soaps". 
I Played Through LunSP1 Tonight 
so ... apparently I'm kind of a dick.

Promise I'll try not to be that evil in Lunsp2. 
junk food for the brain

And have you seen what junk food for the stomach does to your gut?

btw, Generation Kill pwns (obviously) 
The only bad bit was the boss fight.

It was still a clever idea, but a pain in the balls to play.

The rest of the level is great; good evil. 
D2SP: Thunderpeak 
Another very nice, detailed 2-map pack for ZDoom in atmospheric base style. Has exporational bits and a few new monsters including Cyberbarons.

I ran out of ammo at one point and had to axe some grunts to death and scavenge their shells.

The red enforcer shield mechanic is really not very clear. I remembered how it worked, but also discovered how useless it is hammering at them with the DBS. Something similar to the Zer shield that makes use of quake's "red particles = hurting"/"grey particles = not hurting" thing would have been much more intuitive.

There were a couple points where I sensed ambushes, half because they were obvious and half because I vaguely remembered setting them up three years ago. Some of those ambushes instilled in me a prescient irritation.

And I had trouble figuring out my own boss. :P 
btw, Generation Kill pwns (obviously)

I've admire David Simon's work since he wrote Homicide. His technical thoroughness puts the discipline of sociology to shame. 
Lun got pwned by his own map. Ace!

Negke, those look good - very Quake quality architecture.

Can someone explain Z-Doom to me?? I need to buy Doom, then install Z-Doom, then I can play with mouse / keyboard / remappable keys etc etc?? 
Shielding Monsters 
Is still something I'm not sure about. The Quoth Deathlord works ok, but I'm not sure how much gameplay 'worth' he'd lose without the shield.

Those red enforcer captains in lunsp1 were only killable with nails, really, since they didn't switch to a close combat attack when the player got close (like a deathknight) so their spread attack multiplied in danger when getting close.

The only really irritating ambush I remember is the vore at the top of the lift - basically forcing the player to snipt its bounding box from below and wear down its health - seemed drawn out.

The main problem for me with the boss is that he leads me when aiming on skill 3, turning the battle into a quicksave spamming session.

But these problems were completely outweighed by the amount of cool stuff in there.

Looking forward to sp2. 
Yes, it works pretty much like with Quake engine ports. You can even drag&drop pwads onto zdoom.exe if you don't want to mess around with a command line. Controls, appearance etc can be configured from the menu.

If you like those, give KDIZD a try. 
The megaenforcer shield has always been broken, somtimes on / off aside from the visual fx.

And it was only ever an annoyance, for me at least. 
I loved your map, but I havent managed to complete it yet!! :P

But this means that I will play it again!
It is very immersive, and massive, and tense. There are cool bits where you are running round a "circuit" through different rooms, with guys shooting at you across water, the player just running around and returning fire as they go, around and around until threats were cleared 
The Vore 
I was going to mention that too. Caught me totally off guard, but there's ways to kill vores without hiding, namely, run around like a madman and let the voreballs queue up behind you, then shake them later.

Vores really aren't used very well in maps, since usually the designer just throws them in solo in places where the player can easy just snipe from around corners. Since they almost always achieve priority-one status in any combat they show up in because of their lethality and how much attention they require, they're best when there's fiends and knights chasing you about, invalidating cover spots and making you deal with the vore in the less convenient and more dangerous but still possible to avoid all damage way. 
Shields Etc. 
Zer mega-enforcer was cool, always liked the shield idea on that, possibly the best "nu-gameplay" thing in Quake until Quoth's flying snot things came along. 
i thought they were a cool concept, but none of the mods that use it seemed to do a great job of communicating exactly when the shield is up vs. down, and whether I can do partial damage or no damage when the shield is up. I end up just shooting at the enemies continuously until they die.

Some better audiovisual presentation, plus maybe more time between raising and lowering events (so it doesn't seem to just randomly turn on/off) would help. 
The Shield Comes Down When They Fire 
you know, like romulans. 
Never thought of AvP soundtrack as an alternative Quake score. Gotta try it. Thanks for the advice, Lun! 
My Tip 
tracks 2-10: pants for quake
tracks 11-15: awesome for quake 
is there some link you could post with all the info on doom engines and new doom wads?
What are some of the best wads? I've never played any non id maps, other than that one qboard thing. 
Best Site For The Game I'm Aware Of --

There is a great review site I have in mind, I'll get back with you when I find it again :) 

My only problem with playing Doom and Doom II is a sense of nausea I get after playing for a while. Not an aesthetic criticism!, but a real headache/nausea feeling. I have an eye stigma condition that is probably the source of the problem. Anyway . . . there you go! 
Doom Makes Me Nauseous 
after a while as well. So did Hexen/Dark Forces/Duke3D/etc so I always just put it down to the partial 3D. 
congrats Lunaran on Post #15,000 
Hey Sweet 
and I used the words "quake", "awesome", and "pants" for it 
Found This Little Program Handy... 
If you have ever had folders/files in windows that you could not delete because they were protected somehow (example : a windows vista installation that you don't use any more) then this little freeware app can help you out. 
Ty Sir! 
handy little gadget! :) 
With the questions concerning Doom popping up, I was looking for some older levels that enjoyed in the day. Could this be you? 
"Yes, I'm Watching Anime" 
- sean 'scampie' campbell, august 26th, 2008, 1:54 pm cst 
Bal's Fault No Doubt 
I was just reading this stuff about the Nephilim. Whoah!!! I have never read about this before....

Anybody got any interesting links or books to recommend on the subject?

Metl? - Antediluvian? 
I was just reading this stuff about the Nephilim. Whoah!!! I have never read about this before....

Anybody got any interesting links or books to recommend on the subject?

Metl? - Antediluvian? 
It's interesting reading. I've got a scrap for a map called Nephilim based on Vondur's Koohoo textures that I threw together after trawling through all that stuff.

Warp happened instead, although the C�chulainn reference got lost and distorted. 
Someone please send me tronsp1, I managed to lose it. 
Doomworld is your site, as HeadThump mentioned.

Here is a list of available engine ports: - might not be up-to-date, though.
I'd say casual players can't go wrong with ZDoom as it runs just about everything. It also has a GL variant. Many people also play with prBoom.
There are also eye-candy engines, some even with 3D models, like jDoom.

For levels, browse their idgames mirror (ratings)
Doomworld more or less regularly posts reviews of newly uploaded maps. However, sometimes they are very biased and unfair, sometimes even outrageously so, and partly lacking screenshots. 
In My Defense 
I was watching The Melancholy of Haruhi Suzumiya, which is actually quite decent as far as anime goes.

DANCE! Weeeee 
Scampie is merely steps away from enjoying tentacle loli porn like the rest of us.

(By us I mean Bal.) 
I Have 
er.. Oorotsuckidojo 1 and 2 on dvd. A freind, er, lent it to me :) 
Ricky likes tenticle porn!

(it's Urotsukidoji) 
The Jungle Was Always Nice Then Came Guu 
love love tropicana 
Are you really 24? I assumed your were older for some strange reason.... :P 
I notice that there is a #qexpo channel open, right? So what does that mean? Is it just a live chat thingy for bored Quake fans with too much time on their hands (ie me)?
I got onto this Java thing after persueing it through google, and could see the names of loads of people at the right side of the screen, but didn't know what to do...

Does that just mean that there was nobody on it at that time?

most people assume that, yeah

the best part is I look 12 
Fuck Man 
Im less than half a year younger....

It's The Bitterness That Makes Lun Seem Older. 
Ricky: you type stuff. Ideally obscenities and insults. It's also popular to post links to the nearest available disgusting obnoxiousness the internet has to offer, especially if the URLs or filesnames make it seem harmless. 
channel: #qexpo
This is a great free program for it: 
you're 11 1/2? 
No I *look* Fucking 35! 
I am 24.
I smoke continuously and binge drink often. i.e Im English. It's great but it doesn't do much for my complexion :D

I feel I will have to post proof that I own a copy of, er, the legend of the overfeind/demon womb....

Then you can all marvel at my fantastic complexion. :D 
I'm English... 
And I disown Ricky and his ilk. 
SO Your'e Tee-total 
you never watch manga necro-porn (:?)
and you have skin like, er, Kelly, er, the one who went out with Jason Statham. 
Love Those Interviews 
keep them coming 
DeFrag Lives 
'ello ppls. I hope everyone is doing great.

Its been like 2 years since I played Quake in any form *ack*. I miss it terribly but my custom server finally went tits up. MAME & my music gear has held me over. Anyway, just poppin' in to see who else is still around. L8rs 
DeFrag go play the levels you missed... or vanish forever!!! 
Action Doom 2 - Urban Brawl

Nice, a stand-alone comic beat-em-up game based on the Doom engine. Has a Frank Miller-like story, multiple paths and endings and numerous insider jokes. 
DeFrag! How's it going mate? :D 
Man, Where I Can Watch Manga Necro-porn? 
also i prefer jason woorhees

btw (the great doom site) 600 
And Here:

but if you really want to see it in its full glory I would invest...... 
may i suggest you 
Aeon Flux 
Hey Frib! 
Doing fair mate. I have tons of questions but should probably just read 2 years of posts 1st. What's major in the last couple years? Q1 still strong? Peej alright? School, work, got kids? Its surprising that Tigger-On is still doin' LvL. 
Hey Frib! 
Doing fair mate. I have tons of questions but should probably just read 2 years of posts 1st. What's major in the last couple years? Q1 still strong? Peej alright? School, work, got kids? Its surprising that Tigger-On is still doin' LvL. 
dont read 2yrs worth of posts, especially in GA, it'll probably make you not want to come back at all :)

lots of quake stuff still happening, not so much on the q2 scene. 
Hi nitin, nice to see you're still around.

Anyone seen Zan? Tell him his mother is looking for him! HAR 
QuArK Pipe 
What's The Difference Between A Quark Pipe 
and a crack pipe? 
It's a good way to make a pipe. Only when the thing goes hollow, chance is high it will produce hom's.
Have you seen that curv-entity map?
It has a large sphere, divided in small parts,from which you can easily make good pipe conduits. 
Good to see you're still kicking around, buddy =D 
You'll never find a Quark pipe in czg's apartment 
My main man.. Howza goza?
You still mappin'? For what Q1, 2, 3? 
Here lately it's been HL2 SP and DM maps, and COD4 (Call of Duty 4, which uses something not unlike the Q3 engine) single-player. I've got a couple of Quake maps in the mix, too, although I haven't been back at them for a while. 
How's CoD4 mapping? 
Actually, have just slapped together some patches and stuff in the editor, haven't even tried compiling as of yet. May have more by this weekend, since SOMEONE ELSE has been trying to quick and dirty stuff, and I want to, too ;D 
Have To Share This 
it's on a desk in our office but it needs to be pointed out to the world

not a single title on that cover that doesn't have a number after it. 
A Common Occurrence 
I just do not fucking understand some things in life. This is one of them: 

now I know what to get my dad for christmas :P 
Odd Question: 
did i ever release chapter_necros2? o.o 
2 New Reviews 
thanks for the kind words, btw :) 
Heck man thanks for the maps! 
BJP Vis And Light For Linux 
I took the liberty of porting them.

I'm porting treeqbsp, too, but there are some ... problems.

Now Inertia 
build that supercomputer so you can vis our maps for us. And build a web interface for uploading and downloading the bsp:s.

Didn't Willem or someone already enable multithreading? Don't remember.

GB: You're golden. 
I don't think bjp's vis is threading.

But since we have

a) the source, compiling on *nix
b) people like Lord Havoc and Willem

we might have something like this eventually.

Full source goes up at qexpo tonight or tomorrow. I hope some of the people from 2) or similar get hacking on this soon. (qbsp doesn't compile yet, read PORTING in the source once it is up.)

Bambuz: Thanks. 
Re: #15072 
someone should make a distributed vis app that everyone runs on their computer (like the SETI@home thing) so every mapper can help vis a small bit of whatever map is in the queue.

Even retired mappers, and wanna-bes, and hangers-on can contribute! You can later brag "i vised that really awesome room with the pillars in that really awesome map everyone likes."

Or you could be the one that vised that dull corridor with the unfair trap. It's unpredictable! 
Quake on Steam -- was it always this cheap? Quake 1,2,3 and their mission packs for $15: 
I Got Quake 
on Steam, just so that I can access it from anywhere in the world.

It's quite handy, but the one downside is that you still need a CD for the music. 
Source Available 
bjptools for Linux here:

please read Changelog and PORTING.

If you can help porting qbsp, contact me.

This Weekend On Steam 
Straight from Steam:

"This weekend only, id Software games are 50% off. This includes the id Super Pack for only $34.99 (over $200 worth of games). Or take 50% off individual titles such as Doom, Quake, Wolfenstein, Commander Keen, Heretic, and Hexen. Offer ends Monday, September 8." 
I took the id Super Pack, just to make up for the 1 or 2 games I never actually paid (probably heretic and hexen or something). It's really too bad Quake 4 isn't in it, but hey, that's not really an id game. 
... really did go down the tubes, didn't it? 
Nice, but please (also) port TxQbsp as it's slightly superior to TreeQbsp. 
OK, I included txqbsp. Coolness, this includes even more Windows-specific functions. :-( don't expect it tomorrow. 
What exactly does it do better than Treeqbsp?

It seems too hard for me to port because of (insert a number of weird things here). I mean, in Tree I can at least pinpoint the problem :-P 
AguirRe's Tools For Linux 
A full set of AguirRe's compilers has been ported to Linux. Treeqbsp, vis and light compile and work as they should.

TXqbsp and bspinfo have been included and added to the Makefile, but do not compile yet. If anybody feels particularly brave and wants to help porting them, be my guest.

The next milestone will be to add multithreading to vis and light, following Willem's code.

The tools are open source and the working ones are released under the GPL, in accordance with id Software's re-release under said license.


Anybody Gonna Do It For Win32? 
I mean vis and light? :) 
The Multi-threaded Vis 
that willem did for mac, does anyone know where it is and which vis it's based off of? i'd use if it it was like aguire's vis that had the save feature and the verbose output 
It's included for reference in the latest bjptools, but is going to be removed by the next release.

It is apparently based on id vis (or perhaps rvis.) It's not based on Bengt's since that doesn't compile on Mac. Or didn't, I don't have a Mac so I can't test. But I removed all Windows specific stuff.

But I think I removed the _Macosx folder, so...

He linked it from the RMX pack thread, if that is any help. 
thanks for the link, gb. the vis is of limited utility to me however, without some kind of save feature. i can't believe how useful that thing is. after having it all these years, i'd never dream of vising anything without it. o.o

still, it'll be handy if my mac ever has some down time and i have a vis process in the queue. :P 
I would be inclined to make the Linux version of visbjp compile and run on a Mac, after the threading feature is added. We'll have both then - saving and threading, ideally on Linux, *BSD and Mac.

I'd need someone with a Mac and a compiler, though...

Can I contact you for testing (and possibly compiling)? It's only 50K or something, and compiling is fast. 
but i don't really understand much of how this kind of thing works on mac. :P i hear a lot of talk about getting this stuff to compile... i'm just used to easy windows where i get a program and it's already compiled. :P

i only use the mac for very few, very specific tasks, so my general knowledge of the OS is pretty limited. 
Nobody Wants To Make One For Us Windows Gaylords?!? 
Rickyt23 sent u a very important mail :) at least to me :) 
check your mail! :) 
make what? There already is a compiled Aquirre's vis for gaylords. I think you could quite easily compile that linux one on windows too.

Btw what are people's experiences of single core vs dual core vs quad core processors? Any help when doing some demanding work (what demanding work do you do?) 
This maight be hard for you to understand, but I'll try it anyway:

I dont have the slightest idea how to do that.

As for processors:

I have experience with dual cores, core2s, P4s, an Athlon 64 and a Phenom 64 (Quad Core).

I would say that the P4 (3.2Ghz) and the Athlon 64 (1.7), the P4 pisses all over the Athlon, and I use it on my admin PC, with 6+ spreadshoots and Sage Accounting software simnultaniously, and never have and slowdown at all!!! The PC is rarely used for anything else, but its "old" now.

Dual Core vs Core2Duo:

Both Intel, the Dual core is older, 2.3Ghz, the Core2Duo is a newer model, the 6750, clocked at 2.66Ghz (no overclocking done on any of my processors btw.)

The Core2Duo is REALLY REALLY GOOD!!! :) :) :) And pretty cheap now also! I use it for gaming, and with the exception of Crysis (which does<>30 fps on "very high" 1280x1024) all games are on max settings and resolution at 60hz. That's with a GTS 88000 512Mb, 800MhzDDR2 2Gb. And whilst playing Crysis at 30hz I am often running other stuff behind it, internet, WC, browsers etc. Norton virus scanning maybe. And there is very little ussues with slowdown. As long as I keep the disk defragged.

The Dual Core I do see slowdown, and games run slower, I dont feel its anywhere neer as good. I mean the graphics card isn't as good either, but when when just running internet browsers and emails it can slow down a bit. But its not TOO bad I guess....

The Phenom Quad Core runs about the same as the Core2Duo. If not slower. But that machine has Vista32 and 4GbRAM. Still very little slowdown, I actually think that the 2 cores in the Core2Duo 6750 2.66Ghz do a much better overall job than the QuadCore Phenom64 @2.3Ghz, by a fairly large margin.

Intel processors have bigger caches than Athlons. This is why they are faster. My Core2 has 4Mb, but the newer Core2s (the 8200-8500s) have 6Mb. And the crazy Quad Core Intels have more than that (but you pay for them). The Q6600 is a 4Mb cache slightly older Intel, @2.4Ghz with 4 cores, and it has a reputation for being VERY cost effective, although for the same money you could maybe get a 6Mb Core2Duo at 3Ghz+ (8500s) and I bet that would feel faster :) but if you have $5-600+ (US) I would go for an expensive Core2Xtreme thingy from Intel with 4 cores and 12Mb cache + :D

Don't bother with Athlon, they are slower. 
I Mean AMD - IMHO AMD Is Less Fast Than Intel. 
I dont have the slightest idea how to do that.

Ricky, you don't have to do anything - aguirRe's tools are already compiled for windows. They're talking about porting them over to linux. 
Well, They're Compiled For DOS 
but, yeah, ricky, the reason you've already compiled and released maps is because the compilers already work in your OS :) 
You Guys Are Mis-understanding Me, Or... 
...I'm mis-understanding everything!

Originally I think Necros was talking about Willems fantastic Multi-Threaded Vis, which so far cant be done in Windows. Boo-hoo for me. And anyone else who has Windows and want's to use their processor to its full potential, and half those vis times.

I love Aguires vis, its possibly one of the most influential tools of all time! Think of all the maps we never would have seen because vis wouldn't take the brushowrk :P

I need to be carefull saying that, because the maps are obviously sub-standard if only AguirRe's tools will work on them.....

I assume you mean you want the multithreading for the Windows version.

Since atm we have two versions, one of which is Windows-specific, you should perhaps ask AguirRe for it.

