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Quoth: Expansion Mod Pack For Q1SP
The intention behind Quoth is to provide a large portion of content in as easily accessible form as possible for both players and mappers. The components are designed to be consistent with each other as well as the original id content. More is under development and updates will be released as and when they are ready. Yes we are mad, but ours is a madness brought on by divining the blasphemous truths of a terrible cosmos. Or something.

More info, download and images:
http://www.planetquake.com/necros/quoth/

Direct download ( FilePlanet, sadly ) :
http://www.fileplanet.com/dl.aspx?/planetquake/necros/quoth.zip (22 meg)

This pack contains several monster/weapon/power-up modificiations, and some test maps. Additional full map releases posted below...
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Light_marsh 
ok, I want to set the colour to red, but when I do ("color" - "5") tyrlight quits with an error saying that there aren't 3 values for color.

How do you get marshlights to work properly?

I thought color in tyrlight was set with "_color" anyway. Grr.

...it is set with _color... AND
"v0.90
- Downgraded "not 3 values for color" to a warning for compatability with some QC mods."

Hmm... HELP! I'm using tyrlite 0.97 
Another Thing 
the info_screenshake doesn't seem to work. Maybe I didn't set it up correctly?

ltime 12
multiplier 2 
 
negike: no, you can't customize skins on any of the monsters

than: have no idea about the compiler thing... unless you need coloured lighting, use aguire's light program? (or does aguire's do coloured lighting too now?)

as for screenshake, not sure why it's not working except:
try using higher values for multiplier (10ish) and go from there
also, make sure that there is a direct link from the trigger to the info_screenshake. if a monster or lightning or anything other than the player triggers it, the screen won't shake, same like how centerprints won't print for the player unless he is the direct activator. 
Necros 
cheers, the screenshake works now... 10 is a bit much though! 
Re: Screenshake (and Some Other Q's) 
You mentioned in the above post that the info_screenshake needs to be activated directly by the player for it to work. I have this set up and it works fine now, but surely there is a problem with coop. Will other players experience the screenshake?

What about the shake from the Gug?

Is it possible to implement screenshake that emenates from a point in the map and affects all nearby players?

I vaguely remember screenshake being used in Scourge (not sure, since it was a while since I last played it) and it also moved the player around a bit. I don't need this in particular, but were it a spawnflag, I would probably check it :)

Finally, I had a look in the Marcher txt file the other day and noticed Kinn mentioned something about entity grouping. I'm not sure, but I think it was a feature of the qc he was using. He said in the readme that it allowed the map to work on low capacity engines (i.e. not Aguire's GLQuake or DP). Do you know anything about this? Does Quoth use it?

Currently I am about 80% complete of the first large section of my map (basically the size of a fairly large level) and am wondering whether or not to just finish that section and release it as a level, or go ahead and proceed with the next large section (probably the same size again).

Currently I'm only at 6000 brushes (19,000 surfs after compile) so I have a bit more room in that respect, but probably not enough precache slots to add all the funcs I might need if I decide to double the size of the level.

I'm also debating whether or not to split the map up as you originally suggested, so that more people can play it, and it can be played in FitzQuake (as God intended!) It would be cool for the level to be one HUGE environment, and certainly more impressive to walk around, but I wonder if you were right in suggesting that I split it.

Maybe splitting it would allow me to take my mind of Q1 mapping for a while and do something more beneficial for my career :) 
 
you could try using the seamless level transition. it will carry your kills over across the maps, but other things like secrets and playing times won't, so it's not that greatest solution.

as for screenshake, i didn't really put much thought into it, tbh. it's just a minor atmosphere thing, so i hadn't even considered in coop.

the gug should shake all players though. 
Re: Entity Grouping 
actually, i never really understood what kinn was talking about for that, except for the horde spawn things.

so i don't think quoth does it, but maybe i inadvertantly did it, who knows... o.o 
It Was A Cvar... 
in his readme, Kinn says that... well, here's a quote:

Impulse 152: Toggle Entity Grouping

Entity grouping is ON by default; This enables a form of edict compression that allows the map to be playable in engines without increased MAX_EDICTS. It should have no visible effect on gameplay. If you turn entity grouping OFF, be warned; the map will only be loadable in high-capacity engines, and you will most likely suffer a performance hit. Requires a map restart.


