A thought for Sock: The QuakeC extensions check is only for what language extensions a server has. That's why they are QuakeC extensions. In single player, that's the same thing as the server.

But it sounds like you are doing coop too.

Remember, a regular Quakespasm client and a DarkPlaces client could be connect to a Quakespasm Spiked server.

Doing checkextension("DP_TE_PARTICLERAIN") tells doesn't tell you anything about a client.

Send some WriteByte wizardry to regular Quakespasm client and it'll crash out? Quakespasm Spiked R25 have new extension that uses WriteByte (that DarkPlaces doesn't have and R24 doesn't have) and DarkPlaces or Quake Spiked R24 as client to R25 server gets unexpected message and crashes out after 5 minutes because explosion effect sends unexpected bytes?

/Please let me be wrong and that I haven't found the achilles heal of the QuakeC extension system where even a server never knows what clients will work --- it just needs to run the progs and maybe the client crashes out eventually or maybe it doesn't. Hope to hear "Baker is completely wrong because ..." as next Spike post ... 

(I mean to post that in Quakespasm Spiked thread. Grrrrr ....) 

The maps are great, yes. Fantastic even. But they owe some of their qualities to this mod and its features. The greatness of the the entire package lies in how the maps and the mod mesh together.
I still believe that when the maps and the mod features are combined, that is what makes the experience special. Some maps in AD are certainly better than others, but they all heavily rely on AD features. There is also a third factor that many people outside the mod don't realize, the relentless drive for quality! I certainly hassled, pestered and pushed everyone to be aware of consistent visuals, good details and constant testing.

That's not to say there is no flaws or faults in AD maps because there certainly is, just that constantly testing is a good trait to adopt when creating community content. 

I actually thought some of the AD maps were too big. I would get tired of playing, save and come back the next day
I have been saying this in private for a long time. I spoke to ijed about this when he was developing RRP and mfx when he was developing swampy. I do think there is something nice about a map finish screen for breaking the experience down into manageable chunks of time. Quake gameplay can blur into one long killing spree at times and the final map screen is a good natural break.

I also understand why large maps exist because getting lost in a large world is a very cool experience and if done right can be very rewarding for the player. With all the extended limits available it is just so much easier to get carried away and just keep creating more and more.

There is no easy answer to this and there will always be a divide in the community about what should be the right amount of map content. Probably the number one concern that a mapper should be aware of when creating episode/large maps is ...

The larger content, the more testing that will be required! :P 

This discussion kind of reminds me of the ECHELON megawad for Doom that was just released, where the author really kept a lid on the scope of the individual maps
I did consider making all the AD maps into one large episode, but you have to understand that mappers are like herding cats! Forcing community mappers to keep to one direction is never an easy thing to do and certainly has issues with motivation.

In the end I think the diverse creativity of the AD maps is cool, every map has its own unique vibe and they are all feel like a different book in a grand library. Each map is a good short story with different environments, personal details and can be completed however you like.

I don't understand why everything has to be a linear structure, when the player can finally decide how they want to experience the game. Quake has always been a diverse set of worlds, do we really need to force episodic structures on everything we create for Quake? 

So, is there any sort of ETA on 1.5 or is it "when it's done"?
There is too many loose ends with AD 1.5 before it can be released. I would love to give a fixed date, but it is not possible at the moment.

If you want a weekly fix of what progress is happening with the MOD, keep an eye on the twitter feeds of the team as that is where the eye candy is posted. Otherwise its just, wait and see ... 

I don't understand why everything has to be a linear structure, when the player can finally decide how they want to experience the game.

Not everything. The thing is: everything became the opposite lately. It's also not exactly about linearity. You can have a hub of 10 maps you can play in any order, and still make it feel like a single journey.

And no, it's not calling the recent works lazy crap or anything like that. The focus might have been shifted, but the quality is undeniable. Though something tells me I can get away with more because I'm not Mugwump. 

An episode would be a nice thing to try to do in the future, and would limit lengths single maps can be anyway since you'd need someone specified as the lead designer to say "X item is on the main path of Y level, with Z in a secret" etc type decisions to pace out the episode. If you can't collect every single item in Quake in a single map, giant maps become very boring.

Likely as a team you would make the decision "levels should take on average 10 minutes to complete" as a rough baseline of pacing anyway. And perhaps even need some deadlines for mappers so everyone can discuss and revise together on a scheduled pace.

As a future project with an understanding of "no new mod features" to make it more manageable, maybe it would be a fun project to do and expand on AD. 

no new mod features
Haha. Ya. Right. 

I believe it was about working with features already present in AD, instead of still working on the mod as the mapping goes. 

Probably the number one concern that a mapper should be aware of when creating episode/large maps is ...

The larger content, the more testing that will be required! :P

Yep, still trying to adjust to that realization. I was going for a small map but I myself wasn't satisfied with the amount of content so now it has grown into a medium sized map and I hope to keep it there.

The tough thing is any new area you create in a map also requires detailing, textures, lighting, gameplay/logic elements, testing.

That's a hefty workload due to having a "good idea" for an additional area!

I can't fathom what the AD mappers are dealing with! 

oh.

Yeah, I'm not sure that criticising AD for "lack of narrative" or "episodic content" is really warranted or even makes any bloody sense considering the size of the maps and the modular, open structure of the entire project.

Makes for good drama though. 

I think the idea was thrown about but it didn't really catch 

I for one think AD is the best nod ever made for Quake. Not only are the maps and features high quality, but the qc code is very well commented and thoroughly consistent. Also the qc structure is pleasant since many boilerplate functions have been rolled into one, saving code and making maintainability very easy. It's impressive to say the least. 

 

 

no new mod features
Haha. Ya. Right.

I was thinking this more as a side project, maybe done by the community, rather than part of the mod. Just get together and make a set of maps and use what already exists. 

I think it's comments like yours that create drama.

Again: no one is out to get your favorite mod. No one is calling it crap. There's no reason to get defensive. 

Never thought I'd see someone accusing me of whiteknighting a mod. That's gotta be a first.

It's called having an opinion. God help us if that catches on. 

I can't see any other reason for seeing drama where there isn't. Or trying to create it.

But I'm sure you have it.

It's called having an opinion.

A good phrase to wave around when you're in an uncomfortable position. 

If you're so against drama then why are you still going on about it, you massive winking sphincter? 

To see what kind of fallacy you'll pull next, obviously. 

When it comes to creating fallacies I think you're winning by a fucking mile. Just re-read your posts and try to have a little more self-awareness and a little less hypocrisy. It'll make this shit less drawn out. 

 

I urge you to reconsider the target/name234 not for 1.5 thing. It's a very useful feature and in my view should be added sooner rather than later. Is it really that much work - how much more than than an addition to SUB_UseTargets?