That's wierd too, because I did use -tjunc when I compiled it. Maybe DuBSP's -tjunc doesn't work or something, but I can't really tell if the sparkles are a problem or not because I don't get them in TeleJano.
Thanks for the demo Vondur!
are there because the map leaks, then tjunction calculations aren't done. I've now sealed the map and thereby reduced the # numportals from 12k to 4k and made a full vis/light. The original had only fast vis/light.
With brighter lightning, this map looks very good.
any chance of me having it?
If Zwiffle Permits
but I believe he's got enough information to make a new version already that he could release if he wants to. I'd prefer that since it's his map.
Zwiffle: What do you want to do?
I've got the lighting done, but I don't wanna mess around with leak problem (i'm tired of the map) but since you sealed the map and re-lit it feel free to distribute it as you see fit.
Would it be OK for me to send you my modified version of q1tm3_zwiffle so you can host it along with the original (i.e. not replacing it)?
just email it to me, email@example.com
can also be caused by conflicts in the UV coordinates of the two adjacent brushes when they are textured on facing sides )ones not meant to be seen). Caulking solves this in Q3. I don't know what the Quake I solution for this would be but I have never heard it mentioned as an option in a Quake I forum.
are you talking about z-fighting? Otherwise i don't really understand.
sparklies can at times result from z-fighting. This article does a good job of explaining the problem.
But That's Not Really The Same Thing.
they look sparkly, but are not tjunc sparklies. :)
that article is complete bullshit too... z-fighting doesn't occur when brushes join like that. he thrashs csg-hollow, and then makes even WORSE brushwork. and caulking the outside of brushes? whoever wrote this 'tutorial' has absolutly no understanding of bsp or how to map and should be taken out back behind the chemical sheds and shot.
so, bsp tools do the same thing in q3 engine games as they do for q1, right? they remove all the outside faces? (i'm guessing that's what some of the "bullshit" was refering too)
pardon the ignorance, i've never touched q3 engine mapping. :D
should have added: what _is_ caulking for? i've always seen it as sort of redundant, because faces the player can't see are going to be facing the other way anyway (the normals are pointing away from the player) so thye wouldn't be drawn anyway.
That Misleading Bastard
Scamp, you can borrow my shotgun for that surgical strike. I have had that dumb idea in the back of my head for sometime, even though it contradicted what I have come across in the better forums moderated by the likes of Ydnar. I apoligize for this -- I have a few recommendations for clearing this up though -- ones that shouldn't land us on death row any way.
Here is a forum with the same discussion and some of the same misunderstandings that had to be cleared up.
and this appears to be a better tutorial for those that need it. http://fps.brainerd.net/sparklestut.htm
Caulk And Q3, Moh, And Quake.
caulk can be used for:
-faces you'll never see becuase they are always facing away, so that they don't waste lightmaps or space in memory/on disk (even though as you say, if they are facing away they won't be rendered.)
In quake you can't do this (though there's a "skip" texture that Tyrann or someone created which a special utility can remove.)
-faces that you never see becuase they are behind a curve patch or some detail brushes. They need to be there becuase curves and detail don't seal the bsp hull. But if they are drawn, they not only waste memory and lightmaps, but they also eat fillrate and can cause z-fighting if the patch or detail faces are co-planar or nearly so.
Quake doesn't need this becuase it doesn't have detail or bezier patches. Though there are often faces inside door frames or behind bmodels that you never need to see, these are so few in most quake maps that it doesn't matter much.
-faces on detail brushes that you don't need, but are there becuase a brush has to be complete even if all you wanted was one face to be drawn. This is less of a reason in q3 becuase detail brushes are CSGed together, but in MoH it's essential, becuase they are not.
Quake doesn't have detail brushes and its CSG is much more strict, so there is never a problem of extra faces or overlapping faces or anything like that. (except sometimes with bmodels overlapping world geometry, but that can be avoided easily by the mapper.)
is it up yet?
It Probably Would
have been if I had tested the map more carefully before sending it off. Those nasty clipping errors ...
Anyway, Scampie's got a fixed version now and if he doesn't discover anything fatal, it should hopefully come up pretty soon.
heh, you're lucky I noticed it... first time I ran into it, there was a knight standing at the same point, so I thought I was running into that and not a clip brush sealing the silver key room off :D
I'll put it up when I get home in about 2 hours.
q1tm3_zwiffle updated by aguiRe map, rename the old file if you want to compare/keep the original as this has the same filename.
thanks for the good explanation! i hadn't thought of those other instances where caulk would be useful.
played the modified lighted version. I have to say, this map was the most fun gameplay wise in the whole pack. Nice job!
Visuals werent bad either, now that I could actually see. Texturing was pretty cool, perhaps the red and blue floor tiles were a bit too gawdy but overll pretty solid. Nice touches with the spikes on the roofs. IMHO, the onyx bit at the end was the coolest.
Now go and make a proper map, if you can kep the gameplay as fun and improve your lighting, it'd be well worth playing.
I can't believe I forgot to take the piss out of the end of Zwiffle's map. Actually I think that's because I can't believe I actually played that entirely random bit of anti-themed nonsense at the end, I'm sure I hallucinated it in a fit of dizzines/flatulence (delete as applicable) brought on by playing all 4 turdle maps in one go.
Lev's Onslaught Map
can be quite fun if you just add the DBS, GL and some 20 rockets to the player's inventory at startup. Plus lower the minlight a bit.
It would probably also gain a lot from getting rid of many of the "200" lights and replacing them with ambient sunlight.