Sounds interesting, whilst at the same time sounds like it won't help with precache ents at all.

I'm guessing that it's related to the monster spawning, as you say. Maybe monsters of the same type that are spawn triggered using the same targetname can be loaded without requiring an edict for each one until they are spawned. 
Than 
"v0.90 - Downgraded "not 3 values for color" to a warning for compatability with some QC mods."

Although I fixed that it v0.90, it looks like I fucked it up again in version 0.95. Easy to fix though - I'll see if I can get to it this weekend. 
Good Show! 
nice one, tyrann :) 
Than 
Fixed version of TyrLite is on now available on my site. 
While(Tyrann == TheDon) GiveBeer(largeGlass); 
Thanks, Tyrann. I will go back to using your wonderful program now - even though Aguire's light program isn't noticeably and better or worse :) 
Gug!, Plasma Gun 
Top work guys, Thanks. Love the gug, e1m1quoth and kell's test maps. (Haven't played the extra maps yet).

{..get down on my belly and beg mercy, as I have a criticism}

The plasma gun - am I missing something? It's a shitty model, animation and sound, and, umm, it looks like a penis. [[[Ikka's mod would fit in ~more~.. (and it never got overused in the first place)]]] 
Coorst 
THE SPIRIT ADVENTERES OF THE chanel 
O_O 
wtf? 
Error 
I get this error when trying Quoth per the instructions. Quake launches, and then in a dialog box I get:

Quake Error
W_GetLumpinfo: inv_laser not found
 
Phait 
Somehow you're not using the Quoth gfx.wad file (inside pak0), make sure that no other gfx file overrides it and that you're using the -hipnotic option. 
I'm Using -hipnotic 
But how do I find whether no other file is overriding it? It's all in it's own directory (Quoth), set up proper as far as I can tell. 
Check 
that gfx.wad is inside pak0 in the Quoth dir and that no other paks exist in that dir. What engine and cmd line are you using?

The error occurs when the engine requests a Hipnotic specific object in the gfx file due to the -hipnotic option. The std Q1 gfx doesn't contain that object.

If it still doesn't work, try another engine or make cmd line and cfgs as simple as possible. 
Something Desperately Needed In "Quoth2" 
One of the best things about Quake is the combat with weak enemies.

This is why the early maps are special like E1M1, E1M2, E1M3 and also why Quake takes away all your guns at when you return to the start map.

The WORST problem with multi-map packs is that usually you will have all the heavy weapons and therefore the map is packed with tougher monsters, which are often kind of boring to fight because it is only their hitpoints that makes them a challenge.

Some of the best single player maps use zombies in a very effective way. Even 1 zombie can be a real threat if you don't have a way to kill it.

Maybe something that could make Quoth more useful is having a worse kind of zombie, like a really rotted dark zombie, that is like a regular zombie (just a reskin) except it can't be killed except with Quad damage or has to be killed with the axe (more interesting and annoying, hehe) or it has to be squished with a map element.

Or maybe Quoth should have a way for a map author to remove some/all weapons at intermission somehow maybe with the ability to set an intermission "story" of what happened like ... "As you stared into the void that was this horrible place, you inadvertently knocked your rocket launcher off the ledge ..."

This would allow a subsequent map to not have to be loaded with the tougher monsters for at least a while allowing natural map progression to happen.

Anyway, just a thought. I personally think the later levels in Quake are somewhat repetitive and boring because I don't think the "tough" monsters again and again and again are very interesting to fight. 
Interesting Viewpoint 
I dont really agree because you can have progression with 'tougher' monsters too, although it would come from number and placement.

but interesting viewpoint. 
Rain/Snow ? 
There was a level of Nehahra that had a snow effect, and of course at least one of the Nehahra movie demos had a rain effect.

I'm sure those 2 effects require a engine modification and it's been a long time since so I don't recall if those effects were localized or actually affected the entire map.

Just throwing this out, part of me would really like to see things like localized fog, rain, snow and translucent glass be part of Quake.

/Although I know the argument about how those are standard Quake engine features, but neither is max_edicts > 600 or farclip > 4096. 
Neh Snow/Rain 
doesn't require custom engines, as you'd know if you'd tried playing Nehahra with my WinQuake ...

