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Q1SP: Grunt Grenadin
I wanted to celibrate Quake10 and this board for its help it granted me in the past years! I made a new level, and I hope you enjoy it! might have called it Grunt's Rarebit, or PoopinGrenade, because the slopes cause a bad effect.

Download the level: http://members.home.nl/gimli/Grunt.zip
Screenies: http://members.home.nl/gimli/gimli09.htm

QUAKE ONE !!!
A New Madfox Level... 
...to explore.Yeah. 
I Haven't Played 
this edition yet, but the beta was fun. 
 
I really enjoyed playing this map. Some areas are a bit bland, but the size of the map makes up for it. It took me a half hour to beat it, which is pretty long. Difficulty was just right, not to hard, but not to easy. Well done. 
This Map 
This map has so much potential!
The layout is cool once you get the hang of it, the progression is really interesting, some of the setpieces are good. In genral this map is a really good idea.

Sadly, the build quality is non-existant, the lighting is an affront to God, the texturing seems to have been done in notepad and there are some weird choices regarding theme.

100% serious: If I had the time I would do a remake of this map.

Oh, and what kind of naming convention is naming the .zip 'grunt' while naming the .bsp 'grenade'? And also putting folders in the .zip file when it's not needed? :( 
Oh And 
Please please please learn to use gold/silver key doors properly, Madfox. Making the doors open when you pick up the key is not correct and makes things confusing.
Add the key "spawnflags" "8" to make a gold key door and "spawnflags" "16" to make a silver key door. 
Soo Picturesque - A True Madfox 
to anyone who wants to play it, i strongly recommend deleting the .lit file, because the colored lighting looks really really shit. i had to blink my eyes every few seconds to make sure they were still ok. without the .lit, it was much more endurable.

then what czg said; plus i got lost after the pushing the goldenrunelight button which lets one fall into the water in the waterfall canyon. noclip. :/ 
Didn't You Find 
there's a hole in the wall on one side that you can swim up and press a button and then there's another hole that opens up to the waterfall and then there's a door that opens up that leads to a hallway and then I dunno what happens 
 
NO! Dont delete .lit - that would make map less madfoxy 
Glad You Enjoyed The Level! 
I must admit the colors were overdewed, as said in the read me.
I already made them half as they were, but it is still too severe,
must be my cartoon roots.

czg, the first name I had was -grunt grenade-,
but then I discovered a map on the net that already had that name. Making keys is indeed not my strongest side, and texturing was a tough job.

neg!lke, there is indeed a point, when one swims further without taking the side way, the level can have a deadend. I will make an arrow for markpoint.

#7 -that leads to a hallway and then I dunno what happens-
Then the halldoor in front of you has opened, so now you can make your way to the second train, end level.

This level has made me a hom-blaster!
I had this strange apearance with maps in the past.
Then it were a few two or three. Nevermind.
Virtus DeathMatchMaker isn't so bad anyway! 
No Way 
you use deathmatchmaker?! I remember buying that... 
Must Admit 
that the big marine base and the round chamber were made with it. Maybe this explains the srage texture editing. It always goes 2" out of grid.

Later I placed the maps together with Quark61.
And without the new tyrlight of Aguire the map
refused in a maximal planes. Thanks for that!

There were two parts I sunk into the level, and I couldn't find anything in the map.
So I clipped them with succes. 
Hahaha. 
I used to use Deathmatch Maker too. I've also got DMM2 and HexMaker hanging around somewhere. A fool and his money, eh.

MadFox, did you not release this map a while ago? Or was that in beta?

Either way, I strongly recommend leaving DMM behind for good now that you've picked up something else. It's very restrictive, and tends to cause some very irritating errors in my experience. 
DMM?? O_O 
I'd rather be making maps in Windows Notepad than Deathmatch Maker - at least in Notepad you actually have the option of placing brushes on a binary grid.

It's also worth pointing out that Notepad's "texture browser" is at least as good as Deathmatch Maker's if I recall correctly... 
Bleh 
The map was earlier released on beta and screenshots. I needed some support to know if my mappings were modulated enough for an average player.

I really tend to Quark61. It has barsliders and a good viewer, and texture scaling. And for correcting things I always go back to Quark407. Silly I never got RQradiant working in a decent way.But I'm still running under Win98, because for Quake I don't want to loose my Dos functions.

Kinn, in the readme I wrote something about the brush placement.
It was related to an article I read on this board about placing polyhedron ends exact on grid line, but I forgot if it was you or Kell.