In the meantime, someone could take Willem's vis and try compiling it on Windows, and then we will at least know if it works.

If it does work, a future multithreading *NIX version could theoretically be compiled for Windows (and Mac), and then we'll all be happy.

I hope. 
Aguire? Metl? Lunaran? Preach? (if I tried to make a list of all of the people who might know where to start, I'd be here all night...)

I dont know anything about how to do it :( 
Someone Not Me 
I dont know anything about how to do it :(

Same here. I don't even have Windows.

Btw I didn't learn this stuff at college, either. You might google for "compile" and "Windows". I'm pretty sure there are free C compilers for that. Install one and RTFM. The principle isn't that hard to grasp. And YOU do have Windows :) 
Normally it is the other way around - Windows people tell that to us. 
Paddydm1 - Crazy Shenanigans 
Hey, was just wondering if anyone had a copy of, or link to, a Q1 map that I made ages ago called paddydm1.bsp - crazy shenanigans. HD that it was on failed, and I wouldn't mind having a look at it again.

email - sjoh079

Much appreciated. 
No Matter... 
I found it on the MPQ archives, awesome! 
Who all wants to discuss the LHC??? 
It's Been 
so fucking stupidly portrayed in the US news media it's beyond belief. 
haven't actually seen anything about it in the news, have to go to like BBC or other websites to get any useful, new or interesting info on it. I myself am not really worried about the world ending, I just wanna see what cool physics stuff comes out of it. 
A bunch of bible-thumpers would prefer if we still ate our meat raw and lived in caves. </shrug>

Expanding particle physics is the normal progression of technology.

And I for one will be happy to be called up as a soldier when it rips open an inter-dimensional portal to the nether realms and releases horrors beyond the imaginings of mankind ready to devour the human race. 
lay off the caffeine dude 
Then I'll never finish it all. 
Zwiffle, I bet you know all about Large Hardon Colliders. 
u clever boy

Yes I do, btw. 
Ive Got A Large Hardon..... 
Wannacome back to my place for some experiments? 
damn near killed her! 
Also Ricky, You're Way Too Late: 
Its Never Too Late For A Good Hadron. 

Cases Of Large Hardon Collision 
Zwiffle meets Scampie.
Czg meets Vondur.
What else?
Biff meets Roy Bee? (In a dream.) 
A kung-fu panda meets bambuz 
bambuz meets ip failure 
cern meets succes 
If At First You Don't Succeed 
keep on suckin til you do succeed 
That is just asking for the typical "yo mamma says..." retort. 
Isn't that some song lyric from somewhere? Its really pissing me off :) 
Multithreaded Vis 
The problem with moving Willem's code from mac to Windows is that Mac Windows and Linux all do threading a bit differently. So you can't just copy it over and compile... I was looking at the code awhile back but got swamped with Real Life � stuff and haven't been able to look at it again...

cygwin (with GCC) or minGW could be used to compile on windows I'm not sure what threading libraries come with them. 
Has The Large Hadron Collider Destroyed The World Yet? 
lol at it's source 
pthreads is available for mingw 
See Similar 
HTLHCDTWY doesn't have an RSS feed. 
Biff Meets Roy Bee? 
I am Roy Bee. 
But Do You Know Roy G. Biv? 
I Have A Penis 
I have a penis 
A walking penis that HAS a penis?

That's just stupid.

P.S. Hi czg. 
Press The 
funk button 
More LHC Stuff 
Black hole generation: cool :P 
CERN Should 
find a way to begin every press release over the next coming year with the word, 'whoops'. 
Indeed... it would be funny to see something like things: "Whoops, we unfortunately switched on the ring accelarator, but the excepected result was not there... however, we were very lucky, and we are glad to announce officially that we discovered the chthon-onh...etc.. etc..." 
End every announcement with 'Psyche!" 
What Do The Tech Guys Say To 
Brightness and spectrum not matching anything known, flaring up where it wasn't seen before and then dying again ...

A chance impact of two non-luminous bodies? Erroneous burp from a mostly dead star?

If it begins to flare cyclically then maybe it's a spinning and very shiny one of these: 
Im in South Africa at the moment, broke the little finger of my left hand, so I cant play guitar..... :(

Back on Oct 7th (hopefully) :(

Anyhoo CYA, Loveya, etc, etc, etc, ra ra ra ... x 
...on Quake series, Rage series, and narrative: 
broke the little finger of my left hand, so I cant play guitar..... :(

Set that pinky with some tape and a stick and do it like Django. 

...on Quake series, Rage series, and narrative:

No wonder Id have never managed to pull off a decent narrative. Willits seemed to completely glaze over the fact that one of the most important things for a compelling storyline is meaningful interaction between multiple characters. Personally I don't think a Game will EVER do that as well as a novel or movie so developers should stop harping on about wanting to create a narrative masterpiece and actually concentrate on bringing us awesome gameplay. YEH. 
No wonder Id have never managed to pull off a decent narrative. [...cut...] Personally I don't think a Game will EVER do that as well as a novel or movie so developers should stop harping on about wanting to create a narrative masterpiece and actually concentrate on bringing us awesome gameplay. YEH.

Storyline and Gameplay is a false division in the interactive arts.

But the problem, and heart of the issue, is not that there are bad writers of games(though, honestly there are) or that somehow games cannot create meaningful interactions, but that the games industry as a whole has approached the problem in the wrong way and have only accidentally stumbled upon the solutions here and there. Even games championed for their 'story' are limited in their abilities to truely comb the depths that interactive narratives truely have. 'Storytelling' is wrong, 'Storycreation' is what games are about.

Games are, fundimentally, all about the player's entertainment. My belief is that the entertainment derived from gaming is fundimentally linked to narrative and story... it's just that the story is your own and you're experiancing it.

"I jumped into a pit and died."
"I 0wned this n00b with a headshot."
"I stole a car and ran down 3 hookers and then the cops caught me."
"I misplaced the L shaped block, so now I can't get a tetris"

The trick is making these minor stories somehow build and climax in a way that is natural and player driven. Half-Life 2, for instance, you naturally move from point to point along a story, and it feels very much like it is driven by the player. Things are reacting to you, or you stumble upon something, or a door blocks your path and you find the hatch on top of the building to sneak in. The few points of the game that jarred me was when it seemed I was given little choice but to follow the wishes and commands of the NPCs to head toward the next point of the story laid out for me. Let me find my own story! I never tell my buddies about how Gordan Freeman went to Xen... I talk about how I killed a helicopter with an RPG standing on a cliff.

Stories are made of choices of the protaganist, and his reactions to the antagonist. In games, the protaganist is the player, and the antagonist(s) are what the game throws at him.

All these minor stories, parts of the larger epic of your own gameplay experiance, are what are important in a game, and it feels like most 'story' games miss this point by attempting to force you to conform to 'their story'. RPGs such as Fallout or Obivion have generally let you take the minor stories and encounters you face, building them into that large epic.

[...paste!...]Willits seemed to completely glaze over the fact that one of the most important things for a compelling storyline is meaningful interaction between multiple characters.[/...paste!...]

This is true. We do need better characters to interact with, and be part of our story. It's sad that the Companion Cube is the best NPC character in a video game for a long time, though many RPGs do have some good ones. I think a key element missing here is that most NPCs don't do anything beside 'assist' the player, but don't have a goals or motives of their own. They don't appear to be 'playing' their own story out. Sidekicks are generally decent, but again break the illusion when they die and either it's planned by the game, and again not 'your story', or it's game over, which just sucks. 
Scampie Has It... 
People don't tell their friends the next day about the canned storyline they sat and watched, or the narrowly-scripted combat encounter they were led through, they tell their friends about the spontaneous events that THEY made happen. 
My God. 
Is that really Scampie speaking??

*falls over with shock*

Good post BTW 
What really needs to be explored is the thoughts/feelings resulting from when the player acts instead of just filling in a hole in a finished story. 
what they should really do, is make an action game that's not-entirely-linear, with varied gameplay, for COOP. That way, you play with a few friends and plan (or not) how you play, leading to complex circumstances/interactions. Good AI would also help, if the game's supposed to be setting up interesting stories as opposed to simply arcade-type action.

By not-entirely-linear, I don't mean like MMORPGs or anything like that - I mean like Far Cry, (where there was really only 1 or 2 effective routes at any given time) except less linear (let the player decide to use vehicles or gameplay options for himself more often). 
I'm not just a pretty face you know. 
People don't tell their friends the next day about the canned storyline they sat and watched, or the narrowly-scripted combat encounter they were led through, they tell their friends about the spontaneous events that THEY made happen.

...or at least, you reasonably feel you made happen. The end of Portal is a great example here, though you don't tell your friends about it, it still felt special to you personally. 
I think one of the things that makes Portal work like that is the escape sequence. You have to make the decision to break out yourself, even though that's really what the designers intend you to do. 
...and then you realised that a) everyone else loved GLaDoS too and b) that GLaDos is an old lady. Brrr, so dirty.

HL2 was too scripted for me, I felt pushed from sequence to sequence all the time. Damn mapping!

Cave Story had a perfectly introduced story in my opinion. No long boring intro sequences with too much information to remember.

But then I think that games to not need to have a story at all. At least certain genres can do very well without. 
You spelled 'fundamentally' wrong. Your post is null and void. 
Cough Cough 
You spelled 'fundamentally' wrong.

What Scampie Says 
... dovetails with Warren Spector's prime directive of game storytelling: what makes games special is that the dialog can go both ways. They don't always have to do that (see games like hl2 or cod4) but the areas where they do (deus ex) is where the fertile ground truly lies.

So what do we all see in Quake, then? :P 
Monsters Are Pretty Rad, Dude. 
You Don't Need Dialog 
for story telling. 
What Sounds Cooler? 
being able to slow monsters down to a crawl or teleporting a few meters in front of you (through monsters)? 
teleport sounds best for me 
A Gun That Teleports You To Where You Click 
but you can only click on monsters. puzzles are about how to get out of a map without running out of monsters to telefrag in the right places. 
...a great idea. 
the gore fountain at each telefrag would be fun too... 
sounds like Redline (c) 1998 with up-to-date graphics, can't wait !!1 
Other Ideas 
- telefragging scrags in hard-to-reach places
- luring fiends into making leaps across gaps you can't leap yourself 
A Friend Of Mine 
made a mod like this, where one of the weapons switched your position with that of any monster you hit - pretty awesome, you could make monsters fall in lava and stuff. Your gameplay ideas take the concept a lot further though. 
Hey, Nice.... 
that is pretty sweet, especially if you have to telefrag a patrolling monster at a certain point on his path, and of course if he sees you he won't keep following the path... treating scraggs like a misc_teleporttrain basically. 
Was kind of done in the Wheel of Time gamef : there was a switch spell, was needed to get to certain areas during the single player game, or during mp, you could jump in a lava pit and quickly switch with an enemy, or also switch when you had multiple homing spells following you, thus they would follow your enemy instead. Was a very nice game mechanic. 
Cool, Someone Else Can Make It 


How is it pronounced? Does it rhyme with "lasagna"? 
I Can Never Find This Stuff When I Need It... :P 
can someone give me the hard limits for q1 models? #verts, #faces, #edges?, anything else? 
I noticed some discussion about DZIP in Willem's map release and felt the need to rant, but as I haven't gotten round to playing the map yet I figured it would be rude to do so in that thread.

Why does everybody bother with DZIP? The advantage over more commonly used compression programs is pretty minimal in this day and age [with super fast internet connections and huge hard disks] so it bothers me that people bother to install DZIP at all, especially as it doesn't work on macs or 64x versions of Windows [at least, without reporting a nasty virus in the latter].

Seriously, what's the point? Is it not making an already nich� community even more inaccessible? 
I don't watch any demos anymore because I refuse to download and install the absolutely worthless DZip. 
CZG's Curves Tutorial 
Does anybody have this damn thing mirrored anywhere? czg is pretty shit about keeping websites running (or caring about the people that read them more likely) and I hate having to spend twenty minutes grepping the internet every time someone in #tf wants to make a circle.

I made this in the meantime for pocket reference. 
I Feel Self-conscious 
about uploading 12 MB of worthless first-play demos. I feel a little less self-conscious uploading 1 MB of worthless first-play demos. If I had known you couldn't open .dz files, Text_Fish, I would have provided .zip archives before.

I shall keep the lack of portability of .dz files in mind in the future. 
Dzip Has Only Been Around For Like 10 Years Or Something 
So I think it's a bit hard for it to suddenly be making the community more inaccessible (and it also works on a mac, though command line only).

I agree it's probably a bit pointless in this day and age. 
#15180 Also Also 
What wrong with that way of building stairs Lunaran? As far as I'm aware that's the only way to build spirals that have equidistant steps units. 
mwh - nearly as long as quake. I respect what they do, but don't find it useful. Those who play Q1SP but don't know how to manage the formats basically don't exist. Much.

Lunaran - :| but no. Why is lunsp3 takign so long?

kat - that's probably the worst way of building stairs, trust me on this. Off-grid horrors that will compile, but never how you want. You'll be looking at brushes all over the place that you can't fix in the editor.

dzip is a waste of time for me. It makes things easier in alot of engines, but I prefer to pack dems in 7zip because I'm a cunt. And the filesize is smaller.

Posting drunk after a national holiday. That's not an apology. 
@ ijed: Ah, sounds like your talking about that in relation to *structual* brushwork which it will feck up. I've never had any issues so long as its *detail* flagged which things like that should be for Q3 editing. And "trust me", I know about non-axial brushwork, floating point errors and sparklies thereof ;) 
Hah, that tutorial is brilliant. 
Oh The Writer Actually Responded 
So I'll post a more constructive reply.

Yeah what ijed said, even if you make it detail, it's far from being optimal and will be cut up pretty randomly and in some engines you have no detail brushes (like quake1) so can't get away with such sloppy brushwork.

For spiral staircases, try starting out with a cylinder with a specific ammount of sides (usually something logical, divisble by 4), snap those sides to the grid, then align brushes along it to create your steps (you can use a second smaller cylinder with the same ammount of sides as a central wall too for larger stairs). Edge edit is your friend. 
Rip Dzip 
ZIP would be my preference.

czg's curves are here: 
Eyeballing edge manipulations like that to use as a 'template' has it's own inherant problems especially when using cylinders with more then a dozen or so sides. If you want steps to be *exact* then you have to duplicate and rotate by calculated values. 
"(and it also works on a mac, though command line only). "

It actually doesn't. It's a classic application (aka OS9) and modern Macs won't run it.

I'd love it if we could start using regular ZIP. The demos that guys delivered for Evil Exhumed in ZIP form were awesome and compressed just as well. 
If you work with a small enough grid the steps don't have to be exact, you won't see a difference visually, and the result will be much cleaner.
I've done plenty of pretty complex (much more than 12 sided cylinders) spiral staircases this way, and they compile fine even in quake1. I can tell you that you're stairs would just make q1 qbsp kneel down and start cying in most common cases.

In the end your tutorial is for quake3, so yeah it'll work fine, it's just not very clean. 
Ummm someone remind me, what do I use to zip so I don;t have to use the trial version of Winzip that reminds me I've exceeded the trial limit by 8 decades?? 
Czg Curves 
12 and 24 sided cylinders are pretty nice and with his ingenious clip-stretch-shear method you can curve very complex geometry. 
7zip is your friend: 
I Don't Want To Flog A Dead Horse Too Much, But... 
Dzip does work on OS X, because I compiled it, and gave Nolan the executable for the dzip page (that's a PPC binary though), and use it all the time.

So, er, nyah? 

OK, well, it didn't work for me. So I dunno. Can we not just use standard ZIP files? 
Clean? It's horses for courses Bal, if you're throwing brushwork around to do some interesting designs with stairs (other than a tube with stairs and openings top and bottom) the chances are you're going to cut across a spiral and create nasty floaters at compile time anyway, and that's regardless as to how you made them. So it really is a completely moot point to say that; even using smaller grids isn't a cure-all as it has a tendency to introduce precision errors as you know.

Every method has it's problems, just use whatever you think suits what you're working with and trying to do and how quickly you want it done. Having said that the tute wasn't intended to be read in the context of Q1 level design.

I've updated the tute regardless to take into account what's been discussed here. 
I don't watch any demos anymore because I refuse to download and install the absolutely worthless DZip.

Lame excuse, aguirRe's current engines and (iirc) JoeQuake can playback Dzips like demo files, as long as dzipname = demoname. Place the demo files in ID1 and do playdemo demoname as usual.

(yes it's necessary to rtfm sometimes, but it's worth it as SDA keeps pumping out awesome demos like Stubgaard's fairly recent e3m4_120: )

Also, aguirRe's 3.09 (current beta) will have even more useful features regarding demo playback.

7zip is good because it's free/stable and the compression rate with large demos is indeed better, but 'installing' Dzip is a matter of 10 seconds... 
"Lame excuse, aguirRe's current engines and (iirc) JoeQuake can playback Dzips like demo files, as long as dzipname = demoname."

Plz add to FitzQuake, kthx! :) 
The Spiral Stairs In Lun3DM3 
are on a minimum grid of 4 at the smallest. They were easier to work with, line up with the curve patches for the trim a lot more cleanly, plus the compile-side benefits. I'd post a grid shot but I'm at work.

Why is lunsp3 takign so long?

because lunsp2 isn't done yet. 
Oh Boy... *sigh* 
Sorry, moot points again, those are all 'attributes' that can and have been argued for and by proponents of every method there is to make spirals, Quake 3 and beyond. 
Lun: CZG's Curves Tutorial ! 
And Lunsp4? 
Goddammit Lun 
where's my... your es pee five?! 
Quake1 And Detail Brushes 
I've read some misconceptions here concerning quake and detail brushes, such as they would require bsp or engine modifications to support. This actually isn't true. There's a set of compilers called "eUtils" that support detail, hint, and skip brushes. Hint brushes are added to the bsp first, and detail brushes last. Simple right? Well I dunno really, I'm no coding guru.

The qbsp looks for brushes grouped into "am_detail" entities.

Two catches: one, vis and light need to be aware of the changes, and such versions are included. Two, there is source, but it's a Carbonized mac app, so maybe not many of you could try it. I use it as my main compiler and they work fine. But it would be interesting to see the features added to the linux-ified bjptools that are being worked on.

It was made by frank "pOx" condello, same guy that did the extras qc mod. 
I remember that concept being tossed about (hint added first, detail added last, but they are still part of the bsp structure), and I seem to remember some people saying that the order that brushes are added to the bsp tree really isn't that important (even though conceptually, it seems like it would be.)