Just add the -nehahra option and try out e.g. neh3m3 for snow and neh3m4 for rain.

There are of course other things in Nehahra that require custom engines, but not those effects. 
Zerstorer 
also had rain on the second level. That worked in plain old dosquake :)

Glass can be faked in Quoth using water brushes with solid colour textures and then by using the entity that I forgot the name of that allows you to set console variables like r_wateralpha from within the game. There are a few other things that you need to be aware of, but making glass in this way isn't too bad. 
Snow/Rain 
I guess I knew Zerstorer had rain ;)

I'll have to try -nehahra with Enhanced WinQuake and see what snow looks like in software out of curiosity. 
In Nehahra 
You can use the alpha key as well, which is an engine specific feature, but allows transparent entities - func_walls, enemies, whatever.

AguirRe's Nehahra engine also has an -id1 option to play the game in normal quake but under that engine, to maintain the extra visual effects. I think there's another engine that supports alpha keys as well.

Spose the problem is that anyone playing the map without an alpha supporting engine won't see the glass, just a solid brush. 
Well, Guys... 
I dont think its unreasonable in this day and age for a mapper to demand that players use specific engines to view their work!

I mean my last map used coloured lights, and some of the lights had a coloured source texture, i.e. a red light - people who choose to view the map with an engine which doesnt support coloured lights are silly :-P Especially if they then complain that the lights were crap, or looked silly with white light coming from a red light-source!!

The glass thing - fuck it man!! Make levels with windows, glass ceilings and everything, and honestly, as long as you document your engine choices properly, so that people have no excuses for not knowing that they were supposed to use engine "X" or "Y", then they have no right to complain about it!!! :D

Question: - Can you ad "r_wateralpha" "0.3" to the worldspawn?

Im pretty sure (havent fully experimented yet) that Quoth users can have their "info_player_start" inside a "trigger_once" which targets an "info_command", with "r_wateralpha" "0.3" so as to automatically start the player off in the level with transparent water activated.

Also - panes of glass - this works right?:

"classname" "func_wall"
".alpha" "0.3"

This doesnt require the water hack?

Also you could add the

".alpha" "0.3"


bit to a monster to give a ghostly effect?
(hehe - "effects" "4" would give a translucent glowing monster)

:D 
RickyT 
I sended Than's GlasTest by email.
It has a workaround from his use of transparant glass in Quake1. 
Thanks Madfox 
Yeah, I got that!! I'll have a look at it in a bit!! :D 
Note 
if you use metlslime's skip tool instead of tyrann's really old one, you shouldn't encounter problems with vis when trying to make glass from water brushes. Metl's tool works a charm, whilst Tyrann's was experimental and sometimes you ended up with very obvious problems. 
Confirmed 
metlslime's skip tool is really working well ;) 
So JPL Is Using Glass Hack For His Glass? 
Is it even possible to use a ".alpha" key on brushmodels (or any models for that matter)?

Where did I get this from :-o ? 
RickyT23 
It is possible to use alpha on func_wall for sure, maybe func_door (not sure), but it is not supported by all engines. However, using metlslime's skip tool is supported by most of enhanced engines. The r_wateralpha settings must be set, either in your cfg file, or in the map using Quoth's trigger_command/item_command entities... It's uo to you ;) 
So Its Just A Matter Of Going... 
...Bah! to weird engine users!

Surely it *could* look better if you can have some texturing on panes of glass, squeaky clean glass would look a bit wierd in a generally grubby quake environment, a slightly more 'textured' glass might look more realistic....

So I would ASSUME that FitzQuake, Darkplaces and AgurRe's engines all support ".alpha" keys, they seem to collectively support most stuff like this together...
I would also ASSUME that Tomaz/JoeQuake type engines dont.

??? 
Reckon That's It 
And you can apply alpha to anything - monsters, doors, whatever as long as it's an entity. Never tried it with pickups but I see no reason why it wouldn't work. 
Ricky 
You ASSUME too much, go read some readmes ... 
Ricky: 
fitzquake doesn't, but the other two do (afaik) 
Ricky 
the glass hack works on every gl engine and at least one software engine (basically all that support r_wateralpha) whereas enhanced engine features only work with a few engines. There have been successful maps that have required the use of a particular engine (warp, nehahra) and if it really means a lot to you, you can go that route, but personally I like to try and do everything so that it is compatible with the widest possible range of engines. I am starting to get fed up of supporting software though, and dm3rmx didn't support the original id engines because it had too many entities in it. 
Also 
I think FitzQuake should be the reference engine for all mapper.. 
Yeah - I Wouldnt Wanna Make A Non-Fitz Map ! 
Been there, done that, bought the T-shirt :D

I like the look/feel of Fitz (just like quake really) and I l00ve the lit-file support and also the external texture thing. With me its all for the coloured lighting...

