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Zerst�rer Turtle Map Pack Is Finally Here
Crawling your way since mid December 2007, the Zerst�rer themed turtle map pack has finally arrived.

Here in lies 4 maps by efdat, Neg!ke, and HeadThump, get them and relive the horror of the The Destroyer, his army of feral enforcers, troglodytes practiced in black arts, and the Sanguinoch who craves the blood of the fallen.

ScreenShots:
http://mortisville.quakedev.com/efdat.jpg
http://mortisville.quakedev.com/zertm_ht.jpg
http://mortisville.quakedev.com/Negpic.jpg

Download:
http://www.quaddicted.com/filebase/zertm_pack.zip

Note: You must have Zerst�rer installed in order to play.
http://www.gamers.org/pub/idgames2/partial_conversions/zerstoerer/zer.zip

Many thanks to efdat and Neg!ke for making this happen. Special thanks to Neg!ke for extended technical assistance he gave after the big rig meltdown in January. A truer Quaker I have never known.
 
Aderlass is seriously the best custom map I've played for Quake since I can't remember when.

Kudos, neg!re. 
Ok Tried The Other Two As Well Now. 
Efdat's is also brilliant. I got a bit caught up in how there was the same floor texture everywhere, but that's just a small niggle.

Don't know what was supposed to be zer about HeadThump's map to be honest... 
 
so yeah I started playing in Fitzquake - as you do - but all the brush entities were b0rked. Nonsolid mostly. No idea why.
Works fine in aguirre's engine though. 
Fitzquake 
When you say fitzquake there, I'm guessing you're actually running fitzhack. The less well documented feature there was me messing around with a flag for making monsterclip entities, before people knew how to do it in an engine independent way. Turns out zerst�rer already uses that same flag for something else, so it breaks. I should tidy that up really, but my current build is stuck half way through adding alpha support, so it's bad in other ways like protocol changes. 
 
Ah, that would be it. Thanks. 
Played 2 So Far 
headthump, didnt really like yours mate. Its a big step up from one of your previous maps I tried but I found the texture combo strange and the layout was less than intuitive. Some nice combat in parts but overall couldnt get into it.

Efdat, very nice stuff. Reminded me a lot of the Blood cube level (and I notice this leads into it), which was one my favs from the original pack. Even apart from the bloodcube similarities, it reminded me a lot of zer with its texturing and build style (especially the steps). Loved it. 
Please Remeber: 
to record & post your firstruns =) 
Could Someone 
fix the title to denote turtle map *pack*.
Downloading... 
The Pack Opens Fine With Winrar 
though it exacts eeeeeextremely slow. Why? Stop the gimmickry.

I'll complain more once I play more. 
Very Zer 
I played the aderlasses. Damn, good stuff!
And efdat's too, although it's hard for me!

But they are good.

Gotta play ht:s still...
I'll upload demos. 
Recommeded Order Of Play... 
neg!ke -> headthump -> efdat

I'm sure others will disagree, but I played in this order by chance, and the pacing seemed just right. Neg!ke manages to make a series of 2 small-ish maps seem as epic as the original zer. You get to the end of the first thinking "that was a cute little zer-base" and then its like "OMG I'm being shoved thru a giant colon like in Doom 3" and "holy fucking shit the tower is a demonically possessed turd!". Then you are treated to some citadel-esque lift sequences (cannot be adequately described) and of course main fight which is a perfect remake of the original (after playing through it again, the details are everywhere in the architecture for instance). Though quite unbalanced, you probably won't care too much.
Headthump - nothing reminded me of Zer in the level design. But it was a good mindless rampage sort of map, I'm sure the Zer weapons and quite cramped conditions contributed to that.
Efdats style seems to be story telling with lots of messages, usually enigmatic and with a personally delivered slant, sometimes making you lol. Those opening lines sounded like lyrics almost? Besides that the re-imagining Zerstorer was as perfect as Neg!kes though of a different part of it. No big surprise there if you remember the 129 speedmap of last year, also from Efdat. Seemed proper to finish on this one. 
Excellent 
i played it in this order: headthump -> efdat -> neg!ke - and personally wouldn't have done it differently on hindsight

headthump - enjoyed, can kinda agree that it wasn't particular zerish but it had somewhat of a similar oldskool charm to it, with nicely balanced, challenging gameplay (save for one moment near the start when i ran out of ammo).. although what was with the lack of intermission at the end?