I think in radiant at least, any time you select and deselect a brush it gets added to the end of the map file, so you could manually do this sort of thing by selecting/deselecting brushes that you want added last. Not sure if this is that helpful. 
Detail Brushes 
what are the biggest differences between func_walls and detail brushes?
How hard would it be to add an intermediate form of solid geometry to an engine, one that is rendered quite like walls (without the func_wall penalties) but is not part of the bsp somehow (could affect collision hulls somehow, dunno how). (how do you accomplish that I do not have the faintest idea...)
Maybe just generate an entityish class for func_walls only. 
Tree Order 
It's not entirely accurate to refer to the "order" that things are "added" to the tree - hint faces have the highest priority for splitting the tree, and afaik details have none. What order the brushes are listed in the map file has nothing to do with anything because split priority is based on brushes' size and shape and angularity. If order mattered you couldn't have major structural leak-stopping brushes "last" because the BSP tree would have been largely finalized already.

An aguire or a lordhavoc would be useful right about now. 
i guess i thought qbsp adds brushes to the tree in the order it finds them in the map file. Didn't know it scanned the entire list of brushes and then optimized the order in any way.

Either way though, a leak plugging brush will plug the leak regardless of the order you add it, assuming there are no precision errors or bugs.

P.S. I'm talking about quake 1, if that's any confusion. 
I'm almost certain that QBSP adds the brushes in the order it finds them in the MAP file. It has to, otherwise overlapping brushes with different textures wouldn't work. The ordering has to be deterministic. 
From my understanding it wouldn't seem right for Qbsp to just take the brushes in order, I always thought he splits everything up according to volume sizes (leaf nodes) to keep them similar (in size), but that's maybe just some misconception I've been dragging along over the years.

And yeah in Quake 2 (unlike in Quake 3) detail and hint are just there to influence qbsp in the right direction, detail brushes are smaller complex forms that you usually don't want to be used for initial splits, while hints are you trying to force qbsp to add a split in some area first.

In Quake 3, Hints work kind of the same afaik, but detail brushes don't split the tree at all, they are completely ignored, I think they are just culled (coplanar faces) and stuck into whatever leafnode they occupy (usually defiend by the caulk stuck around them to avoid leakage).

But anyways, yeah, I would have loved proper detail brushes in Quake 1. =) 
The ordering has to be deterministic.

Super/hard-deterministic to be more precise, but that's hardly a useful pragmatic viewpoint.

Or were you talking about something else? ;) 
Golden Boy Qbsp 
Just had a look at the wildcards stuff in wad.cpp ... I cant test that stuff myself, but perhaps the "glob" system call is what you want. Type "man 3 glob" for manpage. Ozkan ( ported all of the Hexen2 utils to *nix , so that might help too. 
thanks for the hint. 
fun at #tf :)

[21:36] <@Bal__> * Added Trinca!*@* to ignore list, should have done ages ago I think
[21:36] <@Bal__> +that
[21:36] <@voodoochopstiks> :D
[21:36] <@Trinca> Bal__ thks!
[21:36] <@Trinca> i�m sick of you bullshit
[21:36] <@Trinca> get a women
[21:36] <@Trinca> stop talking about all 50 games you fucking play
[21:37] <@Trinca> i just play one becouse i want time to FUCK MY WIFE!!!


Trinca(PT) 1 - 0 Bal(FR) 
Clearly it's important to you that Bal still see your scathing retorts (the part where you implied he did not have a girlfriend was particularly fresh - nice job!) because you felt the need to mirror them here. Clearly him ignoring you bothers you, then, and you need some kind of release to feel like you had the last word so you can keep feeling better about yourself.

Is putting down foreigners you've never met in an IRC channel necessary to get through your day? Perhaps there is some reason why you cannot take such pleasure in your day to day life. Are you happy in your marriage? Or do you regret the life you've chosen, feeling trapped in a bitter loveless marriage, away from what you really enjoy, which is apparently your penis?

Or maybe you're just exceedingly fucking immature. Go retire again, I promise you nobody here will miss you, miss your childish ravings about sexuality, or miss your whiny footstamping at the faintest provocation or perceived slight against you.

Go the fuck away. 
did u read any book to write this?


ok, go take your goat! 
Oh Drama 
how I've missed you. 
kekeke, someone was having a bad day at work yesterday.

I am inclined to agree with the majority of Lun's points tho, even if they are written in a particularly aggy style (actually, scratch that, all his points).

I especially like the fact you proved him right by feeling the need to post (yet another) weak retort within an hour of his post despite it being 2am where you are.

And how is literacy (that'd be reading books) a bad thing? I like being both verbose and well read, it improves my mind, allows access to novel (see what I did there ;) points of view and means I can create a more sound argument that 'lololol you readz!' or 'i has sex k!'. (On an aside, reading Bulgakov atm, why I haven't done so before eludes me, but I reccommend is work if you haven't read it)

And for someone who gets to 'fuck his wife' so much, you seem to have a lot of time to check func 30 times a day. This does rather suggest it doesn't take you that much time to fuck your wife, which may be part of the problem...

Of course, the fact your wife just gave birth means you're probably not actually getting any atm (hence the need to defend your sexual prowess so much in unrelated arguments). And even if you were, a swift pint in the burnt down ruins of your old pub isn't really the same as a selection of cocktails in pleasant, modern bars. (Yes, that was an analogy for your wife's torn up and tired out pussy vs the wide selection of attractive tail being single provides) 
The Only Troth 
The level of intelligence in some people here is so high that makes me cry� but guess they are not much susses full with women�s because they spent more time playing all kind of games instead of getting out of home and get a proper social life. Oh well but this is just me guessing i might be wrong and you are pure machos! And play tf2 with a girl making a blowjob at same time!

:\ lol get a grip� 
"(Yes, that was an analogy for your wife's torn up and tired out pussy vs the wide selection of attractive tail being single provides)"

As classy as that was, I feel obliged to point out that now you're going down the exact same road you were just decrying. The high road is looking awfully empty these days. 
kek, yeh, I know, but without gross hypocrisy my life would be exceptionally dull ;p 
Also, the kekeke thing isn't really working in your favor. 
I like cheese. 
And Now To Something Completely Different 
shout critic at me, don't spare embarassing yourself with stupid remarks: (no direct linking to avoid crawling) 
I Like The Darker Look 
As for critic..

* The background color in tr.light contrasts too much with the one in tr.dark, making it hard to focus on the table contents.

* The level name used as the page subheader should be the same size as the rating. Right now it doesn't stand out enough.

* The pink border line placed under glossary items is kind of iffy, especially with the text getting underlined upon hover.

* Some things feel as if they take more space than they should. The MD5 signature definitely needs to use a smaller font, and so does the "Files Included" table at the bottom of the upload information. Using a different font face in those elements wouldn't hurt, either.

* The BSP/PAK/etc checklist should be a table rather than a single line, but that's just me.

* The links in the navigation sidebar on the left should have different means of being emphasised on hover - how about making it become white text on a pink background? 
So you're going to have to convert every single one of those .html files by hand?

Excellent feedback, onetruepurple. Thanks!

Lun: I might be special but I ain't that stupid. All I will have to change is the XSL stylesheet. :) 
Do You Remember 
when funny pictures didn't need text over them? 
How Is That "fail?" 
do people even try to make a connection between the image and the choice of stale-meme they paste onto it? 
It's Irony. 
The guy adding the caption failed... 
If you intend to fail and do, did you really fail? 
no, you are failing to fail. 
It looks like successful candle bukkake to me. 
i actually like the original colours, but the new layout is more solid. 
I Like The New One In Every Way 
more brown! BROWN IS THE WAY 
Websites are like video games, the more brown and colorless, the more nextgen they are. 
I will call this "Quaddicted 3.11".
The old colours were nice, I came to these new ones when writing some other pages for it. And then I thought "mmmh, this looks so polished and noble". 
Ultimate Webgame Website... 
... will be completely dark :P 
... And... 
... black obviously ;) 
Spirit... is still ravingly gay and the pinkest thing ever. 
looks good to me. Don't ditch the pink! 
I Came In To Work Today 
sat down, opened firefox, and typed /join #terrafusion into the address bar 
suggestion to metlslime: make it so you can spam... put a deluge of sad face post icons in your post... 
opera works almost like that :o

btw, i think we need this on the board: 
wasn't your DKT review site also "ravingly gay and the pinkest thing ever." 
it's different if shambler does it (as long as the balls don't touch, ofc)! 
I'm Noticing 
that a lot of people are saying they played through custom maps on Skill 1. I always play through everything on Skill 2, and I guess I figured everyone did, because, you know, we've been playing this long enough I thought we were all super good.

Is medium difficulty pretty commonly used still? More than hard? Does anyone play on nightmare for fun? 
Not To Imply 
that anyone who plays on Medium sucks, I understand you might just want a less grueling experience to check out a new map. 
I just never am really bothered with changing difficulty settings. I just kinda hope that the designer has made a decent experiance at standard difficulty. 
On Skill 
i play on skill 1. i feel that at this point in time, maps are far beyond the difficulty that skill 1 used to be when quake was released.

the skill levels of maps have scaled without abilities to play, so i stick with medium skill.

when i design maps, i try to make skill 2 an extremely challenging skill. 
I Make This Typo A Lot... 
without = with our 
I Always Play On Skill 3 
impale me. this is why I seldom finish maps. although occasionaly I play skill 1.

TBH I play on whatever skill I feel like at the time, but when I try a new map out for the first time and record a "1st run demo", its always skill 3. dont know why. I have eyes bigger than my belly 
I Play 
On 3 because it's set in my autoexec - one of the reasons why I don't post many firstrun demos. 
I understand you might just want a less grueling experience to check out a new map.

that's about it. I started using skill 1 when playtesting for ijed (um, see his post above). ^^

About firstrun demos, yeah I'll normally die somewhere along the path because my normal mode of play is pretty sloppy. When I want to make a demo for someone, it's kinda desirable to stay alive... so...

but I don't always use skill 1. When playing id1 and older custom maps, or maps that I know well, I play on skill 2. That's where the "we've all been playing long enough" bit comes in.

I'm also someone who likes to take in a map's atmosphere, lighting, and general feeling of the place. I actually stopped to read the centerprints in Willem's map, even if the rest of the demo was "cringeworthy". (Probably because I just spent a lot of time on looking around).

So, yeah, I play on skill 1 when it's a new map. Skill 0 even, if it proves to be a tough one. I switch to skill 2 when I want a challenge. I see no point in current Nightmare skill. I might as well bang my head against a wall, that'll also hurt. Doom nightmare (respawning monsters) is my idea of "nightmare done right".

I play TR though, so... I'm not a "true Quaker" I guess. 
I play on skill 1 and I start to hate that trend of posting firstrun demos that are only about completing maps on the first attempt. There is nothing wrong with loading. 
"even if the rest of the demo was "cringeworthy". (Probably because I just spent a lot of time on looking around). "

I think the cringeworthy was the missing of the first secret despite the 5 solid minutes you spent looking at the ceiling but never at the right spot The only spot, in fact, that you didn't look at. :) 
There are only a few exceptions where I will play a map on skill 1, like RickyT23's Sick Base and Soul of Evil: Indian Summer, just because they are incredibly hard.

Every other map I come across, I play on skill 2. 
Sometimes I play on skill 1, sometimes on skill 2, depending on my mood. If it's one of those 150+ horde maps, however, I'll most certainly play on 1.
Player skills have indeed greatly increased (but probably not with a consistent distribution?) so skill 2 has become a lot harder nowadays. This also depends a bit on the playing skill of the map's author. Some maps are still very beatable on skill 2, others are extremely hard. Just don't dismiss a map if the latter is the case without trying a lower skill first (out of false principle or whatever).

And yes, listen to Spirit. Quicksave during a demo recording. If you die, stop the recording and disconnect, then start a new one under a different name without specifying a map, then quickload.
Most people probably don't complete/post their demo because they feel it doesn't look good enough, while in fact it's much more interesting for the map's author to see what the player stops to look at and how he approaches certain situations. And 'cringeworthy' sections can be easily fast-forwarded with a simple host_framerate script (like aguirRe wrote once). 
I Should Use Better Words 
First run demos are always appreciated I guess. But I noticed that my own playing style on new maps changed drastically trying to finish the map without dying and being very frustated if killed. And that's probably because it became a trend to post demos that complete on the first attempt. I don't hate anyone, I just hate that my playing changed from something like that.
Earlier I used to quicksave and load a lot, when I took too much damage = quickload, when I screwed up something = quickload. And it was more fun! I'll try to return to that. If that means I won't be able to give an easy demo to the mapper, so be it.

Did anyone else notice the same? 
More Skill 
Is it preferable to see fewer monsters on lower skills, or just more health/ammo and earlier weapons? I don't want to do things that punish people who play on medium with less combat but I still feel playing on hard should have some kind of reward besides bragging rights. 
"while in fact it's much more interesting for the map's author to see what the player stops to look at "

Agree++. It lets you know what was worth spending the time on and what wasn't. Helps to facilitate creation of the next map. No point spending time on stuff that nobody seems to like or care about; 
I play most new maps on skill 2. Using skill 1 only if the level seems to be very hard judging from the comments. I have also noticed the same thing spirit is talking about. When I record a demo I tend to play more carefull. But I still enjoy it. I always try to record a demo. Sometimes I die early and stop recording. But if I get far enough and then die I will tend to start a second demo.
Mwh (I think it was him) recorded a first run demo once where he didn't care if he dies playing very offensive and he has managed to survive. It was one of the best demos I have seen here.
Playing on skill 3 would be very frustrating for me. I also think that on this skill the game isn't that fun (ogres and shamblers standing in one place just spamming their projectiles at you and other things). I have beaten quake and other maps on nightmare but i wouldn't ever try it on a new map. This would destroy it for me. 
Most people probably don't complete/post their demo because they feel it doesn't look good enough, while in fact it's much more interesting for the map's author to see what the player stops to look at and how he approaches certain situations.

That's the reason I posted the evil exhumed demo, I knew it wasn't very entertaining, but I thought exactly this and posted it because of that.

The problem is I would normally never play like that... I would die relatively early and call it a day. Are first run demos where the player dies interesting for map authors? I wasn't even aware that you can apparently continue recording a demo after dying, until recently.

I'd normally only replay a map (after dying a couple times) that would get gradually harder, and/or had an interesting atmosphere (cool place to be in). I don't feel inclined to replay a map that is focused on unforgiving battle, or wants to kill the player. I admit it is fun to put 100 monsters in a map, I did it myself, but I won't do that again. What I'm looking for in a map would be atmosphere, sense of accomplishment (gradual increase in difficulty and combat intensity, plus discovering stuff) and movement/layout. I have no problem with a map that has almost no monsters for the first couple of areas. Let it ramp up more gently.

Did anyone else notice the same?


Is it preferable to see fewer monsters on lower skills, or just more health/ammo and earlier weapons?

Tough one. Perhaps (almost) no monsters on skill 0, and more ammo/health on skill 1, combined with fewer monsters in the first half of the map. Hard to say though. Haven't really thought about it yet. I guess skill 1 should have an exponential increase of difficulty - it's OK if it gets very hard towards the end, but give me a chance to see more of the map before biting the dust, even if I'm sloppy. You can have a more linear increase for skill 2 then. (Is that a theory or what?)

I think the cringeworthy was the missing of the first secret despite the 5 solid minutes you spent looking at the ceiling but never at the right spot

All right... but shooting a lamp to open a door? I guess it's established in Quake, but this one isn't really the player's fault. It's like in Wallace and Gromit, turning on your radio to make your toaster work... (Not trying to argue here though.) I also play at a relatively low resolution.

I saw the space under the lava walkways, and assumed there was a secret there, but for whatever reason I didn't go for it (I believe secrets should be optional). 
I play on skill 1 and I start to hate that trend of posting firstrun demos that are only about completing maps on the first attempt. There is nothing wrong with loading.

who are you to shoehorn your playing style/opinions onto others ? 
"All right... but shooting a lamp to open a door? I guess it's established in Quake, but this one isn't really the player's fault. It's like in Wallace and Gromit, turning on your radio to make your toaster work... (Not trying to argue here though.) I also play at a relatively low resolution. "

Well, it has a different texture on it and it's the only one in the room that looks like that. It's a fairly standard Quake convention but I do feel bad that you had trouble with it.

And I agree that secrets should be optional. These were. The map is totally doable without finding them. 
It's a bit late, but here's some Cthulhu-oid pronunciation discussion, complete with reference to Egyptian linguistics. Pretty damn geeky, even for this crowd.

More, with bonus mp3: 
Read #15262 please. 
Fear my use of compliment sandwiching in the screenshots thread, for example;

wrath, I like your levels. But kek you, you kek. At least I laugh occasionally you miserable cunt. Also, I like how your name is monochrome.


2 birds 1 stone, this internets thing is easy ;) 
nonentity, now with smileys. And self-congratulating... What the hell, have you learned nothing?

I hope you die in a fire. 
Totally Unrelated 
I'm sitting in a thai internet cafe surrounded by schoolkids playing counterstrike in the ugliest box map ever. seriously, the only design 'flourishes' are boxes. But they fucking love it. 
Go rape those schoolkids.

In counterstrike, I mean. 
Little Late To The Party But... 
Skill 2 is set in my autoexec.cfg. I've been playing this game long enough that I think I'm pretty good at single player, I know how monsters are going to react and I know how to fight them. I expect a map on skill 2 to be challenging but fair. I expect to die quickly in tough spots if I'm not careful, but that my skill should see me through once I know what to do. I quicksave often, proportional to how scary the map is and how likely I think it might be that I'll die around the next corner.

Dropping the player into an arena with no cover, instantly surrounded by 4 shamblers, 5 vores, and a gug, would not be "challenging," just dumb and unfun. Just an extreme example there, can't think of any specific maps that actually did that.

I only turn the difficulty down when things are insanely hard and I'm frustrated, or I'm getting shitty framerates and can't fight and react properly. Generally I'd expect there to be less monsters, or less difficult types of monsters, on medium/easy. Ammo actually might balance itself out, consider this: a less skilled player on a lower difficulty might be less accurate with his guns, and so need extra ammo, but a player on a higher difficulty will need more ammo to kill the greater number of monsters. So, pending testing, the ammo count could stay the same, or even add a little more on skill 2, if there are large horde fights. 
what metl told me he does is that he just populates the map and puts in enough stuff that it feels okay to him when he plays it, and then makes that Hard difficulty because he's got the home court advantage, then scales it back from there.

when I made that stupid speedmap with the teleporters I didn't have skill levels set at all so I guess the map was technically skill 2 since it felt okay to me. Just to save time on testing I totalled up how many of each monster there was, figured out the total monster hit points in the entire map, then figured out how much damage each ammo item allows the player to do, and then placed like twice that much ammo. And people still ran out. 
The best quote on difficulty I ever read was in Game Developer magazine. They did a special on Half-Life and it's development process. This is NOT the quote but I'm paraphrasing:

"You're good at your game. You just are.

HARD difficulty should be whatever you find to be manageable. It should be a challenge for you but not too bad.

NORMAL should be a little less than that - something you can handle easily.

EASY should be easy. Tune it until you can't believe there's anyone who couldn't finish the game on easy. Then make it easier." 
I don't think skill levels are ALL that relevant in Quake maps these days since the audience is so small and generally they are long time Quake players. But it's still somewhat important I guess. 
I Think 
I once said on here pretty much what's been said above. I use my own play as a marker for hard, then just scale back monsters.