I find the documentation for Fitz to be a bit of a head stress, I find it hard to understand what it all means. I guess getting a feel for different engines is often a case of trail and error. As for the glass hack thing - it almost annoys me that you cant *quite* have your cake and eat it!! I mean Darkplaces would do *everything* but I guess its not a stable as Fitz...

Oh well - Skip util + waterbrushes 'ere we come... 
Fog 
Wait until you play around with fog for some more headaches. Darkplaces' is just fantastic, the others are different or ugly. 
Sprites 
also need the alfa channel.

http://members.home.nl/gimli/drags.gif

It grew drags on me untill they were really transparant, as in FimG the pictures would add the alphachannel, but didn't save them! I had a hard job to avoid a white screenblock. 
... 
fitzquake should be the standard

Bah! to weird engine users

I see what you guys mean, but remember

a) not everyone uses Windows
b) DP runs on linux but is a bit resource-hungry
c) choice is good
d) does all this stuff work on Mac OSX and *BSD...?

As far as supporting software, I can see that it's not always practical, and it will slowly die. But today there are still laptops out there that have no working 3D hardware, so give it 2,3 more years and then I'd say it's safe enough to assume 95% of computers will be 3D capable. It's clear that software will eventually die.

It's OK IMO if mappers start dropping it.

But I'd hate to see Quake mapping go Windows-only with the possible exception of Darkplaces. The original Quake was cross-platform for a reason. Please try to think of others.

Major Linux GL engines are DP, tyr-glquake and Joequake.

There is also still Proquake, which Baker just took over from JPG and he's working to fix the Linux support he broke somewhere along the way :-)

- Darkplaces we all know, IIRC it also supports OSX.

- Tyr-glquake is a conservative GL engine, supports Windows/Linux/*BSD, and it would be easy enough to up the entity limits. It runs most mods and has a number of nice options. In a word, this is THE candidate for a more conservative cross-platform engine (after some maxentity tweaks.)

- Joequake is the only active Linux engine that supports Nehahra. The other is Qudos' dead port of nehquake-bjp. JQ is enjoyed by speedrunners it seems.

- Fruitz of Dojo, _the_ OSX port, is NOT crossplatform (just like some Windows ports...) so unfortunately, that makes it a bit hard to test your map in unless you own a Mac ;-) I guess Mac Quakers can blame themselves on this one. Their problem. 
Goldenboy 
Hold your breath, SleepwalkR is porting Fitzquake to crossplatform (SDL). Then we will be in eternal bliss.

Darkplaces is way too modern and bugfixed to classify as proper singleplayer quake engine. Joequake depends on that shitty fmod for sound (iirc). Tyr-glquake is nice but kinda buggy. And no-one needs Proquake, it's a multiplayer optimised engine. 
Fitzquake 
I don't really want to drag this argument up again, but the other day I loaded a map in another engine that had less of the awesome fixes metlslime added to FQ and all I could see were blurred textures, bland lighting, cracks on water, the geometry of the skybox and to top it off it didn't support widescreen, so everything was stretched :(

FQ made Quake feel alive again for me when most maps being released didn't work properly in software due to the slightly restrictive limits, and most GL engines were not concentrating on improving the engine so that SP maps could be enjoyed to the fullest.

So good luck to SleepwalkR with the SDL conversion of FQ, and I hope linux and mac users will enjoy playing with such a great little engine as much as I do. 
 
I guess the only thing I can say on the software/hardware-only engine subject is ... if you're going to abandon software users and require a specialized engine, please make sure that it's worth it.

What I mean by that is, make sure that whatever you're doing to your level that is going to shut out software renderers (translucency, huge edict counts, mega surfaces, etc), make sure that you can say with confidence that "Yes, this map NEEDS this".