efdat - great idea to combine zer1m6&7, and a fantastic job done with it! the attention to detail was incredible & it really captured the essence & atmosphere of both maps - i especially liked how the main generator room doubled up as the sanguinoch's arena. the exit was a nice little homage to zer1m5, too. awesome stuff

neg!ke - first map was very tidy; as with efdat's, it had the details right down to a T & i had me forgetting i wasn't back in the original zer1m1 at one point. gameplay was fairly easy, but fun. the second map though.. holy shit! i can't remember the last time my jaw hit the desk so hard whilst playing quake.. it seemed to cram in *EVERYTHING* that was awesome about zer & fit it all inside a massive tower setting that offered a brief nod to mexx9's 'tower of twilight'.. a combination made in quake heaven. the use of cutscenes & scripts were excellent, and the atmosphere was positively dripping, especially near the end.

i think we need more zer themed maps.. it's one of the few custom episodes out there that out-quakes the original quake =) 
SPOILERS 
Aderlass - very nicely done, although progression seemed a bit confusing - almost like a DM map. I missed using the chainsaw to slaughter grunts as well. Aside from that a very good map. Good ending effect as well. 7:30, all kills, 1/3 secrets.

Hold of the Troglodyte - not as good as Aderlass, but not bad. Had a fair few niggles like brushes getting in the way and the old max enemies bug. Hearing the gargling of the trogolodyte throughout the map was good, and I could have stood to see alot more trogs - the ending was a bit sudden as well, without an intermission. More obviously a turtlemap than Aderlass, but also a fair bit bigger. 14:00 56/58 3/3 secrets.

Love in a Bunker, Baby! - My favourite of the pack, a nice combination iconic themes from the original zerstorer with modern mapping ideas applied and some cool extra features. Another cool ending, although the Aderlass portal effect was nicer. 10:14 91/92 2/3 secrets. 
More Spoilers 
Just realised aderlass is in two parts - I tend to read readmes after I play maps.

Aderlass2 - Holy shit. Excellent. I can only imagine the effort put into all the secondary details - sanguinoch dispensers, cool teleports, the tower, the 'look only' chambers and the final end sequence. Very combat light but a great example of Quake storytelling, really took me back to Zerstorer's twisted world. 7:42 27/27 
Thanks 
for some of the generally positive assessments some of you have given so far.

Don't know what was supposed to be zer about HeadThump's map to be honest...

My apologies though I think efdat and Neg!ke more than make up for my lapse. There was a pretty straight out Zer map under construction, but I wont be getting the hard drive it was on back for a while (long story).

Instead of unfairly delaying my co-conspirators, I whipped out an old map from even before Ariadat and shaped it up. I added only the Zer entities that fit into a medieval themed map so its flavor isnt quite Zerst�rer.

Truth be told I aped the metal trim and stone style of your Nimbus here as well.

Results are a trifle uneven, but I grew to be happy with the game flow. Sorry about the low ammo at the start though. I added a case of shells before the second fiend encounter because Neg!ke had the same problem. 
If I Were To Say You Should Have Done Aliens 
Id be lying!!!

I tried to record demos of aderlass, which is the only one I have played right through so far, but I did a good demo for part one, then overwrote it for part two, and died, then cheated on my second attempt.

Regardless, it was pretty fucking cool!!

I havent played Zerstorer all the way through, but obviously the shipping thing, first level, I have played. And aderlass1 is better than that by a long shot. How long did these maps take?? A bit longer than people might like to say methinks!! aderlass2 was just massive. Neat idea and everything, but the feeling of scale you get when you first com out into the lower open-air courtyard bit is amazing. The fight was a bit too luck-orientated if you ask me!! Played in skill2. Maybe skill1 would have been better.

Efdat - your map was cool. I havent managed to finish it yet, but running around it, the size was also pretty impressive for a "turtlemap" ;-P

HT - as above really, xcept the first fiend killed me loads of times!!

More later......

(thanks btw) 
 
how do I please install this? 10MB zerstorer mod unpacked to quake/zer and 4MB bsps to quake/zer/maps. then I try using bat file containing "fuhquake -winmem 12 -game zer -zone 1024 +sv_aim 1 +r_maxsurfs 4000 +r_maxedges 16000 +skill 1 +mlook 1 +r_farclip 16384 +deathmatch 0 +map andrlass" but only original zerstorer map named start runs now in DM mod... what am I doing wrong please? there is no install info in the pack, thanks. 
Take The "n" Out Of "andrlass" 
otherwise I dont know. I was using FitzQuake, just "fitzquake.exe -heapsize 256000 -width 1280 -height 1024 -bpp 32 -game zer +map adrlass" on the cammand line ( the desktop shortcut to Fitz) ?