Adding extra ammo shouldn't be necessary since there's less to throw it at, but I've proved myself wrong so more ammo as well can't hurt.

Having weapons earlier or easier to get is a good idea - don't think I've seen this in a map before, but then I don't usually play on other skills.

One thing that could be good is having secret pointers on easy. So you make a func_wall that only show in easy and basically has a big arrow pointed on it showing where the secret is. I say this because there's not that many who actually use easy now, though that depends on the map.

You could go even further with this for labyrinthine maps and make a series of direction pointers - a bunch of arrows showing which route to take. 
Lunaran Says: 
He plays the banana with the mouth.

take that as you will. 
I Heard 
That Scampie and Lunaran's mules are punching each other all the time. 
and prosper

may the enchanted qcode entangle our carved editors to rejoyfull gathering
may the broken ruins of map failure rotten for good in their homfilled hallways
may the leaks groan the muddy slime from their infected off grid placement
may the andrenaline quotum from the best maps howl their echoes through the nightmare stage of subconsiousness

may the id of gilgameshes quest to the deeper dwellings of revealment have its detiny. 
pardon my lyrical ofcursion,
must have been mapping to much. 
Thanks Madfox 
looks like the post-qexpo euphoria wore off and everybody crawled back into their caves. 
Im back from my "holday" as of yesterday.
My mapping will recommence v.soon.

Project is "on the go" - no-one has seen it yet except for me :P

Finger is a bit better than it has been, but guitar playing is still fucked. Which is probably good for mapping.

Willem - old chum of a few months - great to see you are back - hopefully epic havent crunched you too much.

Looking forwards to playing your map! It looks very tasty.

Also Necros. Looking forwards to playing you map too.

Fuck - I have a lot of catching up to do!

Also Madfox - if your map is boxed then send it to AguirRe! He is a genious with finding leaks! 
And In My Cave 
I wonder why there wasn't a best booth log chosen, just like in 2006. After all they all were winners but it would have been nice to see some kind of logs with most hits.

Rikcy - I did, but he is working with the Q2 engine. Ijed mentioned something like finding the leak, which I did. Think it will vis better now. 
And In My Cave . . .

That's where MadFox goes to groove with
the Picts. 
well, seems like Quake is dead again. 
Each Time... 
... Scampie post here, Quake dies :P 
Which species - a squirrel? A rabid badger? Or maybe one of a pair of stoned mice? Playing a piano? Drinking a bottle of scotch? 
Wired Speak 
In a nondescript Bay Area office park, a converted hard-drive factory with a shiny new fa �ade began churning out unconventional solar tubes that big investors are betting will soon blanket commercial buildings across the world.

Anyone else annoyed at this style of writing? 
Oh Yeah - A Fox!!! Duuuhhhhh 
sigh - have you seen Fean and Loathing in Las Vegas? If so try to imagine the sound of Jonny Depp saying it whilst in the character of Doctor Gonzo/Hunter S. 
Homo Sapien ProtoScotus 
They Be Fuury Too 

Ever see South Park's Woodland Critter Christmas? I kind of imagine them being the guest in that cave. 
Hookah Smoking Catepillars. 
They are furry right? 
3d Scanning An Area In A Single Laser Flash
A tech called Ladar.
This was prolly mentioned on func or tf some time ago. 
Words People Need To Stop Using: 

You mean to say envision, you stupid cunts. A vision is a good thing. You envision a grand strategy for your company, or a brighter tomorrow. You don't want to 'envisage' anything. Corpses have visages. Visages leer at you from the windows of haunted houses. You fucking prats. 
Lunaran, stop eviscerating the situation, you're only making things worse. 
The English language disagrees with you. 
Lunaran just envysages me because of my incredibly sexy visage. 
Blog And Orientate Are Also In The Dictionary 
that doesn't make them any less bullshit 
It's weird that Gullible isn't though. 
Earlier you were arguing that 'Messenge' was a word. Not that this invalidates your arguement against 'blog', but you should really pick your fights here. 
Bla Bla Bla! 
I know your just trying to illicit discussion here, but most of us could care less about this sort of thing.

I don't know if you're trying to infer something, but were suppose to be relaxing on this cite, and for all intensive purposes, the only affect this sort of post has is to levee your own baggage onto others.

Irregardless, try complements instead. Its the principal of the thing. 
That PJW 
He sure can vocabularate
There's Nothing Wrong With 'envisage' 
It was stolen honestly from the French a few centuries ago (from 'envisager'), and it's just fine. Whine about something else.

P.S. Blog is a word now. Get used to it. 
That was the greatest post ever written. 
Go And Look Up The Word 

as in the oven brand... 
Those are misuses of words and phrases as opposed to raging against a perfectly valid word. But funny nonetheless. 
OMG, it is so funny :P 
Hang on a sec...

WTF is wrong with orientate?

And yeh, That was the greatest post ever written. 
It would have been better if he had swapped all of his you're/your usage and threw in a 'teh' here and there. Just a tip for next time, loosers! 
Constituency Is The Cockgoblin Of Little Mimes. 
Or somesuch shit. Teh. You're welcome. 
In a nondescript Bay Area office park, a converted hard-drive factory with a shiny new fa �ade began churning out unconventional solar tubes that big investors are betting will soon blanket commercial buildings across the world.

Try to imagine the voice of the narrative in the movie reading the paragraph above. 
Orientate Isn't A Word 
It's 'orient'.

Verifying what is and isn't a word is pretty easy. 
The whole shit about what is and isn't a valid word is garbage. If someone makes up a word, it's a valid word. Period. That's all there is to it. It doesn't need to be in the dictionary to be valid. The spoken language is pretty fluid like that.

Fo' shizzle. 
Portal: Prelude

A pretty professionally made Portal mod taking place some time before the original game. You have to play through 19 test chambers and eventually get to witness the activision of GLaDOS. It even has bonus maps and a developer commentary (in French).

Unfortunately, I found most of the puzzles to be incredibly hard and annoying (some seemed to border on pixelhunting) and eventually ended up noclipping through most of the maps. This is clearly something aimed at the hardcore Portal players. 
If enough people use the wrong word, it's no longer the wrong word. Perhaps that has happened to 'orientate', but I don't think a link to establishes that.

I wouldn't use it on my resume.

Zwiffle: spoken language is fluid, but people are going to think you are a complete moron if you use poor English in formal writing. 
People will think you're a genius of satire if done correctly. -.- 
All Depends 
Which version of the English language you're speaking. 
I Think I Fail To Failure 
dis miens det wen ai dont rite goet amerikeniesj
ai mait bie a djienius ov satier? 
I Fucking Hate All Of You 
except madfox 
Callate Conche Su Madre 
Chingate Su Papa 
Solo Despues Que El Terminar Con Su Tu Mama 
I can even fuck over another language - su / tu. 
or guest
orgue est
orchest ra! 
Is resonating throughout you're blogospheres 
So Fkn Late To The Party 
that d3 vid you posted looks interesting. might benefit from having different floor levels instead of just one large plane. 
is a word you used in is valueless 
Ask Here, Why Not 
Doesn't really fit in any of the other categories.

Does anyone know of a 3dsmax grid plugin that causes the object to snap, instead of the pointer?

Currently pointer snapping is worse than useless. 
Make sure you check "Use Axis Center As Start Snap Point" in the snap options (right click on any of the Snap buttons, then go to Options tab).

God I wish max had maya's snap, it's so much more powerful. 
Already Have 

I gave up on max for having accuracy years ago, just wondered if anything had changed or any new plugins surfaced.

Thanks anyway, will continue to google. 
Messing with the new options helps, but its a still a pain in the nuts. 
Try hitting s (for snap) after you've already started moving whatever your moving. 
Will Try Tommorow 
Where Is AquirRe 
Is he still online? 
aguirRe, AFAIK, is focusing onto is new Q2 engine, or something like that... He is still on the scene, but with less activity: you should email him directly if want something particular ;) 
yup, email him. 
that new q2 engine is quite spiffy! 
Oh, did you test it ? 
Not As Much As I Should Be 
but I wont say any more at this stage :) 
OK, you beta tested it so... I'll look forward for the release, hopping it will be posted here as well ;) 
I never hopped over the q1 engine 
It Should Be Something Like 
understanding the complementairy qbasic progs quotient, while I can hardly get the most basic q supplement.... 
Unfunny PA Post 
But that first frame is Shambler in a nutshell. 
Spopse it's even less funny without the link. 
This Is Penny Arcade In A Nutshell 
Which one is me?? 
I'm not very good at this.

The Deluge comic -

"Word up, that's an authentic statement"

Sigh - I'll go back to my corner now. 
So UWF (Tronyn?) is taking a break from reviewing? Anyone else to step into the gap - Kona?? ;) 
You're right about the humour though, it's kind of dropped off. I still read it a fair bit when the boredom sets in - seems like it used to be better.

A few of the series stick in the mind as good, but it gets tiresome eventually, like Bottom or Father Ted. Stuff that was great in their day but time hasn't been kind to.

The comic I b0rkedly linked was funny in the first panel, the rest just a monotonous in-joke. 
yeah, anyone want to review NSOE?
actually on second thought don't bother, there should be a new version out soon.

UWF said that he'll post any reviews I write while he's away when he gets back... but I thought, just IN CASE he doesn't return there's no point writing reviews right now that aren't going to be posted. I think I did 95% of the reviews this year since February, so UWF wasn't all that involved, but he has been running his site for 6 years - maybe it's time for someone else to step up and make an independent review site. 
Kona? Step into a GAP? Right.... 
How 'bout that debate? 

#15364 posted by Zwiffle [] on 2008/10/16 17:00:51
How 'bout that debate?

I'm voting for THAT one --> 
God Of War 2 
ok, I give up.

I tried playing God of War 2 this afternoon (PS2). I got to the bit near the beginning where i'm still fighting that big statue man but the blade of olympus is stuck in the ground and i have to pull it out before i can use a cutscene to attack the big statue thing.

Problem is, this game is probably the buggiest piece of crap i've ever played. First time I get inside the statue and battle my way to the top to trigger a cutscene of me jumping out of it - then the game crashes midway through the cutscene and i have to reset the console. So I'm reset about 20 minutes back. I do the battle to get the sword again, and then some sort of pseudo-cutscene is triggered where i launch myself at the statue to get inside it. I say pseudo-cutscene because it's still in-game enough for the collision to spaz out in the middle of it (i have no player control at this point though) and send me clipping straight out of the map and into the void instead of doing whatever the fuck it's supposed to be doing. After falling through the void for a while it kills me which was a relief because I didn't want to have to reset the console again.

Ok, third time lucky. I get to the bit again with the blade of olympus in the ground. Now for some reason the rendering of my glowy-chainy weapons isn't fucking working. I can see the player doing all the moves, all the combos and shit but the fucking blades are invisible. It makes the player look like he's trying to throw punches but in a sort of school-playground "wave your arms around randomly and wait for him to walk into your fists" kind of way.

On second thoughts it seems that not only are they not rendering but there's no collision on them either so i can't hit anything. But yeah, I haven't got any further than that because the blades don't appear at all now.

My PS2 is fine btw, off-the-shelf, not modded or anything. 
Your Ps2 Is Fucked Up 
did you mod it? you shouldn't have done that. buy it off the shelf next time. 
bitterness level :P 
Yeah, it's your PS2. The game played perfectly for me way back when. 
can use a cutscene to attack the big statue thing

Gotta love modern game design >_> 
In seriousness, you do. The giant statue battles in the God of War games are awesome spectacles that I never would have dreamed were possible even 5 years ago. Fucking -awesome- fun! 
Yeah But 
no matter how visually impressive they are, quick-time events still suck arse as a gameplay mechanic. 
awesome spectacles


-awesome- fun! 
I'm sorry but if you don't find the God of War games to be awesome fun you need to turn in your gamer badge and get out. Seriously.

And yes, QuickTime events suck but the rest of the game makes up for them IMO. It isn't like it's a crap game AND it has QTE stuck in. 
And the giant statue fights, unless I'm remembering them wrong, weren't the worst offenders of QTE anyway. They were at least memorizable (meaning, the sequence was the same each time). The fight at the end, not to venture into spoiler territory, where the QTE shit was randomized was far, FAR worse. 
For the Wii is good because it's simple - messing around with the dpad for quicktime is beyond shitty.

Kinn, you need a new PS2.

GoW is a great game. 
"func Msgboard" Yields The Greatest Anagrams 
"Barf Cum Dongs" and "Scumbag Frond" are both on the first page of results.

there's also "Scrag Mob Fund" 
The incarnation of productivity. 
Dawn Of The Dead Mall For HL2 
I was browsing youtube for Left 4 Dead vids when I stumbled upon this pretty cool little walk-through video.

Its a complete remake of the shopping mall from the 2004 remake of "Dawn of the dead", and I must say the sheer size and attention to detail is very impressive.

Apparently the map is part of the Half-Life 2 modification called "No more room in hell" which you can find here :

How Many Roads Must A Man Walk Down Before He Can Say 
he's walked down 74'976'298.8819 roads?

The answer my freind is.... 
The Answer Is..... 
Blowing In The Wind [nt] 
Ugh. Bambuz Farted. 
I Thought Something To Do With Oral Actually... 
Actually No... 
the answers is infact 74'976'298.8819.


OK, so HeadThump was very very close. I would definitely have rounded it up rather than down. 
Unfortunately, Ricky 
if you watching where you were going you would have realized the partial is not a complete road but a mere gravel path that will lead to a upper middle class cul de sac of homes at some future date. So the answer is 74'976'298. 
Just To Be Sure, 
I gave the benefit of the doubt that you or the subject of the analogy may have walked that path at some date in the past when it was indeed a road, but unfortunately the geographical schemata I found in the county records shows that the ground the path stretches across has never been developed for use. The Underurth Archives of the long dead Stenonychosaurus inequalis show they never developed that particular partial of land either, and a similar inquiry to previous BigFoot and alien inhabitants
came back with the same null results. Sorry. 
I swear it, you're wrong! It's zero.
I've re-thought my stance on the issue, and it has come clear to me now that the answer is definitely zero.
You see the man is quite capable of saying he had walked down any number of roads, regardless of the true figure. 
In almost any other circumstance where you didn't play upon a Bob Dylan lyric from his pre-psychedelic phase, I would fully and gladly state, 'you are CORRECT, sir!', however, you did choose a Bob Dylan lyric and therein lies the error in the application of the phrase 'before he can say', as you would like it to be read,and as it could be read without error outside the Dylan lexicon which you chose to appropriate. In the Dylan lexicon, this phrase like many of his others, given Dylan was a product of his time and he soaked up much of the culture, ideas and taboos of the Beats who were quite obsessed with the false, pretend, plastic lives of the 'gray flannel men' and who also wanted to live lives of authentic experience where one's language was plain spoken and the words coming from one's lips were true to the inner self, like a Dharma Bum, denotes a meaning of authenticity, in other words in Dylan speak, you cannot express 'before he can say' without it meaning what is simply expressed without lies or misdirection. Sorry, nice try though. 
we could be dealing with a dastardly liar who though familiar with Dylan is willing to misappropriate his words. In that case the answer, my friend, is not 'zero' because the question was never honestly asked, but 'null and void' instead. 
WTF retard topic is this?

Can we go back to debating dongs or some other intelligent discussion? 
One Allinchinsky 
beer for me!

or whatever which road he took? 
it looks like our plan is working ;) 
Of All Of The Topics Ever Discussed Here 
this was one.

I still think zero, how about this:

The man in question was declared a 'man' by the sixth word of the verse, and therefore could say he was a man there and then, regardless of of how many roads he had walked down. I mean that would be true to the Dylan version.
But this was a grossly mutated version of his original verse, the question not being weather or not he was a man, but being weather or not he could say that he had walked down 74'976'298.8819 roads, and due to the generation gap between the originator of this instance of the verse and Dylan, the difference in the overall "message" is much more easily understood. 
So If It Wasn't A Willfull 
distortion in the plausible alternative scenario you give where the state of mind of the man who asks the question doesn't necessarily reflect on his honesty therefore the integrity of the implied contract between the questioner and the recipient of that question isn't rendered null and void on the face of it due to a breech. I like it. Zero it is then. 
you never know what func will bring you on any given day. 
Scrag Cum Dong 
mafia hit burgers 
Has Anyone Sees The Magazine Or Scans 
from it that show screenies from Deus Ex III? Some encouraging info there concerning how the game will play, but is that Gunther wearing a frilly doublet? I can't tell for certain from the low rez screenies I've seen but it sure looks like it. That is kind of gross. It wont be easy explaining this style change up within the Deus Ex continuity given the clothes in the first one are gritty urban for the most part.

Am I the only one who has noticed a resemblance between Gunther and the often great defensive lineman Brian Urlacher? 
'n' And 's' Are Not Even 
on the same hand side of the keys. Will do the honorable thing and commit Seppuku. It is the only honorable thing to do with a spelling error that grotesque. Here it goes -- blehhhh!! Hurts so much, damn, wow . . . feeling cold, is that you Marmaduke . . . 
In an interview with Edge magazine, published tomorrow, Dugas says the original Deus Ex was �kind of slow�. He added, �There weren�t enough exciting, memorable moments. It was aimed more towards a simulation rather than a game experience.��kinda-slow�-says-deus-ex-3-dev 
RIP Deus Ex 
It was a fantastic game - very much a fantastic game experience in particular - pity it is being increasingly consigned to history. 
He's a tall bald man with no neck. They all kind of look like each other. 
Well, That Is True 
What I was noticing was their eyesockets were set at a slightly odd tilted angle. Gunther because he is drawn model on simple geometry where the modeler wanted to emphasize a Teutonic warrior type, Brian because he is a little funny looking. 
I am carefully introducing the new design, just now the maps description pages got revamped, check 'em out!

For a tiny bit more info: 
Looks Good 
Not much more to say. The map listing is a bit difficult to read, I think because of the column alignments - maybe make them all left justified. 
where the pink syringe? :( 
I wanted to try non-gay for a change. Maybe I'll put it back but no for the next weeks. 
What The Fuck 
where did you get that title image, 1994? 
From Biff 
i actually preferred the half-gay design you had a little while ago -- more brown, but still with the pink highlights and that syringe. 

the greenish brown background with the red is not doing you any favours. I suggest going more rustic brown.

And you need to make sure the width of the page is the same as the title logo on all pages, looks very poor when it's not aligned right. And the logo itself is hard to read, the background being much more busy and bright than the text.

I did a quick photoshop to fix up the colors and make the logo slightly more readable. 
whether it was gay or not, it was distinctive and unique. 
Keep The Old One 
Change the pink liquid to brown.

Not gay at all. 
Legendary Pictures Buying Epic Games? 
While you are right with the easy readability your version looks like glquake without any full- and overbrights.

Thanks for the feedback everyone. 