I love Quake but I'm a traditionalist. I was never a fan of even GLQuake - I don't like the texture smoothing. I like raw pixels and chunky geometry in my Quaking.

Maybe that makes me a nutbar but that's where I'm at. :)

We software users love to play new maps as much as the hardware-only specialized engine guys do. Don't shut us out unnecessarily. 
Software Quake 
Yeah, there are some purists who like it, and that's OK, but they should really use a 'modern' software engine then, like aguirRe's enhanced Winquake or the one that comes with Tyrquake. 
Edicts - Software 
Edicts

I think that the only limit which can really be justified breaking is edicts. 600 just isnt quite enough! If your carefull with your brushwork, you can make massive maps, with 64 lightmaps, 32k marksurfaces etc, just literally tailor the map to its maximum within these hard limits.

Isnt there a JoeQuake software renderer which allows more than 600 edicts?

If FitzQuake is successfully ported to OS X then that engine supports more than 600 edicts, but its a GLQuake engine...

I just think that its possible to make some really great maps, which dont require Darkplaces/AguirRe's GLQuake to run, but edicts are the only thing which holds mappers back from fully realising the potential of the original software engine paramaters... 
 
Well, I'm a Mac user so until SleepwalkR gets done with FitzQuake I can't just switch engines willy nilly. :) I like software so this works for me at the moment.

Just to add some context to my preferences.

However, if his port of FitzQuake supports the ability to have the game render the same as the software renderer (pixelated, monochrome lighting, etc) then I'll definitely use it! 
 
r_overbright 1
r_oldwater 0
r_oldsky 0
gl_texturemode gl_nearest 
 
Nice! Now I just need an engine on OSX that will support higher edict counts and such. :) 
And Ofc 
gl_flashblend 0
I don't know why that is on by default 
FitzQuake Does Support Hight Edict Counts!! 
Or do you mean another engine/one which is already availiable...

Fitzquake can be made to handle (I think) 4000 - odd edicts!! It just requires a console command. Edict limit can be changed with each map loaded!

Its like the glass thing - I wouldnt want to use brushmodel transparency for a map if it didnt work in FitzQuake, which it DOESNT. If I made a map with transparent brushmodels and coloured lights, the only engine I could really use would be Darkplaces, and I really wouldnt want to make a DP-only map!! :D

As for software 'style' in Fitz, what czg said!!

gl_texturemode (1-6) - different effects, one is definately pixelated textures...

:D :D 
 
Yep, that sounds great!

Hurry up, SleepwalkR. :) 
Fitzquake Software Emulation 
I took some shots from my setup of a few maps.

http://than.leveldesign.org/files/fq_swlook_01.jpg (WIP map)
http://than.leveldesign.org/files/fq_swlook_02.jpg (gmsp3)
http://than.leveldesign.org/files/fq_swlook_03.jpg (dm3rmx)
http://than.leveldesign.org/files/fq_swlook_04.jpg (Quoth start)
http://than.leveldesign.org/files/fq_swlook_05.jpg (WIP map)
http://than.leveldesign.org/files/fq_swlook_06.jpg (WIP map)

btw, you might want to check out gmsp3, dm3rmx and quoth if you have been away from Quake for a long time and haven't played them. There are tons more maps that have been released in the past 5 years or so that come highly recommended. I won't mention any in particular because there are so many fucking great maps that I wouldn't like to pick a favourite.

...although I did pick some here: http://qexpo.quakedev.com/booth.php?id=29&page=118 
Jpeg Compression 
dunno if it's actually doing some harm to those absolutely deliciously crisp pixels!

I think old CRT:s did a bit of natural smoothing but with the hard image of the LCD:s, the pixelity gets a bit too strong for me at times.

Also if one is a pure traditionalist, can one really play quake with an optical mouse? I think the rough rolling of the ball is an important part of the classic quake experience, that is, if you're not a keyboard player.

Just kidding. 
 
Hey, for me, part of Quake is unfiltered texels. YMMV! Heh. 
Btw: 
Try gl_nearest_mipmap_nearest, mipmapping does help and software quake had it too!

Also, you can use anisotropic filtering with any texture mode, not just trilinear. So you could experiment with gl_nearest and maxed-out anisotropy, for example.