Worked for me!

I dont get why you have to specify "deathmatch 0", I thought Zerstorer was a SP mod? Also "+mlook 1" - I think this is just "+mlook"
I dont know what "sv_aim 1" is supposed to do, but I dont know why you put "+r_maxsurfs 4000 +r_maxedges 16000 +r_farclip 16384" either ?

Also, I'm just guessing here, but isnt the ram allocation syntax for most gl engines -heapsize, rather than -winmem?

Err - just try ditching the batch file! And run from a Windows shortcut/command line....

Also the maps DONT RUN SEQUENTIALLY, except for adrlass. So remember the names of the other two maps, and just run them from the console.

Hop this helps! 
Jaromir83 
Don't use Fuhquake. It's a QW engine with no mod support. That's the reason it doesn't work. 
 
ok, I did "joequake.exe -heapsize 256000 -game zer -zone 1024 +sv_aim 1 +r_maxsurfs 4000 +r_maxedges 16000 +skill 1 +mlook 1 +r_farclip 16384 -bpp 32 -game zer +map adrlass" and worked, thanks.

PS: "Also the maps DONT RUN SEQUENTIALLY, except for adrlass. So remember the names of the other two maps, and just run them from the console." other TWO maps? I have 4 bsps in the pack. sorry for being a bit confused, those maps look good so far. 
 
I got it now. thanks, nice levels. 
 
from neg!ke�s maps, I like the beginning of adrlass2 the most. first level is base themed with a bit confusing layout (to me), second half of adrlass2 map is just crazy :) with a lot of special effects. 
So 
Who else is intrigued by the title? "Finally", and it's only been two months? 
Cool 
What everybody said :-)

I like efdat's best, the feel is authentic Bunker, a bit disorienting like the original, good that there were no monsters on the way in, didn't find the crowd pleaser somehow. Dark, brutal, cool map. Will gladly replay this.

neg!ke part 1 was very clean and well done, but I personally don't find the shipping complex theme too exciting. Part 2 was rather crazy, somehow the trigger_push/door combination didn't work, kept being pushed back in the water by the closing "door" thing, thus had to flymode to the teleporter, the fight was rather ridiculous, and then it crashed, no idea why. Probably my fault somehow. The outdoor/tower section was just "gosh. gosh. gosh." The temple/water room was nice.

Headthump's felt more like an id style map with zer weapons.

My favourite themes from zer are the graveyard and the Blutsturz "theme" though. (neg!ke: good map name.) I'd like to play a more modern combination of those two sometime. 
 
roulfff tought week but finaly played then all!!!

great pack guys :) love then all

HeadThump you rush your map a lot... found lots of misalight textures :) but was fun to play...

there it goes my first demos!!!
neg|ke sent 1st and 2nd :\ becouse in map2 i died realy weard :\

http://trinca.quaddicted.com/temp/zer_demos.dz

p.s --> efdat nice start and negke nice end!!! zomggg is realy well done.

p.s --> i love y�u guys 
Wow... 
...neg!ke you are the chameleon. I could've sworn I was playing an "official" extension of the mod. You just BECAME the original mod-makers tenish years on!

Playing the other two tonight, and looking forward to some old skool action from HT regardless of its Zerness :) 
Heh 
Thanks for the comments and demo.

It seems many people considered the bloodcube battle in my map hard and random/luck-oriented (well, it is. a little.) because they approached it differently from what I intended. I think the best way is to engage the monsters - chainsaw does work against Shamblers, especially with the bloodcube - and not rely on hide and seek tactics.

Btw. Trinca: you don't have to axe every single wall. Secrets are usually marked in one way or another. :D

In case anyone is interested: I recorded two simple Kascam demos in my maps (thanks aguirRe) spoiling the secrets. I'm not totally satisfied with the outcome, but I can't be arsed to give it more tries atm - each KC run looks different, it's hard get perfect results. Anyway, http://negke.quaddicted.com/files/aderlass_kcdemos.dz 
First Two. 
Headthump - not bad, quite crude but I enjoyed the gameplay and liked the finish. I can see that some of the chaotic nature of the design was Zer-ish. But needed more.

Efdat - well rad dude. Like a little summary of Zer in one map! Good designs and all, and good gameplay throughout - except the end which needed more beef. I like the reliance on Zer weapons in particular. I'm most impressed with the huge chunk of map that was left out too!! 
Great 
Will watch those today.