Mark Rein already smacked that down. DENIED! :) 
1994 Called 
they want their logo header image back. 
1994 Called 
Your mum fat. 
I like it. 1994 seems like a perfect design sense for a website dedicated to Quake 1. 
1997 called, they want their "1994 called" slogan back.
I am already using Javascript to help the buggy Firefox render the map description, does that not make Quaddicted next-gen2.0 enough? 
There Are Things From 1994 That Look Good 
and there are websites that have header images made out of embossed cutouts of quake textures.

that any better? 
If you want to help you will never succeed with such attitude. 
Change the character outlines to white so the letters pop off the logo better. That would be enough to finally make the nay-sayer's heads explode. Or, at the very least, move on to whatever is next on their seemingly endless "Things to whine about" lists. 
The Lava Background 
is high contrast and busy. The letters are low contrast, darker than the bright parts of the lava but brighter than the dark parts. The old chrome cursive was actually easier to read. 
I agree with the low contrast comment. That's why I suggested pumping up that black outline around the letters. Seriously, trying filling it with white or a bright yellow. Something to pop it off the lava. It DOES get lost and you don't even realize there's a word there for a few seconds. 
The Syringe 
looked better.

The pink looked gay, but it also looked unique.

Spirit the old site looked much better in my opinion, or maybe i�m just used to�

Thanks for all the time you spent in your site!

The more important issue is to keep it alive! 
Yes, that it is.

I like the logo or I would not have used it. Maybe I will change back to the old one some day (by my own will) but for now it's going to stay. 
That's Okay 
I like the logo or I would not have used it. Maybe I will change back to the old one some day (by my own will) but for now it's going to stay.

That's okay. I have the wayback machine to send me to the old site and along with a loop of Barbra singing 'The Way We Were', I'll manage to get by.

BTW, if you have seen me sniffing around the site lately, I've been d/ling some levels I've preciously missed. Andrew you have an excellent level from 04 I played for the first time last night. The puzzles fit into
Quake without a problem, it takes a deft hand to do that right. 
That's Not Right, 
'preciously'? previously. Time to bring the katana back out, tummy is not going to like that. 
You're Allowed To Like The Logo 
but if there's a lot of people who are all telling you it has legibility problems, it's not because the world is trying to keep you down and if you just keep a stiff upper lip and don't back down on your beliefs you'll be rewarded in the end, it's because the logo has legibility problems.

Do whatever the fuck you want with your website. :) 
That's okay. I have the wayback machine to send me to the old site and along with a loop of Barbra singing 'The Way We Were', I'll manage to get by.  
please people like




jump of a bridge... is easy... dont think on first step... 
[23:50] (Trinca): fuck you all old ex: quakers
[23:50] (Trinca): stupid fucking vondur
[23:50] (Trinca): fuck you
[23:50] (Trinca): stupid asshole
[23:50] (Trinca): stay in your fucking iceberg
[23:50] (Trinca): u frustrated mother fucker
[23:50] *** Trinca ( has left #terrafusion
[23:50] (@megmn): lol
[23:53] (@popple): i wonder if there's something in the water in Portugal 
no, but people like Vondur and Bal_ are not helping nothing the few people that still want to map for Quake...

he took my OP in #tf and didn�t even respond to my msgs...

i think there people should be ban of the comunity nobody need then... they even map... just talk fucking crap in irc... nothing more! 
this use to be a good place for Quake.. now people like Vondur, Bal_ noentety or what the fucking nick means just post crap after crap...

is this a mapping site? or a crapytalk shit site? i think in there days in more the second...

is a petty becouse meanslime, shambler and nitin still love these gay and other just put there feet above... 
i�m sorry metlslime for all this bad spawn but is the throuth... i�m of for good of this site :\ i now is not your fault... and i will not quit map but i dont want to see my future maps posted in here!!! 
went with far more style 

I heard there was drama here. 
Dead Sniper! 
got 'm sir! 
Oh Snap 
Who can ever get mad at BAL? Seriously. Bal is like the most unhatable french ever. 
I have no idea what the hell you're going on about. I've had you on ignore on IRC for a month or two and my life has been better ever since. The only way you seem to have to come up to communicate with me (why I wonder?) is to kick me from the channel for no reason whatsoever, yeah, that's really smart, why can't you just leave me alone?

And why keep mixing up Func and #tf, what have Von or I ever done on func to make this less of a "good place for quake"? We almost never post here...

On a side note, "stay in your fucking iceberg", nice one. =D 
i kicked you by mistake i sent it a msg... but vondur could stand quiet.. he had to defend it... so he took my OP he can put the fucking OP in is fat large ASS.

i got nothing to do with you... you were in my ignore list also! 
petty that STUPID RUSSIAN dont understand it!!!

but i dont give a shit... this use to be good but there are to many people killing it 
So... The Story. 
Trinca kickbans Bal for no reason.

Scampie kickbans Trinca for kickbanning Bal.

Trinca loses ops.

Trinca blames me, I tell him I have no power to remove his ops and inform him that Vondur is the channel owner.

Trinca loses his mind and ragequits.

moral: #terrafusion is filled with drama 
Scampie, no was good... i was almost a month not comming here... guess this time is for good...

Distrans 8 month that he dont come
Aguire 4 month...

what is going on?

i think some people dont fit here... go home and play with your cock dont piss people that still love to make maps and dont like to talk crap! 
now people like Vondur, Bal_ noentety or what the fucking nick means just post crap after crap...

yes what was that nick, it's on the tip of my tongue 
Haha, This Is Gold 
But seriously, who could hate Vondur and especially Bal (he's so loveable!). That's like saying you hate teddy bears and kittens. (If you do, you're an EVIL MONSTER!) 
I Hate Ewoks 
which are king of like teddy bears, so I guess I would hate the star wars versions of bal and vondur. 
I Miss AguirRe 
Working on Q2. 
i thought bal was so inactive he even gave up idling... 
A Frenchman? Being lazy? What? 
i just wish everybody stay in there own places i made a mistake in irc and i say �m sorry to him, i think other people "vondur" should shut the fuckup and stay in there own house... but maybe he is a stupid faget and needed to help is lady... very sad! but fuck it in #terrafusion 99% of the talk is crap. So I will not miss anything.

metlslime sorry.

i know this is General Abuse threath but it was to much abuse to the abuse one!

ahhhh Mr Fribbles sorry but i hate kittens 
I go to the pub for one evening... 
Hang on. My names in there (well, kinda, maybe 'brush' would be easier for you ;)

I don't even go in #tf, wtf did I do?

Not that I cba at 5am and drunk, but please, continue the rant so I have something to abusively respond to before I have my morning cig... Oh... I see what I did now ;p 
i think other people "vondur" should shut the fuckup and stay in there own house

You understand how the internet works right?

(Yes, ok, I'm going to sleep now. Apologes for the triple post) 
1 Out Of 2 
Fond of kittens, I had two this summer that I caught while they were feral orphans, but the runt of the two was picked up by a night owl while I was calling her from across the yard one evening :(

I named them Peter and Louis. However, Peter is actually a Petra. Sometimes it is hard to tell what the button is until they get a little older. She is a gorgeous gray Persian, btw.

As for Teddy Bears, I hate every aspect of their miserable non existence. There was a syrupy cute commercial around when I was still
a kid for a fabric softener called Snuggles with a talking bear and smarmy kids and a prescription medicated mother type who couldn't stop smiling a huge fake grin from all the Valium she was loaded on.

Of course, there is also the Lucas factor. No need to get scathing here, after all, the man will burn in hell for what he has done to Star Wars since Return. 
I Can't Stop Laughing 
At the thought of Vondur living inside an iceberg.

I wonder if he would acheive that by living on a big boat and having the water temperature around him drop drastically or if he just carved his home out of an existing iceberg.

Regardless of the method by which he made his home in an iceberg, no one can dispute the sheer evilness and heavy metal-ness of the thing. It would be a great theme for a concept metal album. Or even like a good Viking story.


P.S. how is everybody doing tonight? It's nice when we have drama explosions it gets people out and about. It's nice to see everybody :)

Welp. You guys have a good night :) 
I hate you and am sorry I ever gave you a hug!!
trinca has shown me the error of my ways 
He carved it out of the iceberg himself of course, in perfect square axis aligned chunks! 

wait... must be a different cube... 
[23:50] (@megmn): lol
[23:53] (@popple): i wonder if there's something in the water in Portugal

Doesn't sound like Trinca's been drinking water to me...

And I think Vondur would be very happy living inside an iceberg. 
The pink needle was gay. The new title is ok.... everything looks a little cramped though. 
Speedmapping Theme? 
Vondur's Iceberg house. 
I was going to build on of those :)

That is totally the speedmap theme. That. Vondur's Iceberg. 
I also would like to quote this for emphasis:

very sad! but fuck it in #terrafusion 99% of the talk is crap. 
days without abuse they thunder out of #irc and understood in general nicks their id.

I wonder what my nick's still nigging there, while my kitten died and I even ain't. 
i like the theme!!!

vondur russian iceberg!

if will be a speedmapping event on this theme count with me. 
didn't you quit? 
i never quit mapping...

i quit #tf this is for sure... got better things to do... in #tf 99% of chat is crap. 
99% Of Chat In #tf Was You Talking 
I wonder what my nick's still nigging there, while my kitten died and I even ain't.

I'm seriously thinking that madfox is a new age shakespeare. 
Everyone hates fucking ewoks. Same as binks 
Driver Issues 
Back from my trip and still opengl quake issues. what command do I need to enter to have fitzquake open in a window? 
use the SDL port of it SleepwalkR did. He is a clever fellow: 
And now go map! 
Von's Iceberg 
need ice textures plz hints? 
Reminds me of similar things in #tf a few years ago when somebody hated scampie. Metlslime should add something like 'do not bring #tf problems to func' to policy in faq page 
almost everybody hates scampie and czg :)

but scampie have improved in last years :p 
Don't congrat them please... they will stop to improve... it is always possible to do better you know :P 
Thanks - that seems to fix my problems temporarily. 
heheh this is so true JPL :) 
The 'qte' Thing 
So since it's impossible to adequately explain an idea in full in #tf, I'll do it here so no one thinks I'm done explaining an idea after I send a single message.

The idea was that in a survival horror game (Silent Hill in mind), to add to combat there could be a part where a monster tackles the player to the ground. The goal is to add to the tension of 'clunky' combat, without making the game Devil May Cry or God of War.

Now what happens is basically this: A monster knocks the player over and moves in for the kill. In the example I had, the camera would move down near the floor to better see action, and get in close. There could be different examples, cameras do different things, etc etc. This is just one example.

The player has now has the option of running away taken from him. He has to struggle to survive. The way I imagine it, it's an extension to combat, not a qte. The player can kick the monster off, block incoming attacks if he wants, hit the monster with his weapon, etc. It's not based on "press this button now or you die." You don't die in normal combat by pressing a button at a certain time, why would this be different?

If you can push the monster back far enough, you can regain your footing, where as the monster is dazed on the floor. Run away or try to capitalize before it gets back up as well.

If you choose to fight the monster, you can get it off balance by hitting, which will also damage it. If you hit with a heavy attack, it could become dazed (depending on if the monster is low on health, how big the monster is, etc.) During this time it will stop advancing on you, and you can either kick it back, switch weapons/use items (I assume if you're struggling on the ground you won't have time to switch weapons or use health packs, but that's open for debate) or keep on hitting it.

Now of course the monster is in the advantageous position. It wants to kill you, so it's trying to render you useless. Different monsters will have different struggle strategies. Some will probably try to pin your limbs down, others will just wait until you attack, then dodge your blow and strike from a different angle (no reason they have to be slow, lumbering monsters, they could be small annoying cockroach things) in which case what you do might have to change depending on the monster that's attacking you. If you normally just kick a monster off and it's too heavy to be pushed back, then maybe you should just try and daze it.

Likewise, which weapon you have equipped will affect how fast/heavy you can attack. Smaller weapons attack faster, but less chance to daze an attacker. So that also has an effect on the struggle.

Now maybe some monsters have soft spots, weak points, vulnerabilities. Maybe you want to risk a monster to get closer to you than further away so you can directly attack its weak points, dealing more damage or possibly outright killing it (jamming a knife into a monster's throat/heart/head, etc.) But if you fail/miss, then the monster is closer to killing you, and harder to get off.

Now fuck, just so people can argue against me that it's qte, I'll add in timing elements so you're not just pounding buttons as fast as you can.

Let's say if a monster is pretty aggressive and fast, it'll crawl all over you in no time, even if you're trying to daze it/kick it off. How about waiting until it attacks, then blocking at just the right time? Perhaps if you time it correctly, you can flip the monster over and regain your footing, or roll over on top of it and start bashing away with your lead pipe. Or maybe you can counter attack and kill it with a quick jab to the throat. (There goes those pesky weapons, affecting combat again! And if you have the wrong weapon out when the struggle begins, your tactics will be different of course.)

I *hope* I've explained how this is NOT qte, how it adds to normal survival-combat, how it's not just "press button as fast as possible", "press button at right time for quick kill", and adds more of a strategic element to combat more than anything else.

So really, the struggle aspect I was trying to talk about isn't "press button now" like most of you fuckers think it is. How unattractively narrow minded of most of you. You hear a new idea, and assume it's 'qte.' Oh, you can't escape from combat? QTE. Without even hearing an explanation, or even exploring the idea, you default to qte.

I suppose it's my mistake, though, for wanting to talk about taking things in a different direction and talk about game design in #tf. Second time I've tried talking about game design and been pwned by true gamers! Completely my fault. 
I Would 
map an iceberg cavern 
Just To... Yknow 
So Its True Then 
vondur does live in an iceberg. 
Vondur sounds more and more like the Lich King every day. 
you basically end up with a fighting game?

ps. also, i'm doomed, i knew what qte stands for :( 
Quicktime event.

Because the interactive movie fad of the cd-rom era worked so well. 
QTE Is Awesome 
Developers have for a long time struggled with how to implement their ideas. How to make the player do something awesome when all you have for reliable game mechanics are jumping on crates and hitting stuff with a sword? Cutscenes are falling out of favor, because the anti-Hollywood luddites refuse to cease insisting that our media has to be "interactive" all the time. The answer is really quite simple: you give him some buttons to press.

(Personally, I love a good cutscene. In fact, quite often, after I've watched a good one, if I've still got some milk duds left in the box I'll go and get myself killed just so I can watch it again. Developers who 'get it' make that part easy for me, with tons of bad guys and instant death traps right after a healthy dose of exposition. So I don't have to go looking.

I'll tell you about a developer who doesn't get it: Bungie. First cutscene I experienced in Halo I was so thrilled I immediately grenaded myself to death to sit through it again, only to find out they put a checkpoint save after the cutscene! Come on, fellas! You put all that work into an animated sequence and the player only gets to watch it one time? No wonder Microsoft kicked those guys to the curb.)

What if we want the player to be able to climb a giant statue and stab its eyes out? Too fantastic for you? Get up and leave the room. This is a discussion for problem solvers. For years developers have been wishing their awesome ideas and visionary action sequences could be made into movies, but unfortunately, the best they could do career-wise is games, where they're hobbled by the constant annoying presence of this entity known as "The Player." (Hollywood is smart - those guys don't give a fuck about who's on the other side of the screen. *clicks his powerpoint presentation to a slide of George Lucas* )

But how do you stage and animate the player character climbing this colossal statue while still fulfilling your token obligation to be 'interacting' with the player? Easy: you make a token gesture! And that's why we have QuickTime Events. By forcing the player to press buttons at regular intervals, you ensure he stays awake and that his thumbs haven't gone all tingly, AND if he can lose by not pressing them fast enough then it still feels like a game! But there's a third benefit: the player doesn't have to wait to the end of the cutscene to watch it again! Now your game controls intuitively serve a second role as fast-forward and rewind buttons. Yep: one step closer to the movies.

Back in what I like to call the "Dark Ages" you'd have to write a whole statue-climbing system and simulate the whole affair (plus, your statues would have to be concepted by the level designers - oh god!). After that much expense, you'd pretty much have to make your entire game just about climbing statues and stabbing them in their sensitive bits, and you'd barely have time to pad that with something dead simple like a riding-around-on-a-horse mechanic. And who the fuck would buy that game?

What a modern age we live in. 
Thanks, but I think we're all stocked up on impotent whining. If you know where that shipment of solutions is though, I'm all ears. 
My Whining Isn't IMPOTENT!!! 
How dare you!!?

oh no, wait a minute....


Yes it is 
If you know where that shipment of solutions is though, I'm all ears

-> write a whole statue-climbing system and simulate the whole affair 
"write a whole statue-climbing system and simulate the whole affair"

That's not a solution, it's a pie in the sky wish. I can do that to:

"Make the funnest of the funnest game and make it really fun and super great!"

Same level of usefulness. 
QTE is the answer to a question no one asked. 
The Name 
Quick-Time-Event is managerial speak so they sound like they know what they're talking about 'Oh, so its like quick time?'
'Yes' (no, you fucking tard)
Usually after not having played the game mechanic in question.

Limiting the players input and the good/bad results of input reduced the amount of gameplay in the game.

This is not a good thing. 
"Quick-Time-Event is managerial speak so they sound like they know what they're talking about 'Oh, so its like quick time?'
'Yes' (no, you fucking tard) "

Where on earth are you getting that from? 
What I Mean Is 
The silent hill fight sequences described above are excellent gameplay mechanics, but they will be labeled as quicktime, which has a shitty, shitty reputation.

Quick Time Event is a modern phrase that has little meaning. What people mean when they say it is limited player input. 
Ahh OK, sorry. I over reacted. 
"Make the funnest of the funnest game and make it really fun and super great!"

Same level of usefulness.

Well... No. Not really. While I could write an entire design doc on how the system should work, I'm not actually a professional games designer (unlike yourself (as you are so often want to remind us)). However, if GTA can manage to have different control systems for driving/flying/walking/swimming/cycling/pogo-sticking and not confuse players then I'm sure you can construct some kind of useful system to allow the player to actually climb a giant statue and stab it in the eye without resorting to 'press X now!' every minute or so while pretending it's not just a more annoying version of a cutscene.

Of course if you actually meant 'unfortunately it's unfeasible to create 200 different control/gameplay systems within the restricted budget/development time of a modern game' then that would be more understandable (and a seperate discussion on the problems symptomatic of the modern games industry). But that's not what you actually said, is it? 
driving / flying / walking / swimming / cycling / pogo-sticking / fuck your auto abrv. system metl ;p 
write a whole statue-climbing system and simulate the whole'd pretty much have to make your entire game just about climbing statues and stabbing them in their sensitive bits.

FYI: he's talking about Shadow of the Colossus. 
I assumed this board was games-are-art enough to get the reference tbh...

And statue of the colossus was more interactive levels taken to extreme than statue climbing really. Also they were stone mechs.