Personal opinion: I play with trilinear and anisotropic filtering, but I do recognize that trilinear comes at a cost -- the swimming, sparkling, moire effects of nearest filtering go away, but at the cost of more averaged/blended color on the screen and less of the pure texel colors. With nearest filtering, you get a scene full of the actual texture colors, which tend to be more vivid. 
Willem Et Al 
Willem, I also use software right now, because I'm on one of the mentioned older laptops. I will switch to GL though ASAP, I tested it using mesa. I have noticed the difference in lighting, but "what czg said". It looks as if TQ, JQ and PQ (Proquake can be used for singleplayer, and if I'm not mistaken Baker would gladly extend some limits or is already doing so) aren't going to drop software support anytime soon.

The Fitzquake sdl thing sounds great. ^^ If that happens, I'll radically stop all bitching :-E

I hope I didn't come off again like I demanded anything, I was just sayin'.

Concerning TQ, things are being fixed, for example breakfast.bsp produces no more blah_overflow messages even on skill2. And a nice manpage is in the works ;-)

Joequake's FMOD dependency: The only place where fmod is included is in nehahra.c :-( That's the only reason. Since only the GL client includes nehahra support, software does NOT depend on FMOD (anyway, isn't it a simple matter of "emerge fmod" or "apt-get install fmod"?)

The "problem" (*g*) is that Joe didn't think of #undefining Nehahra support, you have no choice if you want it or not. But hey, it plays Nehahra! (at least rudimentary)

He probably ripped that out of Nehquake and the FMOD stuff just came with it.

edicts limit: I'd dare to quietly say that MAX_STATIC_ENTITIES is rather easy to break even in small maps (ex. TPOF) so edicts is not everything. Torches! :-D 
Floating Crate-a-rama 
WIP those maps into releases, word. 
2 Cents 
Fruitz of Dojo, _the_ OSX port, is NOT crossplatform (just like some Windows ports...) so unfortunately, that makes it a bit hard to test your map in unless you own a Mac ;-) I guess Mac Quakers can blame themselves on this one. Their problem.

I don't understand what you mean by this, goldenboy. The Fruitz of Dojo port is straight-up vanilla glquake, how is that not cross-platform? Of course they didn't make a PC version, that was id software's job.

Personally, I prefer pOx's mac glquake ports ( http://macglquake.sourceforge.net/ , and http://developer.chaoticbox.com/quake.php ), as they feel more like a mac application and do some minor things better like mouse smoothing and anisotropic filtering. He also ported the Nehahra engine, which I often enjoy using, as it has a good mix of quake faithfulness and well placed new features (skyboxes, colored dynamic lights, fog). I think it has some raised entity limits too. However I should note that pOx's glquake engines were coded in Carbon, not Cocoa, so you guys on Intel/Leopard machines might not be able to run them. 
 
The Fruitz of Dojo port is straight-up vanilla glquake

OK. They don't say on the site what it actually is, and in how far it was changed or had stuff added. They just say "Requirements: Mac OS X."

Does the same source compile on Linux and Windows? That's what I meant. :-) 
I'd Expect The Fruitz Code To Compile On Win/linux 
But I've never tried. I read through the diff once though, and all the changes are really minor, apart from the addition of os x video and sound code. 
OK 
Then I apologize. I'll download it and try to compile.

If those non-DP Mac clients are really just Macified GLquake, that would mean we'd have to keep to the limits while mapping, or they won't run the maps.

:-/ 
Ah Yes, That's True 
but raising the edicts limit is probably the most useful thing, and dead easy. 
Raising Limits 
They would have to do that, though. ;-) 
Just Started Playing Quoth 
after havin' a great time with arcanum, i've now started quoth.

i need to ask about playing music files from whatever folders.

in arcanum it is:
id1/music/track03 (etc.)

in quake 1 it is:
id1/sound/cdtracks/track03 (or whatever)

does anyone know the way to do this in quoth? 
 
well, cd music has nothing to do with the mods, so it is up to whatever engine you use. it just depends on what engine you're using.
also, it depends on if the maps have a track set in their worldspawn (the 'sound' key).
if you hear no music but have the music installed, then likely the map doesn't have any set. :( 
Music In QS/Quoth 
i just play user maps from quaddicted in Quakespasm.