For anyone who hasn't seen the kascam I recommend these demos; they're like recammed thirdperson camera.

Got to say again; really good pack. 
Seconded... 
Neg|ke's map had all the right pieces of the elder Zer puzzle in place. I only disliked the Zer turrets -- never cared for 'em -- and accidentally took an extra jog around the block after the last mega-enforcer before the gib-pit. Great cut scenes, BTW!

Efdat's map fit the Zer bill, too, and was an almost perfect match of 'True Love Waits.' I didn't like the 1:1 stairs, though, but they were a part of the original.

Headthump's map could have used a little more polish but I could see where it was trying to be like the Zer graveyard level. Not at all bad for rehashing a scrap at the last minute.

Beers to you guys! 
@shambler 
that huge chunk isn't left out =)
try playing the map in dm and you'll see... 
 
I noticed how no-one made that weird blue plasma gun available. I always wondered what the deal was with that weapon, because in Zerstorer you get it at the very end of Bunker so its pretty much useless in the single player game. Almost like the retarded stepchild of the weapons that they didn't want to show anyone :) 
Hindsight Is A Bitch 
When you realise you should have just used that rocket icon. 
Who's A Lardass? 
Excellent maps all round.

There is something faintly sexual about adrlass2.

Anyhoo... 
Somewhat Incomplete First Run Demos Of Ade, Ade1 And Efdat's Map... 
Ade And Ade2 Ofc 
 
Bambuz 
Cool, but I couldn't view the second part of the demo (second map) because recording a demo of multiple maps in sequence doesn't work in standard engines. All you get are the console messages. 
Awesome TM Pack 
I played Zerstor�r a while ago... meaning years... But yeah, the spirit is there. In the order, I prefered (my personal taste):

1/ Negke: the 2 maps have a real oppressive ambience, and that is very good... a shame there is not enough fights. Also, the architecture and the detail level is.... OMG !! Why are you not a pro mapper !!!

2/ HT: Very good design, good frantic fights, cool monster placement and lot of fun during the slaughtery :P

3/ Efdat: Nice fights, nice details touch, but visually not the best of all... Well, a good map with lot of fun ;)

Well, now I have to replay Zerstor�r completely...

keep it up guys, you all rock !! 
Second Two. 
Adrlass1: Very nice Zer style, all properly done. Rather easy though, could have done with more combat.

Adrlass2: Completely bonkers, more Zer than Zer itself, great attention to style and some many warped designs. Arena was hard at first then fun in the middle bit. I would have prefered a lot more combat throughout the map, then an easier start to the arena, then a really bloody finish with maybe a quad and stuff. The final cinematic (and associated designs) was very good - Zer watching through the teleporter-view was a touch of genius. 
Yup! 
How did you do the cutscenes BTW? Were they incorporated into the bsp somehow? 
Aderlass 
quite good but I wished it were longer and more challenging. It was over before I really got into it. Great end cutscene though.

More full sized maps please negke :) 
Cutscenes 
are scripted sequences consisting of camera, focal point and script entities. See devkit.txt for more information. At first glance it sounds more complicated than it actually is.
Still, making the end cutscene was horrible and took ages. Most of the time I wasn't really sure what I was doing or what would happen if I changed any value. No wonder all Zer cutscenes were done by the same person who created the cs code in the first place. 
Speaking Of Which 
Has anyone ever come across that dubious acs.map mentioned in devkit.txt? It would have been very helpful (and still might). 
Hehe - Makes Me Wanna Try A Map For Zer! 
Well I thought the cutscenes looked perfect!! 
Neg!Ke's Was Best 
because of cutscenes, amazing architecture. focus on amazing architecture and ambience. interesting, not just intense game play. 
Hmmm 
interesting, not just intense game play.

It's not like I used a mind numbing horde of monsters in every area (or hordes in any area, for that matter) coming at you on the same ground floor that you happen to be standing. I considered the tactical advantages of monster placement, anticipating the most likely way a player approaches the situation in front of him to throw in several surprises. To carry this off, the vast majority of the monster were low and mid-level with only a handful of higher level ones used mostly near the end.

And, I used as few in number of monsters as I could to do it while still presenting a challenge to the player.

I have nothing to apologize for in regard to game play accept maybe that last damn platform that doesn't work (and it didn't stop working until the last damn version of the map, damn it!).