But yeh, good game, prefered Ico tho. 
Hey Willem 
Quicktime events sort of make me feel like i'm being forced to take a creamy facial from the lead cutscene animator. It's all about him stroking his ego (cock) in my face whilst he's forcing me to keep my eyes open all the way through it. Meanwhile, I've got no choice but to keep hammering away at my joypad so I can pretend to myself that I'm at least getting something out of it (but I'm just going through the motions at this stage; it's a pretty fucking shallow, soulless affair) and to be honest I don't give a fuck how visually impressive it is, all I know is that it gets up my nose and leaves a bad taste in my mouth, and at the end of the day he's getting far more out of it than I am. 
Like Def Leppard Once Sung It, 
Quicktime events sort of make me feel like i'm being forced to take a creamy facial from the lead cutscene animator.

'Everything goes better with cock.' 
"Did you honestly not catch the reference?"

No, it was fairly obvious. I'm confused now. Did you write that whole post to drop that single reference? 
but you behaved as if you completely missed it. You know, equating my sardonic but exact description of the game's core mechanic with unachievable fantasy, as if in defiance of the fact that such a game was out and well received. Which I guess in a way indirectly supports my point about huge developers making safe games as a means of hedging the huge up-front investment.

Does the Colbert Report confuse you too? 
The Colbert Report is witty. That's the difference. 
The Colbert Report is irony?

d/l Brass Eye Lun, you'll like it. 
I mean buy, dammit, buy. Purchase. Consume. Buy in.

And for reference; 
I Never Saw BE 
But I can recommend SPAM. Not quite the same thing, much more twisted.

It's a common belief that American humour doesn't have much irony.

Lun, what's that smiley symbol you used there? Never seen it before, from you at least. 
You Mean 
It's a common belief that American humour doesn't have much irony.

Like raaaaiinn on your wedding day? No, wait, that is Canadian. Unless you mean North America in general then that totally over looks the brilliant irony of Spies Like Us, which is also pretty much Canadian (peeps from SCTV involved). I mean, when Akroyd and Chase jump out from behind the bushes dressed as aliens yelling 'beep-beep-beep-beep-beep' didn't your spinal cord rivet with delight at the sophisticated and dr�le irony of the humor. Okay, who am I kidding, still would prefer Fletch over Brideshead Revisited any day of the . . . . going to go sulk in my bottle now. 
BTW, The Point Of All Of That 
is Alanis Morissette has a huge but awesome gaggle of hair down there in her lower extremities. 
"Does the Colbert Report confuse you too?"

OK, let me just state this for the record and then we're done. Once I write this, I'm not replying to you any further.

You are the worst thing about this place. You're insulting, you're patronizing, and you bring down my good mood whenever I come here. I can come here totally pumped up on Quake level design and after reading your posts I end up annoyed and unmotivated.

You are poison to this community.

Preach, negke, Kell, and others are the exact opposite. They share information, they help people, and they're interesting to talk to. You're none of those things.

I think you COULD be those things but you choose not to. I also believe that you have interesting insights to share but you won't share them. Instead, you choose to project this edgy 'jaded and bitter' persona, which is unfortunate.

I used to do the same thing. I used to be you when I was younger. And trust me when I say - it's not worth it.

I know you don't care about what I'm saying and I also know that it will have no effect whatsoever on your behavior. I understand that and it's fine. I just wanted to get it off my chest and now I can move on.

We're done.

Pretend you don't see my posts in the future so you won't be tempted to reply to them. I'll be extending you the same courtesy. 
It's spelled 'patronising' 
All people are not either black or white... do you see what I mean ?? People share information, are smart, are cool, when they want to...

Unfortunately, there are lots of morrons onto the internet, and sarcasms are over-used for sure, I agree with you on that point... It is human being to be "nasty" in general... and when people are furthermore stupid, it does not help...

However, you should not take all these sarcams as personal attacks.. I did the same mistake some years ago but afterall, why should you care ? Aren't you mapping for fun ? Are you waiting for any recognition by others here ? Come on, you'll never get that ! I personnaly just want people to have fun with my maps...

an even if Quake purists are always proud to piss off new people that joins the community, and also to drag your maps into mud because they don't like small details, it is just because they don't want newbie to walk on their grass... like primates they are pissing around their territory :P

In anyway, let them for what they are, and keep mapping please: We need more map and more commitment from mappers to make this community still existing... otherwise, we will stay here endlessly with dinosaurs that will not make Quake spirit evolve in anyway...

And now go map !! 
It is human being to be "nasty" in general...
It isn't. It's just that the internet is quite attracting to lonely, sad, non-social people.

Normally humans learn and socialise. Someone who constantly talks bad about others or the world in general is avoided by others. Now he either changes his behaviour or gets lonely (and probably even more bitter).

But on the internet there is always the illusion of having friends, an audience or whatever. So they never learn how bad such behaviour is even for themselves and continue being idiots. 
Give lun a break. He's a bit edgy at times but he's a good guy. If you write over the top, the points become easier to demonstrate.

And thanks Willem for your sincerity. Such is rare.

Sarcasm often sucks on the internet since it's so hard to read into it. Actually, a lot of sincere stuff is read as having insulting sarcasm.

All responsibility should not reside on the reader. "Don't take it seriously, it's only the internet" is not a solution for every problem with messaging here. 
And Spirit 
Right on. I have followed some blogs for years and the writing has deteriorated, getting more extreme and marginalized while the writer's personal life is going somewhat worse and worse.
(Not any people you know or related to func or tf in any way.)

Very much simplified, the temptation of not doing anything about it but just go and complain and lecture about something is a projection too...

That said, there ARE lots of things that are worth lecturing on, and criticizing vigorously, and I laud people speaking up their mind, 
Well, I was refering more to internet people than other people... but you have to admit that being nasty is the human being nature..; Otherwize there would not be any more war on Earth...
I'm just pointing up the fact that without having people face in front of you when reading a post, you never know whether it is serious, or not.. hence some confusions...
I think the main problem is more about respect than nastyness :P... though...
Oh, also, I was not targetting somebody in particular... so if some people are feeling hurted, I'm already sorry for this ;) 
make maps not war bitches!!!

ahhh and dont forget the speedmap event!!!

"Vondur home inside a iceberg" 
Lying here in the darkness
I hear the sirens wail
Somebody's going to emergency
Somebody's going to jail
Don't mind Lun, it's his time of the month.

The time of the month that Dave Matthews pees on him. 
Dear Willem (and Some Other Pplz Too) 
please stop missing the point 
Best Quote Ever 
"like primates they are pissing around their territory"

JPL is godlike, and this confirms it! I spilt my tea when I read that part :) 
yeah back to the topic and negative programming (warning broad brush generalizations included): gaming nowadays... nice graphics, quicktime events, cash from the unwashed masses, some marketing people think it's a great game.
I don't really know since I don't play any games.

Any Games 
meaning anything made after the nineties. 
Thanks... though..

What it a sarcasm ? :P 
Daz.. Errata... 
Typed too fast.... the question was: "Was it a sarcasm ?"...
I dhun't piz & still zah! 
And Madfox Swoops In To Save The Thread 
This thread was doomed long ago 
Should Never Have Been Started. 
Resurrect Scroll 
I found the discussion pretty entertaining. I hardly play any new games at all, but I find that often "making the game more user friendly" can equate to idiot proof/consolization of the controls/options. It pisses me off in a game when you can't do something that it seems like you should be able to do - like the developer is treating you like a retard and putting you in a limited playpen. I don't mean the developer not spending extra time/money developing options/content, I mean them deliberately LIMITING options.

It seems like it would be better, instead of having things split into normal gameplay and "QTE" ('Yes' (no, you fucking tard) LOL), it'd be better to develop a good set of controls for an alternate movement/play type, and then just use that periodically in the game since you have developed it, ie: develop a statue climbing system, then have plenty of statues, rather than have one big statue and then worry about the problem of climbing it. 
The Player Should Have 
more choices than one.
That's where it boils down to from a certain viewpoint.

QTE is the ultimate in reducing this to absurd minimum for gameplay.
That's why CIV3 gets boring after a while. You recognize the one optimum solution to most problems and there is maybe one or two big decisions per HOUR OF GAMEPLAY.
You realize soon it's just a chore. 
Is This News Worthy?

Doom Q1 Level D1E1M1RMX - Quake!

I haven't tried it yet. 
It's a very bland dm map.
If you are unlucky it might overwrite your track #2 in sound/cdtracks/
Some of the textures in the bsp have fullbrights.

Or did you mean the .tgz file extension you surely never saw before (but that 7-zip can magically unpack)? :P

It's a pretty nice rebuild of the map though. 
Yeah, It's Shit. 
Doom not shit.
Doom remake sometimes are pure shit... though... 
that's the same as .tar.gz, right? 
Now, Now 
come on Willem, there's no need to flame lunaran. Quicktime events are the fucking devil and you know it. 
you know, I have no idea what the hell you guys are on about (QTE). I'm obviously years behind the ball with gaming :) 
New Games 
I'm making a doom map, not of pure shit, but...

new games, I dunnoh. i'm playing Quake4 now for years but i still haven't found out how to get out of the wild range of killing idiots on the back of a vehicle after leaving the plane.
I always end up on the same event. Myfault.
Think I'll be playing quake 4 long.

Like having a good map that plays well and looks aprovement, and then the stupid thing starts vising for years and I don't (can't, shall, have to) want to change it! 
QTE = Quick Time Events 
I work in games and didn't get the abbreviation at first either. 
I know what it stands for but I havent seen it in action, maybe becaue I havent played any post 2004 games yet :) 
q1's e1m1 remade for Doom would be cooler.

I thought that's what that was at first. 
I Realize Baseball 
likely has little appeal to most funcsters but I just woke up again for the second time tonight with disturbing visuals of how the World Series ended earlier in the evening. It is time to ban post victory man piles. 
It's like a cutscene but somewhen during it an icon flashes and says "hey, press button x", then you press x and something happens. So YOU CONTROL THE ACTION! It's almost like an interactive movie!

I think this stuff could be used well but then I feel that almost all recent games are shit in one aspect or the other and I am not interested in them. 
I'd Like To Declare The Latest South Park Episode 
to be among the best things ever. 
The Clouds Roam The Earth

i was bored. zip is 38mb or something. 10 minutes long. :'(

its a video i made. with things from tv... boring or fun? i dont know. friends said they laughed like hell... but sadness & tears fell from my eyes, through out the universe. 
it might be deleted in a few weeks. dunno why. to keep up with the limes i guess :'( 
Aaah - A 7Zip File! 
I downloaded this in <1 minute.

What a horrifically weird video. Spent 10 minutes of my day watching it. It didnt really make any sense, and was almost funny. Weird! Quite well put together, must have taken a good couple of hours atleast!

Reminds me of the scenes at the end of Natural Born Killers, just before this: 
7zip? but i made it as a regular zip! i'm confused :)

anyway, i think these type of videos are much funnier when one is sleepy. at least thats how they work for me, but they get boring very quickly.

now if i just had the same energy for quake editng! :( 
Soory Must Have Been Hallicinating 
What Really Worries Me 
is that the new Aliens : CM game is meant to use QTE, this makes me cry rivers and throw my arms into the air, hoping that some supreme being will throw lightning bolts at the developers heads until they drop that idea... 
Peering Into My Developer Magic 8-ball 
Not very likely.

It's a sad truth, but QTE events were in vogue until recently, and likely we won't see them dropping out of games for at least a year or so as newer games earlier in development start to see player backlash against them. 
Gamer backlash has little to with it. Qte happens when a company is bloated with artists they cant reasonably fire. 
To Do With It 
It took me one week to encrypter the savecode from Sin to another computer after I was recomposed to human ingame, because my machine crashed. 
"Qte happens when a company is bloated with artists they cant reasonably fire."

Can you expand on that reasoning? I don't see where you're pulling that from. It always looked like a game designer conceit to me rather than a "we have artist time to burn" issue. 
I Don't Know.... 
i think it has more to do with being light on programmers (or is it systems designers?), so you make QTEs instead of adding game systems. I was on a (cancelled) project where the "Dirk" meter would fill up, and then Dirk Pitt could enter "Dirk Mode" where he would "do something awesome" which was generally "press the buttons to see the next 2 seconds of a 15 second canned fight scene that our animators came up with." 
That's It 
When there's not enough programmers, or designers capable of building systems with the tools.

So it leads to over intensive art projects being built inside the game.

Firing artists wasn't my point - I meant that most likely the company is running another project at the same time which is programming intensive and deemed as more important.

But you can't have highly paid art professionals sat around doing nothing. 
Dirk Nukem Forever 
Well, I'll just say that (at Epic at least) I've never seen the artists bored. We can't hire enough of them, in fact. They have maybe a month of down time once a project ships and then they're slamming again on the next project. There is never a time when the artists are sitting around looking for something to do. There is always something to be optimized or added, not matter what part of the project we're on.

But maybe Epic is unique in that regard... 
Most animator's I know resent QTEs, and think they're too much work for too little payoff.

I honestly believe the largest factor behind QTE events is due to publishers behind the projects. Most care little for any subtle tweaks and design work you do milestone to milestone, so something like an awesome QTE (or new level that's had environment art done... or new attack moves with effects...) is very visual and quick to demonstrate. 
And Yes... 
...artists are always busy. Thanks to this 'next gen' world of ours, artists are getting hit the hardest to produce huge amounts of work. Most of the methods for creating realistic worlds haven't gotten simpler in the last years, only the technology to run them at a decent framerate. 
Yep, art is definitely the bottle neck in a lot of modern projects. As I said, we can't hire artists fast enough. Every time we hire one, they get immediately consumed by the content creation machine. We just can't seem to fill it up! 
. . . is very visual and quick to demonstrate.

Yeah, you've definitely got a point there.

Probably the reason why I have a different working idea of art is because I mainly do game for xbox live, where production is much shorter than AAA titles. 
QTE is a game design ego thing and a marketing tool. Visually striking parts of the game that are extremely complicated to realize within the design frame the game has previously established with the player, but someone can't stand to kill their baby. Enter; MR. QTE.

Also, it lets marketing put together a trailer of "gameplay" that looks completely fucking bad ass without any of those annoying consumers actually having to do anything meaningful with the product.

Some game people should just get into movies or machinima. 
Holy Shit This Thing Is Fuckin Long 
i had to contribute. uhhh, gogo deathwing, ninja Nefarion. This is what i got:
Mish'undare, Circlet of the Mind Flayer
Brestplate of Ten Storms
Bloodfang Vest
Boots of the Shadow Flame 
A Part Of History 
Holy cow I just took a shit and it was amazing but you know whats really amazing... the fact that i have a brown guy in my house and my house hasn't exploded from a fucking GIHAD bomb. Omg now he has his pants down and is chasing a goat! fuck shit i think he's onto my games. Oh madness this is i don't know what to do with myself. wait... maybe ill just.... RAAAAAAAAAAAWWWWWWWWWWRRRRRRRRR PWWWN NOOBS FUCKSHITCOCKS ASS TIT SUCK DICK CUNTi just want to have the longest thingies in eXISTENe NO WAY! meow 
First Post! 
First Post. 
it depresses me that i recognize the things mentioned in 15579 as stuff from WoW. 
I just realised that in real life, I still write capital Qs as Quake Qs. Started doing this a decaded ago and it's totally ingrained now. Hurrah! 
I Remember Being In High-shcool 
and seeing this really attractive chick drawing her 'E's like back to front '3's. I've been doing that ever since...

Double T 
As pi 
Which Spells....... ?!? 
Q.... T.... E..... (!#@*) 
I really hope that I am not the only one who thinks of Travail everytime the letters "qte" are mentioned. 
Instead Of Writing Vowels 
i draw a cock. EVERY TIME. 
I don't have that language pack installed. 
Neither Do I... 
....but it;s still how I always interpret Starbuck's posts. 
It's Ok Shambler 
I'm gay for you too. 
I'm a bit late, but I haven't had the chance to do more than just quickly browse posts for a few days; I finally did more than skim your response to Lunaran, and found myself getting a little irked about it.

Just a few opinions to offer:

1. People who tend to Take Great Umbrage (as you do) about stuff relative strangers post on the internet generally have a tough time of it on the internet. Sorry about that. <--Not sarcasm.

2. While Lun can be a sarcastic bastard at times, and tends to be argumentative and have strong opinions, I find that those qualities often go along with intelligence and passion, of which he also has healthy portions. "Poison to the community" (wow! drama++) is about the last thing he is; he's been here far longer than you and contributed a hell of a lot more.

3. I don't know about Lunaran, but for my part I'll respond to your posts in any fashion I damn well please, unless moderators have something to say about it. "Don't talk to me ever-ever-again and I won't talk to you, ever-ever-again." is operating on the level of about a 5-year-old, and it's not really how this shit works.

Just sayin'. 
Just A Quickie... 
Does anyone know of a freeware program that can convert .flac files to either wav/mp3? 
flac -d *.flac gets you .wav.
lame -V 0 --vbr-new gets you .mp3. (Use -V 2 if you are not some who can hear flies fart.)

Or just use Foobar, it's got some conversion tool on rightclick (you will still need FLAC and LAME installed). 
Oh And I Cannot Resist Saying 
Isn't it nice that FLAC is a free and open format? That way you are guaranteed there is a free software to use it.

*whispers something about Ogg Vorbis* 
Thanks Spirit 
Appreciate that mate! 
epic lol, I've been using foobar for years and never knew you could convert files with it, big slap on the forehead for me :) 
wtf is foobar? 
Fucked Orangutan Outrageous Beyond All Recognition 
Too early to think of a decent acronym. 
Falling Over Oblong Barricades Arranged Randomly 

No nonsense audio player 
I'll Give It A Try 
See if it's less annoying than winamp's upgrade popups. 
FUBAR originally meant Fucked Up Beyond All Recognition - from American GI's in WW2. 
is great. 
Nice player. 
:p i use windows media player 11 :p no need for those weardo programs ;) 
oips thks

Daz ;) 
Game Programming Thread? 
I was thinking about starting a game programming thread, where we could discuss and post links like or less rendering related stuff ;)

basically some way to boookmark things and have others comment on them. Interest? 
Not amazingly interested myself, but I'm sure there's enough weekend warrior programmers here who may. 
go for it. 
Re: 15592 
I enjoyed this post \ agreed with it. Willem, I can't say I like your attitude in general, though I certainly respect your right to express it. But one can ask, if you're so against reactionaries and anti-commercialists, what exactly are you doing here? This is a board centered around a game that's 12 years old, and the proportion of people here who are anti-modern gaming is going to be much higher than a representative sample of 17 year old disposable income dumbass average buyers of today.
Anyway you seem like a smart guy and I enjoyed your "but he's not an asshole about it" comment. If you've gotten over angst and integrity realize that not everyone chooses that. Partially joking.
I'm well aware that one's right to speak radically is based on what one has contributed, and my statements always outweigh my contributions/piss off people in relation to what I've mapped for (CZG notoriously, in my view, exceeded his limit). That's my uncalled for opinion. 
I'm well aware that one's right to speak radically is based on what one has contributed

Calling bullshit on this one... 
surely you're allowed to get away with being more arrogant/eccentric/egotistic/etc if you're artistically brilliant... when brilliant people are arrogant it's taken seriously, but if retards are, they're laughed at. Same attitude. 
comparing apples and oranges there. Right to speak being based on contribution vs. being taken more seriously if one has contributed a lot. The latter I believe to be true, the former I think is bullshit, like Frib said. 
alright well the latter is what I meant. 
Welcome To The Internet 
The best thing about this board is that erronious nonsense is limited - it's actually interesting to read the posts.