if there are /ent or .bsp files, i can open them in text edit (is that 'notepad' on windows?) and see what the 'sound' key is.

quoth doesn't have bsp/ent files, only pak files, and i cannot open them on my mac atm.

i have worked out that QS just uses:
id1/music/track01.wav (etc.)

e1m1 from quoth responds to track06, so, i guess, its 'sounds' key is '6'.

could you tell me if i can change the 'sounds' key?
if i need to get into quoth's pak files to do it, i'm screwed!

i have tried to open other bsp/ent files and change the 'sounds' key from, say, '6' to '2', but it never works.
i gather i am doing something wrong. 
Yeah 
Get the utility called Qped. Then you can open .pak files, which are basically just file archives containing, wavs, mdls, bsps, etc. The internal structure mirrors just having directors like id1/maps, etc. Then you can modify whatever you want with ent/bsp files.

Though, doesn't your engine have a "play (filename)" music command?

Standardization would be so good - heh. 
Oh 
one more thing, you'll want a qbsp version to put the modified entities back into the map, at least in some engines. You just have to recompile it with -onlyents option it never takes more than 1 second. Damn I'm pretty bad at this explaining shit. And I'm going to bed pretty soon too - lol - if no one has said anything better by tomorrow I'll try to do better. 
Lol! 
that's cool,

it looks as though this may be quite complicated, but then maybe not (cracks knuckles meaningfully!)

i'll drop by 2moro to see what we can do about this. 
Host_error: Cannot Find Maps Map/e1m3quoth.bsp 
i'm at a loss, really.

i have just played the first two episodes no problem.

any ideas? 
It Doesn't Exist Yet... 
 
 
sheee-it, you'll need the 3 separate RMQ demos and plenty of other user remakes... but there's no unified-remade-awesome-quakeness, just yet.

They are making a REMAKEQUAKE mod that inludes remakes of every single Q1 map. But in their 3 demos they have just released a few maps at a few stages. Surely you can't expect to magically have a new map every map you pass now. 
Er.. 
..well,

again, i don't really know how this all works.

in my dumb naivety, i assumed quoth was a collection of maps/or maybe one episode containing some maps, like arcanum. i didn't know otherwise. it didn't say on the Quaddicted page that it was a demo. 
 
I updated that page. Thanks, such input is very helpful. It is hard to imagine being new to all this if you have been in the scene for so long (and I am a newbie compared to others). 
Nah, That's Cool Spirit! 
i'm a man in my 30's, but STILL making mistakes!

@ Tronym:

trust me. if i knew they were demos, i wouldn't have made the confused post wondering where map 3 was. 
Well 
it's awesome to know new people are still interested.

Quoth is a package of custom content, but it only includes a few maps, it's not a self-contained episode or anything like that, the point of it was to encourage mappers to use its features, which they absolutely did, but each Quoth map needs to be run by itself, these maps weren't planned in some larger context (unlike RemakeQuake). So basically with Quoth you can play a ton of individual maps, many of which are great. My suggestion for a starting place is Hrimfaxi's "Breakfast At Twilight." 
 
an easy way to find maps for quoth is to use quaddicted. go to the maps section: http://www.quaddicted.com/reviews/ and use 'quoth' as the filter. 
@ Tronym: That's OK! 
i will certainly heed yer advice, and i will check out the 'b.o.t' map tonight. 
@ Necros: I'm Already There! 
yep,

i went over to Quaddicted & filtered the maps by quoth, and found plenty to go through.

regardless og quoth, i had already planned to go through the whole quaddicted map database, filtered by 'rating'. that's gonna take a loong time, but fun 'n' frolics along the way! 
It's Been 10 Years 
Brilliant releases from a great year for Q1SP.
And ever since, thanks to all who worked for Quoth.

Nigthmare 100% demo of e1m1quoth and e1m2quoth:
http://quaketastic.com/files/demos/quothdemos_paru.zip
Demos for all the Quoth test maps:
http://quaketastic.com/files/demos/quothtestdemos_paru.zip

First&second runs on the first three Quoth maps(skill2):
http://quaketastic.com/files/demos/ne_deadcity.zip
http://quaketastic.com/files/demos/ne_marb.zip
http://quaketastic.com/files/demos/red777.zip

(The above demos require Quoth2.2.)