CZG, if you would make a remake of this map, what would you change?
I am really curious about it. As with support it can make me see what I is meself becoming blind of all that mapping. Had a testlevel -4 of 18 houres. 
What Would I Change? 
Everything but the layout really. 
Limits 
Had already a big box around it for stopping it leak, not a good sign.
Also the lighttextures had a high count. 
Pssssst... 
...go on CZG, you know you want to! 
Reviewage -> 
I Played And Played 
and after some twenty minutes I couldn't get forward and then noclipped and then played some ten minutes and then again stuck and then frustrated and quit. Is it really finishable in skill 1 and without noclip? 
 
oh wel i shouldn�t be making any coment becouse u are a fucking asshole(many reasons...) !!! but if i don�t coment i become one like u... so i will drop my comment on your map...

i think u had very good idears, the layout was great with nice combats,doors were a lot confused... for exemple near the dragon when shambler spwan, i run almost all level trying to understand what happend... this suck real hard... took lot of time to find way! in the water part same crap... :\ drop some msg... once in a wile... or people get bored and start using noclip!!!

thks all was a nice level to play good work!

Trinca 
Sorry 
my last post was hurried. The level's strengths are interesting rooms, environments, landscapes, interconnectivity and some cool lifts and windows. The waterfall was nice too. It's just that it needed to be smaller and have more coherence and player-friendliness. And more polish.
Madfox, try playing some other maps and you see how they are done. You can open the terra pack .map files in the editor to see how they are done, for example. The player always knows where to go next and there are enemies populating the levels.

The computer terminals and the weird beam thingy were kinda cool too. There was some bug in the floor with one computer room with enforcers near the opening windows, i dropped out of the level when I noclipped there and walked around. The room with the teleport destination. 
What's There Coming Over The Hill.... 
is it a monster, is it a monster!

Thanx UnderworldFan, for your revieuw!

Trueley I must confess this map needed more betatesting, but I had to shout more harder on sreenshots and betas. Now there were only four,
and it helps a lot when people give their feedback. For now I got a few good hints.

Sorry Bambuz, my mappings always tend to a morer intuitive path than a logic player would follow. Player friendly is the good word.
I also found two parts where this dropout level appeared. I'll cheque it out.

Trinca, I often wondered why you dislike me, but that many reasons will be a matter of people and taste. Still a beer and good skill myside!
Indeed I should give the Shambler a message for the sidedoor opening. As the underwater path could have signs. Thanks for the hint.

I'll remap the errors, and make a new bsp.
I have made a booth on Q10thExpo and have the level Orb'sBetrayal with newskill setting and lightning, but there may be to much ammu. 
 
i dont dislike u madfox but

1� once i send u a privet msg at quakeone.com and u never reply me... this is not nice!

2� u never coment other people maps people dont care about download but coments are always good bad or good

cheers man :p 
Or Whatever 
for the last is my own fault, but the reason is I am always mapping. Other people's map do interest me, but I'm cheap in time.

the first you must forgive me, because I archive all my email with people sharing Quake maps with me. If you sended me an email at quakeone.com and I didn't answer must be that I'm unused to things like private messages on boards. But it wasn't may intention, my computer crashes rather a lot on the net. 
Madfox... 
Don't sweat it ;)

This map was a giant step up from your previous works although it would have definitely benefited from more beta-testing. The colored lights weren't bad and they helped give the map a feel of its own. The size of the whole thing was awesome and the inter-connectivity was decent - much better than your previous maps. Your brushwork has also improved. Unfortunately, like many others, I was too lost after the first key and quit :(

Ultimately, though, the fact that CZG likes your map enough to offer a redux is an accomplishment on its own :) He should definitely do it! (It's funny, I thought the same thing about Quatrotski) Keep up the good work! 
Demo 
The key factor as CZG said was not in my mapping code.
Strange enough I can bite my edge to show people how to dropp weapons in a new keymap, a key and a door are me a problem.
Thanks for haven them explained.

I made the level with tech05_2 , took out the side and it became some A-form corridor.
Bad is when this texture becomes a door itself it is harder to relate it a door. Had a silver sign marked.
And demons tend to get caught in the slopes, so it needs clipping.

I made a demo and realized it was a rough ressistance I got, without taking the items squad or pentagram:

http://members.home.nl/gimli/madfox.dz 
Just Played This 
Gameplay was fun. I didn't have any major problems, but I got a bit confused a couple of times. Nothing too bad though, just going back to find somewhere I recognised - which wasn't too hard. I can see why some people might get lost though as doors were often very hard to make out, and there were not many clues as to which doors had been opened when you did stuff. The gold/silver key thing was a bit weird too, as CZG and others point out.

The shambler spawning in front of the player followed by an acid pit opening up behind near the end sucked though. I just noclipped out because it was so cheap.

Nice interconnected design - I did like the layout.

As most people said though, the build quality wasn't so nice, and the lighting was very garish. Stop using DMM asap! ;)

Some of the design was also a bit suspect - I'm not a fan of mixing medieval and base textures together - although it can be pulled off well. Here I don't think it was done effectively so the two styles did not mingle well.