Contribution = right to speak? That's a new one on me, I thought that posting was a contribution, weather it's in the drunk thread or one of the help threads.

It seems alot of you/us take stuff said here too seriously. It's a nice place to discuss topics with like-minded intelligents, no more no less.

At the end of the day they're just posts on a messageboard.

pjw said it all. 
I Guess I Just Meant 
that I think I venture outside of my "right to say" given the content I've produced; I think personally (at least in this community) I'm more unpleasant than my maps could justify (again, CZG despite how awesome his maps are presses the issue)... but despite that conviction I can't help but speak my mind, and regarding Willem's anti-angst ideas there I am. 
Wonder If This Concept Could Be Applied To Mapping: 
Hottest Girl Ever In The Most Annoying Commercial Ever 
Forgot The Comment 
Definitely love how she measures a foot; you give her six, she'll tell her girlfriends it was nine. 
How To Behave: 
Tags: Fun Funny Funny Vids Funny Clips Forum Internet Humor

Kinda disagree with that. That's the dude who does those quickfire game reviews right?? This could have been a lot lot better imo. 
Different Guy 
You mean Yahtzee of Zero Punctuation? This was definitely not him. A fair number of his reviews are lulz-worthy, I didnt even crack a smile to this. 
The Metlslime Paradigm? 
Any news on Fitz 0.85? 
Sort Of... 
Getting close to beta-ready, but not there yet (work is taking my attention.) 
... do not forget about me ;) 
hey girls!!!

if anyone want to chat on Quakenet about mappint and not crap...

join #base and not #terrafusion

many thks to Lunaran and Vondur for still been a dick!!!

thks and god bless almost all! 
Any Thoughts About This? 
My Thoughts 
I listened for about 30 seconds before I reliezed I didn't know any of those people, nor could I understand the abomination of English those Brits were talking in. 
Yeah, I Have Thoughts 
They're idiots and deserve to be fired. I find prank calls only funny as long as the person who's called can laugh about the whole thing, too. 
oh - well have you ever seen Fawlty Towers, with John Cleese?

These two "comedians" - Russel Brand and Jonathon Ross - left a message on one of the Fawlty Towers actors answermachine saying the Russel Brand had "slept with his daughter" among other things. I think its quite funny.
Its the waiter "Manuelle" who always said "I know nothing - I am from Barcelona"

Well anyway the two voices you can hear are both in "a lot of trouble" over it - Jonathon Ross is suspended from his �6m/y job at the BBC, and Russel Brand resigned.

Shame really.

Scampie this is for you! 
#15630 FTL 
Despite being vaguely aware from overhearing people that there is some "fascinating" """controversy""" involving Ross and Brand (who the fuck is the latter??), I have managed to remain blissfully isolated from the no-doubt soul-crushingly tedious details of such drivel. Clicking on that and closing it after 5 seconds is the closest I've come to knowing anything about this mindless media nonsense, and that's far too close.

Please don't do that again.

BTW, Fawlty Towers was genius, as were most things of that era. 
On The Other Hand... 
#15629 FTW

Mid-life crisis angst lives on. 
....and In Other News 
....apparently the EU have today abolished an act to prevent shops from selling "misshapen" vegetables. As in you couldn't sell a cucumber for example if it was to "curved". Or a banana if it was to bent, or not within a cetain measurement. 
I thought that law was just a myth in the first place.. 
that was me 

Nice to know that Ross is going to lose his job though. 
Read This

Standard limits are listed at the end of this document..

Thanks aguirRe ;) 
Wrong Thread... 
Gonna post it into the Mapping Help Thread.. sorry for this :P 
incidentally Brand did sleep with Sachs's grandaughter.... 
Fucking Ell. 
This is Func_Qmap not fucking Daily Mail or whatever.

Get back to bitching about Trinca or Willem or something FFS.

P.S. Scampie is dead and Quake is ghey and where the fuck is CZG? 
If It Wasn't For The Daily Mail 
neither of them would be in this mess. Brand made an early appology to Sachs, which was quite sarcastic, and he ended it with a pre-emptive strike on the Daily Mail, saying how they had supported the nazis back in the '30s.

So the Daily Mail crucified him....

And yes, I know im a muppet for bringing it up again. Go on, tell me again.... 
Ricky, Shambler is saying no one gives 2 fucks about this and it's just meaningless celebrity drama bullshit. 
Yeah, That's Right 
I have no idea what you're talking about, but I can say with complete certainty that I wouldn't give two shits or a flying fuck if I did know. 
I Know 
im just a sad lonely deranged individual with no real purpose in life 
How Many Shits 
in a flying fuck?

I can never figure out the exchange rate for these things. 
.3 Shits Per Flying Fuck 
depending on rigidity of boner & looseness of bowels 
This Is Post #666 For Me 
I will probably never post again just to maintain the mystique of being the guy with 666 posts. So I guess I should get some things off my chest with this one.

- When I was eight years old I dry-humped a fat, retarded girl inside of a snowfort. I don't regret it but I just wanted to get it off my chest

- I've never played Doom or Doom 2 for more than a few minutes.

- I've never beaten Quake (but I have beaten Quake 2...I am a deeply flawed human being)

- I'm not really a nerd but I play one on the internet.

- I secretly hate the following people: czg,

- I am fat, bi, and Wiccan. And I am a womyn. 
Ricky, Shambler is saying no one gives 2 fucks about this and it's just meaningless celebrity drama bullshit.

Which is fine when it's meaningless celebrity drama bullshit about member of the Func_Terrafusion (or is that Fucn_#base) scene...

P.S. Cya Bltiz. 

fat hugly fuckers join = #terrafusion

cool Quake guys join = #base 
I Wish Func_ Had An Ignore Feature Too Now! 
i wish u get the fuck out of this forum... u dont map anymore... why dont u fuck your self?

go make gay chat with Lunaran and all those assholes... 
I just come here becouse i like to play Quake and make maps...

those who dont want none of those, i dont understand WTF they are doing here...

Now i will go rest and will not waste more of my nice time!

Yeah, Go Rest 
with the fishes. 
fish is one of most borring Quake monsters!!!

no i will not! 
Ah, Everything's Back To Normal 
Now the only thing to worry about is VIS being stuck at 99.99% for three fucking days. :( 
ten bucks says vis crashed 
you seem like you could do with some herbal tea or a spa day or something. And some blood pressure meds. 
15 euros... 
There are slow portals like that. I've had a two-days one earlier in the process. The map isn't really a prime example of good construction, at least in terms of vis requirements. 
starbuck tea? beer or wine i whould like more!!!

let�s all give hands and make Quake maps!!!



p.s-> this is General Abuse thread please let us people have a litle fun!!! 
#terrafusion if you want to talk about crap. eh. 
Spirit: (was: White Room) 
About Tyrquake on Linux, it really badly hangs the X server. And that makes me think that this is a pretty bad flaw in the engine(s), not the map.

Fair point, but they (Joe, Tyr) run most other maps. If a map fails in Joequake and Tyrquake (non-obscure engines) under Linux (non-obscure OS), it's due to insufficient playtesting. Sorry, but that's the truth.

Oh, Software, well let's always ask for more more more! ;)

Doesn't apply in this case. Apart from that, you misinterpreted what I wrote. I had taken extra care to not make it sound like a demand or sth like that. You're normally a nice, intelligent person, but this (undeserved) bashery wasn't necessary.

-> ;-)

Now for the general part.

Sorry for reporting my findings (you'll have to look very hard at my original post to find a DEMAND). Sorry for getting motion sickness AND TALKING ABOUT IT. Sorry for not behaving as expected (pressing the button, posting rave review), sorry for using the software renderer like a retard AND ADMITTING IT. At least I have some BALLS.

Sorry for spoiling you guys' little party. Go to #tf and show each other porn. 
"Fair point, but they (Joe, Tyr) run most other maps. If a map fails in Joequake and Tyrquake (non-obscure engines) under Linux (non-obscure OS), it's due to insufficient playtesting. Sorry, but that's the truth. "

In my defense, I was apathetic. It works in Fitz. *shrug* 
Herbal Tea 
Down with that bizzle, homizzle. All about the chillage. Anything with camomile in apparently soothes the soul. Well into white tea with vanilla though. 
More Defense 
Willem's map works with the Windows versions of both engines. And there also was that one situation in which your Tyrquake-linux didn't like the push in adrlass2, whereas it worked with mine (iirc). So maybe there's something wrong with these particular (versions of the two) engines under Linux. 
Don't overreact! If I offended you think about if it means anything to you and then do the right thing = think "idiot" and move on. Sorry.

I fully agree that mappers "should" test their maps on a multitude of engines, simply for the reason that the people out there like to play on engines outside the func_focus (tenebrae, vengeance, QMB).

BUT the map works in Winquake which (in my opinion) is the "green card".

I was a bit bitter about the quasi non-existant error handling in engines. 
I fully agree that mappers "should" test their maps on a multitude of engines, simply for the reason that the people out there like to play on engines outside the func_focus (tenebrae, vengeance, QMB).

I disagree: I will not waste my time checking if every corners of my maps will work on all engines..

BUT the map works in Winquake which (in my opinion) is the "green card".

And I disagree again: the green card is provided by FitzQuake !

"I disagree: I will not waste my time checking if every corners of my maps will work on all engines.. "

I'll also add that if the maps work in Fitz but doesn't work in some other engine ... what on earth am I supposed to do about it? I'm clearly coloring inside the lines if it loads in Fitz so, really, my job is done.

Anyone disagreeing is hereby granted a full refund for what they paid for my level. 
So To Say: 

1/ Add correct information in the .txt file
2/ You damned mother fuckers should read these fucking readme before complaining!!

Green Card 
standard quake 
Green Card 
'bout Time The Horde Showed Up 
Sat turns into Squad

is free to do what he wants to do.

You can make maps however you want, you can code engines like whatever you want.

I'm not asking for a refund.

But you got to take it when someone calls you lazy.

Also, why the attitude towards the software renderer. Face it, GLQuake looks like shit. You want some screenies to prove that?

I'll take software over something like Proquake any day. Of course Darkplaces etc. are another matter because they have better lighting. You know this is the truth, there are some areas where software is decidedly better, fucking admit it already.

OK Spirit, I overreacted. There. ;-)

Goes to show you how much I feel my back is against the wall. :-( 
Wtf - Go Test Your Maps Properly 
Test your maps in the most common engines (vanilla Winquake, Glquake as lowest denominator; DP for Murphy's law) is definitely not a waste of time. Fitzquake is not the Green Card as it's still more forgiving on certain things than other engines (e2m2 crash comes to mind, possibly maxedict-related issues too). The new version will make this even more problematic. 
Free Fallout Warfare Boardgame Rules 
Testing is fine but I'm not installing Linux to make sure that 2 extra people can play my level. If it works in software Quake, suck it up. :) 
do you test on Windows? 
No, I test on Mac. I test in Fitz and I test in the software Quake port that I have. 
ah, ok. 
This map just gave me a full-blown "when I first played Quake"-flashback. I did not have the original back then, so no soundtrack. Now I played with soundtrack. And somehow the mixture of the wonderful map, the dark music and the occasional feeling of being lost made me feel exactly like back then.

I wish there would be more maps like that. True Quake! \m/ ;) 
Turtle Map 
Can anyone help me with a definition of turtle map ? What is a turtle map, what makes it "turtle" ? I couldnt find answer by 
It's a map done in one week's time. 
What Zwiffle Said 
It's essentially a speedmap done slow. Not long enough for a proper release, but enough time to make something a lot more polished than you could in a few hours. 
for info. 
Castle Of Oblivion Rocks 
and is completable in less than 20 seconds ;D 
Woo, Back Online 
I got a new pc and a fast net connection. Yay!

Unfortunately my pc wont run fitzquake properly for some reason and the screen is just complete garbage. I get the same shit with all GlQuake versions too, so it is probably some stupid incompatibility with Quake and my gfx card :(

Specs below. If anyone has any idea how to solve this particular problem then please help

core 2 Quad 2.83
4gb ram
Radeon 4850 1gb
XP SP3, DX 9

I haven't yet investigated the weirder engines like darkplaces, but software quake works ok, so I can probably just about manage with bengt's winquake version for the time being. 
Try different driver verions: 
Maybe This One? 
Hell As Long As We're Spamming... 
Is That You Though?? 
Arrrrrgh It Is DZIP 
Yes Actually It Is 
i just want to say sorry Vondur and Lunaran


and dont put the fault on other people.. you are such a chirld... get a gun and shoot your self u frustrated fuck... 
try gl_ztrick 0 
frib/than: there's no ztrick in fitzquake, so that shouldn't help (if it does anyway, i'm confused) 
There is, and it does.

My display was completely fucked in Fitz when I got an ATI card. It took me ages to figure out what it was. I just had gl_ztrick 1 lingering in my config files from the old days.

Apparently gl_ztrick 1 uses a slightly dodgy method of clearing the depth buffer that isn't supported on ATI cards/drivers. At least that's what a graphics programmer at work said when I asked him about it - he could just be guessing. I suppose if anyone would know, it'd be you metl :D 
Actually, Metl 
You're probably right... my memory of this is very hazy (obviously) but now that I think about it, I think what really happened to me was that everything except FitzQuake was fucked, and FQ was the only one that worked properly.

I still had to figure out the problem and fix it so I could get my QW client and everything else working properly, but if this was the way it all went down then as you suggested, FitzQuake is the win and the rest lose. 
try gl_ztrick 0 
might work shamby ;)

my main point was to say i�m sorry to Lun and von :( that kid still didn�t growup



and sorry to anyothers but my blood is to hot :( boils very fast.

but i�m old enought to say i�m sorry and that i was wrong! 
Not old enough to shut the fuck about it though. 
There might be a word missing from that post. Not to worry, it'll show up somewhere else. 
it'll show up

oooo, subtle. 
It still worked. My brain inserted the missing word anyway. I actually had to read it 3 times to determine what was missing when you mentioned it... 
I love when the brain does that. Someone corrects something and I have to go back and look for the error since it was auto corrected in my head. 
This Is Mission Control... 
T-minus 3 hours until release of zombification gas is authorised 
That post even mentions bees, BEES!
Gotta get some func_zombie action going on tonight! 
Or The Valve Pack 
$100 - if you don't have the Orange box - comes with all Valve games.

Probably not much use to anyone here. 
Space Gameplay / Map 
you guys have ideas how to make space interesting in a space ship game? it annoys me that it's just some empty box with no real strategic stuff in it :(

It's obviously interesting for fps wing-commander likes, but for other game types? I'm thinking rpgish and/or tactics.

Homeworld somehow pulled it off.. but i can't really remember how they did it besides ressource asteroids. there was one (annoying) mission where you couldn't leave a certain path because of radiation around it. Probably can use nebulas that effect sensors,etc., too.

How do movies make space fight interesting? i remember something star trekish where they hid inside nebula.. 
Umm Well 
Gravity is extremely fascinating. And what about avalanche effects with asteroids. Theoretically you could send a huge asteroid to earth by pushing a small rock just a little in the asteroid belt if you had infinite calculation capability and infinite time - how they all affect each other and effects start to build up etc.

But you need different timescales to this than traditional airplane battle style space sims.

Think about the curved paths in space, slingshots from planets, everything... 
we're talking about months and years and hundreds of millions of kilometers...

Interestingly, manufacturing new units between battles becomes realistic too at these timescales. Red Alert etc were not remotely realistic in this sense.

Also sensor placement is interesting, since you can hide behind a planet or a moon completely. (on the surface too if it's tide locked the right way or if an atmosphere is obfuscating or something else). 
I Remember 
One Q2 mod that had the player fighting on top of asteroids floating in space.

Might sound lame, until I say that they were all rotating in three axis, and some got destroyed by various stuff. 
I made a dxf of an astroid ring, turned it into a mdl so I can use it ingame. Pity I can't make it turn out of corner axe, but it gives a spacey look.

In game it turns much slower, but I had no other screencapture. 
For Fun 
I Love 
Explosive Domino: there were some nice in Doom2 if i remember well :) 
Space In Star Trek 
Hiding in nebulae is a staple.

Trans-warp travel, subspace rifts, getting trapped in chaos space, getting trapped inside anomalies, getting trapped in a bubble where there are no stars, travelling through singularities, making certain areas full of enemies ("the Nortwest passage"), wormholes, parts of space where subspace got disrupted, so you cannot use warp drives, dark matter asteroids, "fluidic space", piloting a shuttle through a hole in an asteroid, asteroid obstacle courses, tractor beams moving asteroids around, blowing up asteroids that are falling toward planets, using gravity to catapult the ship through between two stars, subspace catapults, time travel, space races, building a vessel that uses solar winds... needing deflectors against space dust, which can be damaged/stolen by aliens...

Just off the top of my head. Mostly it's about the life forms encountered there, though.

Huge nerd? Yup. 
And Don't Forget, 
gravity wells, and mining newly formed gold from the heart of a Nova. 
the trouble with some of those is they are more like recycling tv scifi cliches and are not based on reality in any way.

Reality is often way cooler than what some lame script writers knowing nothing about space invent for the hundredth episode. 
The Most Annoying Thing EVA! 
When you size up a brush to just the right proportions, press enter and it turns out to be a TRIANGLE!!!! (because you forgot to set it to "square" mode) 
Marginally Late For Work 
Again this morning. I deserve the sack. The culprit - well I was ooh-so-close to sealing off a couple of new areas in my map (and did) at about 4 o clock this morning. Definately not the first time that has happened, but the first in a while.

Map is hovering at 26400 marksurfaces/clipnodes, with 53 lightmaps. :D 
My Girlfriend Left Me 
...also, my dog died. I'm sure I deserve it. I start wondering about the emptiness of my life at times like this, like an empty .map, filled with nothing but the potential of brushes and entities. A world ready to be made, if only I seize upon creation. 
Move Town 
A new start will put your head right. Fuck everyone else.


Go and get very drunk in the company of so-called freinds. T'will cleanse the sould.

Or the best solution which is better than anything else:-

(listen to this) 
Scampie get a gun and shoot your self... nobody will miss you... at least me

fucking lier!!! 
this is a map forum not Dr� Phil consultory !!! 
Trinca Has A Small Penis 
SleepwalkR ?
drugs problem? 
can�t open at work Ricky ;) 
Less youtube links, more mapping. 
i�m making and i shouldn�t :p 
Cant Map At Work Willem 

(imagine the voice of Bob Marley)

"....Singin' dont worry....
....'bout a 'ting..... ....cause...
....every little 'ting is gonna be alreit..."