And let's not forget about the Chapters pack,
the first maps to feature Quoth monsters.

Demos for all test maps, a demo of the finale
and a 100%demo for my favourite map in the pack:
http://quaketastic.com/files/demos/chaptersdemos_paru.zip

Kell & necros and Preach - you deserve the highest praise.
I agree with Drew: 'We need a Quoth icon!' 
10 Years 
And still no gauntdrop. 
After 
the gauntdrop / cc attack would complete that enemy.

Light my candle, I still have the qc.
I'm a bad coder, I can only loose. 
Quoth FGD 
Just dropping this link here because an earlier link to the Quoth FGD is broken but this thread still tops the Google search for Quoth FGD.

https://tomeofpreach.wordpress.com/quoth/

You're welcome, future Quoth mapper and/or future me. 
Great! 
What I really would like to know if there's a quoth.qc availabe.
I've got one from the Quoth2, but everytime I ask fteqcgui to take a look at it I drown in the error.log.

As I said, I'm a bad coder, but would like to try new things with it after burning my fingers on too hot spagethi code.

Like being attacked by a purple gauntdrop. 
Kell 
Do you mind if I use Quoth in my mod? All of it. Well enemies, items, and weapons that is. I managed to decompile the 2.1 progs.dat. 
I Don't Think Kell Visits Here Anymore 
But then, like I mentioned in the Noir thread, the idea of toolbox mods like Quoth and AD is that they enable new maps to NOT have all the mod stuff included in the release, because the base material is already installed on the user's system. So one doesn't have to install the same mod all over again with every new map. 
 
I think Qmaster meant using Quoth assets in his own mod. Good luck with that! Sock waited a looooong time and pretty much harassed the Quoth creators to finally get the authorization to use only SOME Quoth monsters in AD. The problem with Quoth is that it's not open source. AD is, so you'd better grab what you need from there instead. Also, Seven's SMC has some pretty cool additional monsters so you may want to look into it as well. 
The Better Question Would Be 
Preach do you mind? I mean after all I won't have all the great new 2.2 features. 
 
Since the thread was bumped, I'll ask a question here. Maybe someone who frequents this forum knows what's going on.

I was looking into making a small model patch for Quoth, and discovered a strange set of weapon models whose names start with "c_". These models seem to combine features of their respective view and pickup models in one mesh/skin.

At first I thought it was just cruft, but then I played the maps bundled with Quoth to discover that the medieval one enables these models (overriding my replacements). Moreso, the hammer seems to use the combined model by default.

The question is: what's the point? The models are about as ugly and broken as the stock ones, in some cases being even worse - the SSG is hideous when viewed as a pickup model. Making replacements for these is gonna be unpleasant as well. 
Aflag? 
Scroll down, you'll see it: https://tomeofpreach.wordpress.com/quoth/tutorial/worldspawn/

Is that it? 
 
Yes. Thanks. 
Might Be Putting On My Bullseye T-shirt Here But... 
I think I'll just borrow all of Quoth 2.1 anyway. I'll credit it for sure. I'm not a plagiarist, but I'll infringe every copyright I come across simply because it was on the internet. If it's downloadable, it's public domain right? (lol no. it's not. but I don't really care and neither do Quake players)

Ahh heck I don't know. Maybe I shouldn't. 
Dwere 
@dwere Are you making a "guns of okayishness" pack for Quoth?

@Qmaster If you do that, you're gonna get burned by the community. They don't like modders who "steal" from them without consent. Ask XOlve ("author" of the Epsilon build), he could tell you all about it. 
 
Are you making a "guns of okayishness" pack for Quoth?

Not yet and not exactly. Unlike the official releases, Quoth has a severe fullbright problem, which is easy to fix (if dull), but is out of scope of a weapon mod. So I don't know if it's gonna be a part of the goo pack or it's gonna be something standalone.

Of the two new weapons only the hammer requires attention, as far as I can see. But the fact that Quoth has its own set of stock-like models complicates things quite a bit. I've seen them being used in at least one more map. 
OK 
Keep up the good work! 
Disablement 
If a map sets the model-saving flag, a client can override it by setting "scratch1 1" in console or config. So you can just replace the stock models (and the plasma gun too) and recommend players use that setting in their config (and an engine with increased model limits). 
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