Uhm, overall though, it was a good 20 minute romp. Certainly worth a play. 
Good Demo 
I too got lost and ended up using noclip, so it was good to see the MadFox demo. And yes, I watched all 33 minutes of it - great fun, well done. (MadFox, either you've got a dodgey mouse or you are a keyboard player. You wasted a lot of ammo with your jerky aiming!)

The wrong use of key-doors and the dodgey door textures were what got me. I suppose after 10 years of Quake, you expect things to be the same in all maps and if they're not, ennui creeps in.

Thanks for this map and keep making them, MadFox. 
 
The shambler spawning in front of the player followed by an acid pit opening up behind near the end sucked though. I just noclipped out because it was so cheap.

That was just your bad karma, than ;) though I agree, that bit sucked alot, because through the whole map before you could always retreat(lots of long corridors and big rooms, the fiends/vores were not very effective because of this, maxbe it would be more fun to spawn them in front of and behind the player with still some room to move of course).
Also I thought some parts could use more monsters in it.
Until the slime pit it�s a great map, the huge outdoor part with the RL is very nice, as is the exploraion. 
Strange 
I admit the acid pit is a bore, but this is exact the startpoint I made this map. cheap thrills!
I was broken with the map, because I started a marine base, but ended with a gothic castle.
I wanted the castle more formed as the base,but ran out of max_brushes.
That same pit made me do over the demo three times, because I wanted it to show.
And then my keyboard play got so weird, I hardly dared to publish the demo. The other demos were more heroic.
But at least I came through without the items or secrets.

Because there was hardly an end play I had only the demon behind the player spawn, and the acid pit.
More monsters could, but I was at 712 monsters, and 299 lights. Close to package overflow.(612 entities)

My own complain is to much megahealth. 
The Acid Pit 
wouldn't have been so much of a problem if it were easily escapable. As it is right now though, it's essentially an instant death trap, which just isn't fun in any level. If you release another version I'd suggest making it a shallow, escapable pool. You could also make it more obvious to the player by having similar pools open along the sides of the corridor. 
 
As long as it is "close to" overflow it should still be ok no !?(doesn�t aguirRe�s engine have extended limits?)
I�d like to see that(and put all the megahealth to good use :) 
Support 
I could change the spawntime of the lift.
Now it is 4, what means a player with health-100 will survive. If wait = 1 health 50 will do.

Monster placement could be better, as the opening door after killing the respawned shambler, which seem to be hard to find.

Thanks for your support, I will try to make a recompiled map with these hints. 
A Recompiled Map 
Still no success?

Oh well, I liked this map as it was. An atmospheric place.

A few years passed but I still remembered it. I completely forgot its name, so I had to search over the whole map archive to find it...

So today I enjoyed it yet another time.

Thank you MadFox. 
Lol 
It's not that I ain't have no succes with recompiling.
It's more that I published three other maps since then.

I made a GruntGrenadine map with a Capture The Camera kit.
This makes it easier to see what happens ingame, like doors that open out of sight.
But it got slashed in my cleaningup periods, as always after lots of mapping.

Glad you enjoyed the level.
My last map has a cave part, that comes from the end of this level.
So it's not that I won't try to recompile it, it's just my last level keeps a hold on me.

See the others on my homepage! 
Abandon, Etc. 
It appears that I like your style of mapping.

Enjoying the Abandon pack right now... and I'm going to explore all of your maps still available on the web :-) 
Enjoying The Abandon Pack Right Now 
Madfox you're rock! 
 
Abandon Pack = lots of fun!

not those top detailed maps but lots of fun to play, lots of Vore dancing... is what i remenber the most. 
Letters To Chtong 
I'm a little surprised.

"GraveyTrail" was the one that made me start.
"Crumb" the one that made me going.
"True Sailor" the one that made me believe.
"FlyingDutchman" the one beyond my imagination.
"SameOldShow" the one that really made me mad.

Thanks for your support! 
Hey 
Droog_Andrey, can you make a demo, so I can see what you like to see changed? 
Almost Nothing 
but maybe only the silver/gold keydoors, they should open when you unlock them, not when you just grab the key. 
Right 
That's a wrong option I gave the doors, sure.

There's a change I would like to make at the crossing over the water.
The Shambler appears behind the player, which can easily avoid him.

I would apreciate if you gave some comments to the Abandon. There's a toppic on it in GraveyTrail.

http://www.celephais.net/board/view_thread.php?id=596&start=185 
Comments On The Abandon 
Please give me some time to fully explore it...

Usually I play Quake maybe once or twice a week, so the whole thing should take quite a while...

But it just suck me in when I start playing... %) 
As For A Shambler... 
I get used to it... so let it be as it is... 
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