Im mapping in my head ;-) 
Metl ? 
First, they drag you down to their level. Then they beat you with experience. 
Dr Phil Time 
Ran into the ex at the local Harris Teeter store chain that I usually avoid because she pretty much lives there. She spent the summer working out. At just under six feet tall, boyish figure, and Farrah hair, she looks more like a European supermodel than the waif I married.

Oh, she won this round without even a scratch. 
HL & HL2 In 60 Seconds. 
What's the difference of an European supermodel and a North American one? 
Few Thousand Miles..... 
i pussy is always a pussy everywhere!!! 
Matter Of Tradition 
American models of the Super status in the past tended to come from the calender girl market, whereas European Super models came out of the fashion industry and worked the runways before becoming famous. A difference in body type emphasis -- busty vs. lithe. This is less true now with some European models getting their first big breaks with Sports Illustrated where a robust body type is important, and American girls entering the Milan and Paris markets at younger ages. In other words, her body type is more like Kate Moss (except she has a better rack) than Christina Brinkley. 
I suspected something like that but you made it more precise.

Returning to the subject, my condolences for the experience.

Being happy with oneself is one thing many people have a hard time with. Other people play into this feeling a lot. 
true, but QINRL anyway. And has become its own cliche. 
Quake2World Project Seeks Veteran Level Designers 
Hi guys,

Many of the readers here have probably seen me mention the Quake2World Project ( in #tf by now, but I wanted to extend an invitation for your involvement here as well.

Quake2World is a Free stand-alone game with its roots planted firmly in its Quake2 heritage. It also blends some of the best gameplay characteristics of DOOM, QuakeWorld, and Quake3: Arena into a very fast-paced and straightforward deathmatch game. It also lends some interesting tools to level designers which were not available in the first three Quake titles, including per pixel lighting.

Our team is looking for experienced Quake level designers who are interested in producing high quality original works as well as classic remakes for our 1.0 general release, which I'm hoping can happen in the first half of 2009. The project is quite far along, and we are currently undergoing a stabilization and media acquisition phase.

In some cases, I might even be willing to pay you for your work. For more information, please join us in #quetoo on, or email me (address above).


[Edit: Help wanted thread] 
haha, that's tru d'n'b party! 
noob... the lower in here is 6� 
open air party + dancing like a freak = fuck yes. summer can't come fast enough... 
I Want This 
A book about LucasArts:,book-info/store,books/products_id,7497/
60$ is quite a lot though. :( 
open air party + dancing like a freak = fuck yes. summer can't come fast enough...

Dude, it's December. Don't get me thinking about summer now. Though it's pretty toasty here in Edinburgh. I'm currently typing with the fingers I don't have frostbite on. No joke. 
Knowing Chroniclebooks, it's probably worth it. They are the ones that puglish all the Pixar artbooks, and all of those are really great. 
That's a fantastic word creation! Let's make up a meaning for it.

to puglish: self defense technique in which the defender overwhelms the attacker by means of throwing a pug at the attacker's groin region; extra points if the pug bites the attacker's penis off 
Puglish (noun); a creole formed from a mixture of european languages combined with l33t and game specific acronyms spoken in a pick up group (primarily WoW, but also found in a variety of team games such as CS)

(I'm really, really sorry about the WoW reference) 
Q1 Quakeworld Ctf Poll For Thunderwalker Smackdown Extravaganza VI 
Come vote now for our event. (registration required)

Light up the season with Thunderwalker Smackdown Extravaganza VII
Saturday, December 20th
10 pm EST / 7 pm PST 
is there any major resource for skyboxes? so far I've just been using Kell's excellent ones, but I'm sure that plenty more exist... can anyone point me toward some urls?

Not Sure Which Of These... for what games, but there's a shitload of skyboxes at The Wadfather: 
This Made Me Rofl... 
That guy make any more comics? 
Headcrab Documentary 
Isn't There A Reserve Or Something? 
Very interesting... indeed ;) 
Impressing video,
I'm still waiting for Abe,
as the headcrabs really look like Squirts. 
Lol, Lunaran Left Us :( 
looks like the 'link to post' function on that board is.. broken firther down the page 
What he's doing there looks really nice. The lighting is killer! 
For those who don't want to click through: 
Greener Pastures 
He hasn't left us, he has at least:
1) cowardly run away to hide his amateurish works from our sharp eyes, feeling he is not worthy for the connoisseurs here (THEY SHOULD BE CRATES NOT FACELESS CONCRETE BLOCKS)
2) been fearing Trinca might say it's not for q1 and hence a waste of time and a battle will ensue
3) gotten more useful advice over there because they know q3 (also see 1 and 2)
4) become tired of the drama over here (see 2)

So let's be better and such a cool guy might return. 
ok, i will not bother you ladies lair.

kisses and hugs! 
Or maybe he took a dump on his dinner table and only later realised the smell. 
he told me a month or so ago that he just simply decided there was no real reason to come here anymore. 
Doesn't Count... 
...unless you quit with a big drama queen strop... 
megaman [] that was probably speedy :) 
So Basically 
He left after Willem called him "poison for this community"? 
Quake Command Line 
is there a way to start a lan coop server for quake and load a map all from the command line? like so i could just make a batch file?

and then is there a way to load up quake and connect to that server (from a different machine) from the command line? 
+coop 2 +map something


Basically you can add console commands/cvars with +.
I don't know offhand what the different coop modes do, but if I remember correctly coop 2 is the one I consider best.

Have fun! 
That Guy 
was me, 130.233.something

What/who did Lun poison? Did I miss something? Please plenty of drama in the answers (not). 
Re: 15788 
the problem i run into is that using +connect works fine, but when you start the game with +coop 1 +map whatever clients cannot connect.

it seems that, although it's running with the proper settings in the progs (letting you respawn in a map and stuff) it's not a true 'server' and is just running in singleplayer mode with coop rules. 
Have you tried adding -listen to the command line? 
Willem asserted that Lunaran is poison to this community. 
Well, Lunaran sure spread lots of negativism and shit. Hello SpaceHulk256?

necros: Oh, I indeed forgot about -listen. Try to add -listen X with X being the number of players. 
Fucking hell what a bunch of bitches ;) 
Willem Is The New Scampie 
Negke no way, Scampie is the most stupid fuck i ever met in the internet...

i wonder why is girlfriend left him...

Willen is just a nice guy that want to have some fun mapping and is sick of all this fucking bullshit.

this site already have been better then it is now, some guys get feedback becouse they are friend of someone, others are black sheep�s...

I don�t give a shit because real life eat me alive and like qw died for me, Q1SP is almost getting the same...

No problem at all, something will born again!

And don�t say sorry for nothing because this is General Abuse Threat and I can whine iis here as much as I want :p

P.S-> Headtrhump, Ricky and rudl i�m still waiting for your demos my friends &#61514;

P.S2-> metlslime, kona, than e.t.c. thks for the nice comments on my works!

Peace and love!

I want to wish a merry Christmas and a Happy new Year to all .

Have a good life! 
Hey, The Gift Crate Is Back, 
God bless ye merry gentlemen!

P.S-> Headtrhump, Ricky and rudl i�m still waiting for your demos my friends &#61514;

I've put a few relatives up for the Christmas season. I thought they were going to the right thing and stay at a local hotel and schedule a few get-togethers, nope, they showed up at my door. Damn free loading hippies!

Anyway, once I get my life back, Trinca, I can't wait to play some Quake again. 
The gift wrapped box at the top intrigues me. What could be inside? It's so exciting! Somebody shake it and listen... 
Oh I Agree With Lun's QTE Rant 
it was on point and had good insights. Advancing the understanding of game design and mechanics at least for people like me.

Some call it impotent whining. Well, this is the internet.

Negative feedback is mostly overrepresented because if everything seems fine, there isn't that big of an urge to write.

After having browsed Lun's blog a bit, I think he has some critical insights into some other things too. Yes there's a negative tone to much of this kind of writing. Maybe I symphatize (?) with it cause I'm a bit like that myself as well. 
It sounds you're acting as manager...
When a map is good, it is normal, so no way to thank people and to congrat them.
When it bad, OMG, it is so pleasant to flame them...
Do have sexual pleasure flaming people or what ? 
thanks spirit + lurker, everything works now! 
please come back to finish the flame war. 
It's Finished 
Fuck Christmas 
I don't think Lunaran was negative about Spacehulk256 - just honest.

Having said that, he's not an easy guy to like.

Func is typically informative, interesting and occasionally funny.

Complaining about stuff (even if it's done well) until someone takes the bait - I don't see the point.

Stand up comic might be a more logical career choice - then you can complain about everything and people applaud you for it. Doing it on a messageboard is pretty much like that word used a few posts up. 
The gift wrapped box at the top intrigues me. What could be inside? It's so exciting! Somebody shake it and listen...

I bet it is a crate! 
So I Shook 
Actually Seriously 
That thread was uncalled for. A real bitchy thing. 
I Missed That 
thread the 1st time around, I must say I lol'ed.

Its the internet, stop taking everything so seriously :) 
Uncalled For? 
It was a genius act of satire. FFS are you Trinca or something? 
"It was a genius act of satire."

It was demeaning and hurtful and did nothing to unify or further the community. It's a small enough niche as it is - should we really support shitting on each other? 
Satire? Satire is intelligent and constructive.

But yeah, it's really great to drag nice projects in the mud! ZOMGLOLZ!!!1 
should we really support shitting on each other?

Well, I say definitely no.... but as it seems to be the general rule here: let's go for shit ! 
Bunch Of Cock. 
Get a grip ladies. The SpaceHulk mapping competition was a good idea but somewhat OTT in the way it was presented, Lun spoofed that BIG FUCKING DEAL.

Can't believe I have to get involved to justify the utterly bleeding obvious, someone made a joke thread on the forum jesus christ. Have you all been smoking the same crack Trinca does??

P.S. Spirit satire is not intelligent and constructive at all, it's pointed and funny and occasionally cruel - welcome to humour.

*rolls eyes* 
Te He He 
Sometime ago Xen did this to show how happy a flame war made him feel, hope it doesn't get fucked in the HTML of things: '<jackingoff>Flame War!</jackingoff>'

Truly a magical time. 
Bunch of cock.


::...---===[({ ^ 8===D ^ })]===---...:: 
should we really support shitting on each other?

I'm actually into that. Especially when the person has been eating a lot of something spicy, like curry.

It's tingly then, when you rub it in.

^^^That's humor. Albeit, somewhat disgusting and sensationalistic humor, but it falls into that big ol' grey area between "hurtful and demeaning" and "unifying and furthering the community". I'm baffled at some of you taking stuff seriously that was never meant to be taken seriously.

Honestly, I feel like I'm at a tea party with the pastor's grandmother, and I'm having to explain that when she heard a guy on the street say "Fuck off" to another guy, that person wasn't actually talking about sexual intercourse, and that it didn't mean that they were actually *on top of* something, and, and... *shakes head*

(Also, Shamby, thanks for saving me some time; I can just say, oh, also, "What Shambler said") 
Yeah, we're all just way too sensitive. More abuse is what this community really needs. It isn't nearly small enough. 
sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah sugeti pula toti mah 
It Was Very Funny 
but surely people realise its also the sort of thing that can come across as moronic and high and mighty?

but that is a line that Lun walks all the time too. 
You Have Really Got To Be Kidding Me 
Please tell me you guys are taking the piss. Crikey, no wonder Lun doesn't want to come back here...

*stern voice* oh no, mother wouldn't approve! 
For god sake!!

1 - We're ALL scum!

2 - We all shit, piss, fuck, fuck up, die, stink and then rot.

3 - The sooner we can all accept this, the sooner we can get on with living.

4 - Its a Quake mapping forum, not the fucking houses of parliament, or the people's court. 
heh, i was just pointing out the obvious both ways. 
Stranger Than Fiction 
Cock is also the name of a city in Italy.

Wondering if it has a sister city. 
I Quite Like A Community... 
...where people take the piss all the time, but when it comes to enjoying gaming, mapping, playing new maps, creating stuff, giving feedback, appreciating others' work, we all know the score and respect what goes on. Banter, even really bitchy stuff, is compatible with a good community. Well it was 8 years ago anyway... 
If you're looking for a good example of Lun ruining things for everybody, that StealthQuake420 thread wasn't it. It wasn't vindictive, it was just messing about and making fun of quake mapping contests in general. The reference to the coagula mapping contest where everyone credited Elek, and the three-initials-username-only judging panel were hilarious, I loved it. Lun even said:

I'm glad some of you got it. I really hope the cancellation isn't because of me, because I was just playing the court jester. Biting, but ultimately good natured.

I actually think there are some great examples of lun being a dick and bringing down the mood of a load of threads, but those posts are usually short and sarcastic... his longer posts are usually quite informative and interesting.

Like Shambler was saying though, I'm all for banter and light hearted ribbing, that's what this place was built on, and it's usually done in love rather than hate I think.

There's no need for huge amounts of cynicism and snide comments though, it doesn't make you cool, it just makes you look insecure and it's incredibly fucking unendearing. It reminds me of someone I know who spends most of his time being pessimistic and pedantic about everything. "The club is shit!" "I hate the music, the DJ is terrible" "Oh, those people are dancing really well aren't they...?" and so on and so on.

You can tell that in his head, he's too cool for school, and by insulting all this stuff, he comes off as superior to it all. The reality is he's a miserable fuck you don't want to hang around with. 
It's water off a ducks back unless you're so involved that the least little thing can piss you off.

Having said that there are those who enjoy the game and doing stuff for it, like Distrans, who get put off by the bullshit.

The bullshit that caused the 256 comp to be qausi-cancelled wasn't some thread on a messageboard, but a spam attack by some group of little doughnut punchers meant shutting it down was better than keeping it running.

Having said that, Distrans kept an eye on func and I 'won' a statue for the map I made.

When saying before that I thought Lunaran was just being honest about the 256 thing I thought Spirit meant the comment on the map, not the comp as a whole - I didn't think of the sarky thread because I'd mentally wrote it off. </shrug>

And finally:

The first two are poor quality taken from my phone at the office, the last one being at home when it had just arrived. David was pretty pleased with how everything turned out - he also mentioned that if I had any commisions for him he'd be more than happy to make them.

So if you want a Maquette of a game chracter getting dismembered for your mantlepiece then let him know. Probably too late for christmas though. 
And that's one of Spirit's runes on the shelf next to it to the left as well, laid flat. 
You Know 
I'm actually super pissed cuz I was looking forward to mapping for that fiend. Then when it was called off I was like "feck, i really wanted that fiend." And then it turned out that the compo continued anyway! WTF! I feel cheated, and I blame Lunaran completely. He owes me a fiend statue. 
To Fribbsles 
You get pissed because people are stupid enough to get pissed?

You notice?

You can't win. 
Stop channeling Tyler Durden ;-) 
I'm all for joking around and ribbing, I'm just not for mean spirited and spiteful comments. That's all. 
Anyway, back to mapping, people! :) 



I've been away from the net for a week, and while I could post a long rant explain exactly why a large chunk of you seem to be being hypocritical, overly sensitive and destructively pampering... I can't be arsed.

Apparently someone who often provide intelligent, well reasoned if occasionally aserbic comments has decided to take a vacation from the forum (he'll return, everyone does) due to the inability of (some of) the user base to appreciate his humour and for recieving excess vitriol for posting his opinion (a gross hypocrisy that few seem to have pointed out or appreciated). From where I'm sitting, that's a bad thing for the community. You know, that thing you keep purporting to support. Personally, I think a community that has a variety of opinions (some of which you'll agree with, some of which you won't) is going to be stronger and more productive than everyone in mass agreement and pandering to the sensibilities of the most insecure/sensitive member. Otherwise you may as well just talk to yourself and be done.

I cannot understand the mentality that supports, or the point of, a forum where rants about IRC drama and complaining someone is daring to work on content for a game you don't play is a valid post while informative yet sarcastic intelligence is condemmed. Get over yourselves and your precious creations. It's a game.

(Yes. That was the abbrievated version ;) 
"Get over yourselves and your precious creations. It's a game."

Wow, that's fairly insulting. To everyone. Nice work. 
Hey Guys Whats Goin' On 
Orl - Nowt, Just Chillin', Smokin Some Bud... 
Theres a little gecko walking through the rain forest one day, when he comes across a tree with a koala bear in it. He looks up at the tree:

"Whoa - you must be Mr Koala Bear, I'm Mr Gecko, very pleased to meet you sir!"

"Oh, er, well, er, its very nice to meet you too, Mr Geko!" The koala bear replied.

"So, er, what you doin'?" asked the gecko...

"Oh, not much really" said the koala bear - "just sat chillin', munchin on these eucalyptus leaves, smoking this reefer!"

"Really?" asked the gecko "Whats a reefer?"

"Well, you get these leaves, and you roll them into a joint, then you smoke them like this - its pretty cool.... Hey, er, if your not doing anything, you can come up here and join me!"

"Well that would be mighty nice, I think I will...."

So as the story goes, the gecko and the koala bear sat up the tree getting stoned for about 4 hours, when eventually the gecko turned to the koala bear and said

"Well, er, this has been mighty fun, sitting here with you this afternoon, but I must admit, man, I'm feeling pretty thirsty, I think I'm gonna go to the river for a little drink!"

"OK" said the koala bear, "I'll see you later?"

So off went the gecko, through the trees and down to the river, where he bumps into Mr Crocodile

"Oh! Hi there Mr Crocodile, how you doin man?"

"Im fine, Mr gecko, but you certainly look a bit pale"

"Ah - well that probably because I've been sat smoking reefer with Mr Koala Bear all afternoon"

"Smoking Reefer?!?!?" said the crocodile....

"Yes, with Mr Koala Bear"

"Mr Koala bear hey? Well I think I'm gonna go and have a word with this character, where is he?"

"Well he's just past those trees over in the distance there...."

So off to find the koala bear went the crocodile, and when he got tot he tree, he looked up at the koala bear, who dropped his joint, and with a stunned expression on his face shouted......





That's A Good Joke And Made Me Laugh. 
And one I actually hadn't heard before. Thank you! Nice presentation too. :)

Wow, that's fairly insulting. To everyone.

I'm not insulted. In context, I didn't find that insulting in the slightest. And I'm pretty sure I'm part of "everyone". *checks membership card* Yep.

Perhaps it's possible that all people on the forum don't have exactly the same reactions and opinions as you? Granted, it's a stretch, but I'm crazy like that... 
When did func get so emotional? 
Games And Shizzle. 
I don't know what to say about this any more.

Banter is good. Sharp vitriolic wit is good. Games are good mapping is good online communities small or large are good feedback is good demos are good websites about gaming are good general chitchat with like-minded people is good and I'm off to the fucking pub. 
personally, it was when i started menstruating. Maybe we should set up a poll? 
This Insult Is To Willem Personally ;) 
man, you're an easily insulted guy! 
"I'm not i