I've pretty much stayed away from counter criticism as either I pretty much agreed with most of what has been said so far, or thought the critic had a valid point, but this one bugged me as it implied my map was nothing more than shoot what is in front of you, lazily constructed affair when nothing could be further from the truth. 
Headthump. 
I agree with you. The main flaws in your map were architecture / build quality. The gameplay was pretty neat throughout, and as you say somewhat tactical. Which is welcome. 
 
It was kind of odd to see a old school build qaulity but with decent monster placement.

Visually the map suffered slightly but in game play it was allot of fun. 
Thanks Shambler&Ijed 
and, also, my comments were not meant as a criticism of the maps of any one else who may have a different approach to game play and flow than I do. 
Yeah, Pretty Awesome! 
Although I was forcefully reminded that I haven't played zer for far too long :) Took me ages to work out what was zer-like about efdat's map... 
Mwh 
i'm a little confused.
Took me ages to work out what was zer-like about efdat's map...
have you ever played zer1m6 or zer1m7? 
 
Yes, but ages ago, like I said. I'd figured it out by the time I got to the bottom :) 
Dude. 
HT - I was complimenting Neg!kes skills, not putting yours down. Shit, I didn't even mention your map in the post ( or Efdats for that matter).

I meant I liked that the sort of low key gameplay allowed the impressive environment to take centre stage. that kind of gameplay isn't all that common in Quake maps.

With regards to your map, I agree with Shambler. 
Okay, I Can See Where You 
are coming from.

I made a few assumptions there based on appearences; one func_ster brought your quote to my attention before I even read it, and a second person I asked confirmed they thought it was a dig on my map when they read the quote. Its obviously a misunderstanding, so lets forgetaboutit. 
Done. 
 
Obligatory Speedrun 
http://python.net/crew/mwh/adr_044.dz

Not the most friendly run, with a long wait, then some annoying monster dodging, *then* the hard bit :) 
Spirit Did It In One Second Less IIRC 
Wouldn't it even be possible to jump down from the upper walkway with a grunt or enforcer boost? 
Nah 
It was 47. And the start elevator waiting is too de-motivating. 
Hm, I Hadn't Noticed That Route Option 
I guess it would be possible, and faster to boot, but man it would be annoying. You're not getting it from me :) 
High Hopes Zerstorer`d 
neglige - impressive geometry movers show-off and cutscenes. That massive amazing castle-mountain alone is insta classic. Too bad the gameplay is lacking. Even the first map felt rather empty (maybe cause Iv circled those square corridors several times). Great final sequence that would crown any pack/tc.

headthump - as always style and texturing allover the place, doom3ish lighting with too many pitch dark spots, but it was prolly the most playable map with good combat setups

efdat - grand design pretty much wasted on the yet another mess-horde bloodcube combat :(
I didnt even bother

Really bad idea to limit a map to zer m6 'remake'. It was good the first time (back in whatever year) cause it was new and original and even then it was just ~20 seconds of blood run inbetween the other maps with other kinds of gameplay.
But doing this again is not any interesting cause its totally predictable and horde combat with the powerup doing most of the job for you is so meh :( 
Zerstorer`d 
Efdat's remake was great, and the intro was absolutely awesome. A little too hard with skill 1 for me.
Headthump's map - quality fun quaking.
Neg|ke - so much amazingness. 
Outside 
There's two cool secrets in adrlass2 (see neg|ke's demo).
Would have been nicer if it had been a jump pad/trampoline ;> 
Dead Link 
Thanks, Fixed. 
It's actually .rar
I should probably finish this some time... 
Thanks For The Demo, Trinca 
That moment when you are looking around for the fiend that you happen to be standing on, priceless! 
 
hummm will see my demo again :p 
 
I found Headthump's & Efdat's to be the most enjoyable maps. I don't mind saying that Headthump's map scared the shit out of me, and that's my favourite kind of map. So many evil monsters popping up from corners. And Efdat's map was a blast, really enjoyable and nice architecture.

Neg!ke's map I have respect for but I always disliked the first level of Zer and to me it basically felt the same. Sorry :( It felt pretty brooding though, and the Bloodcube battle was fun. 
Thanks Amoe! 
I've been freaky busy here of late, but I hope to get several more maps out the door this year. 
Sieh Nach 
you ashehoehttp://www.celephais.net/board/icons/icon32.gif
kenn you siie 
 
I am taking this to mean that I must replay this pack. 
Lol 
you must :D 
 
god, I'd almost forgotten how incredible aderlass is.
Holding up very fucking well. 
Replaying... 
 
Thread Bump 
 
Took You 3 Years And A Half To Finish Replaying? 
 
Yes 
I got stuck. 
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