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New Quake Map: Tower Of Dal Gurak
here is a new map its remake of Blade of Darkness' level Tower of Dal Gurak special thanks to Kinn as author of Marcher Fortress I have used Marcher's contents in my map (progs.dat, mdls, ents, sounds). Aguirre for glquake and compile tools, sielwolf for beta testing, and RickyT23 for beta testing.

the map 7z:



crashes fitz 
This map is beautiful! Been a real pleasure to playtest, congrats on the release :D :D

This map is fucking epic dude! 
speeds, "������� ��� ������� ���" :) 
once agan thank you for the real help 
Ok Beat It 
this is very much like doom2 in all the aspects good and bad, except more linear maybe 
Oh And For Some Justice 
unlike the readme says, the textures are taken from Quake 3, (original author of all the textures being Adrian Carmack or Kevin Cloud or I dunno who else) 
Oh And For Some Justice -2 
>unlike the readme says, the textures are taken from Quake 3, (original author of all the textures being Adrian Carmack or Kevin Cloud or I dunno who else)

yes the textures (most of them) are from Q3
but afaik Kinn modified 'em for a best suited
with quake's palette
so textures are taken directly from his map
if i've abused somebody someone i'm sorry 
Does it do something weird to brightness (looks almost like fullbright, even conback etc) or is it just me? 
second run (1st was godmode)

skill 1, extremely low fps, squished by lift (no thanks)

some abusage :-) 
about brightness, play with gamma 1 or just delete palette.lmp from the pak to enable regular id palette 
Why does this require aguirRe's engine? It did not make any extraordinary technical impression on me. Surely monster spawning could have been tweaked somehow? 
Yeah, I'm on a Mac so requiring an engine other than Fitz is a non-starter for me. 
it appears to have too many lightmaps, marksurfaces, and clipnodes. (might exceed other limits too) 
Dirty Commies 
it's not a bad map, so if you can run the engine somehow (or hack your own), play it.

spy, you should seriously consider removing the palette and reuploading this. 
Its a very good map, I dont know what you're all talking about! Its like a mid-evil warpspasm style map! Just get over the fact that it requires AguirRe's engine to run and play it!

I mean Mac users cant play it. But Mac users cant play Warp either.

Spy - People in this community are old - they just like complaining about things. People come along with exciting new stuff and they just sit and dis-dis-dis. They can be bothered to come on this forum and shit all over something, but they can't be arsed to just play the damn map and not be such fucking arseholes! 
OK Maybe I'm Getting A Bit Carried Away 
Spy - I would have released this as a bsp in a zip with a readme, saying it was a "custome map to be run with Kinns Marcher Fortess Mod"

I wouldnt have put it as a pak, just put the required files in the zip, so that they would be installed to the Marcher dir. 
is it a pig map or a hippo map? 
Definately A Hippo! 
A big cuddly hippo! Its got pretty good r_speeds, its just massive!

I've tested it about ten times! 
I would have thought this map would be right up your alley - big Mid-Evil Fantasy style map with good style and epic gameplay. 
>I would have released this as a bsp in a zip with a readme, saying it was a "custome map to be run with Kinns Marcher Fortess Mod"

maybe i should do it,but...

i've dedicated almost three fucking years of my life to this map and now i'm realize i shouldn't do it so massive. its just a litte tribute to the blade of darkness game 
I already played it and I was not that impressed. Sure it is kinda huge but that's it.
The gameplay mostly consists of horde combat, ammo is quasi unlimited until the end. Most func_s (buttons, lifts, doors) felt somehow rushed. There is no (feeling of) connectivity, one walks and shoots and walks and shoots. Enemy encounters are always the same, a horde of minors, two or three of those flying things. Many monsters "hey, peekaboo, here i am"-teleport in right in your face.
Texturing is so-so, lots of sloppy alignment. Lighting is quasi non-existant.

A good effort but way not in the league of its spiritual grandparents. 
For A First Release?! 
For a first release its fucking incredible!!! 
nah, i think you did right releasing it as a pak and the custom pal is just like idgamma with a bit more contrast - its not an issue (whoever dislikes it - just delete it from the pak) 
It's an ok map, and for a first release it's indeed good. The palette shift put me off (I played at gamma 0.9) but I got over it (that doesn't mean it's not an issue - you can't always blame the player for not liking something...) I hereby threaten to make more demos if nobody else does. Where is Sielwolf, by the way? Holiday?

Spy, it seems clear that you wanted to do something grand for your first release, and it came out OK. I think the basic brushwork, layout etc is pretty good. I have to surprisingly agree with Spirit about the lighting and monster/item placement, which is a bit on the simple side. The brightness/pal shift isn't so good for the textures I think, it makes them look a bit washed out. Nothing that can't be fixed in your next map though.

I liked the part where the bars close behind you (I normally hate that, but in this case there were enough options to handle it.) You can see it in my demo, the part right before the SNG. You used enough different monster types there, bombarding ogres, stairs, infighting, goodness. Spirit is right about the hordes of knights though, those combats weren't too exciting. I also liked the fight at the bell tower after you press the button.

What is this? Normally I do the whining?!

Played It 
Definitely enjoyed it. The massive scale of the map would make sense why it exceeds Quake's limits. Brushwork was really good, especially the terrain rocks.

Gameplay was well balanced. Although there may have been to much monster spawning in front of you, I don't think it ruins the experience.

The lighting was pretty convincing I thought. Well done.

The custom Quake palette was fine, although I wouldn't use it all the time. But for a once through, it was okay.

Very nice work spy. I hope to see more maps from you in the future. 
i�m 400 km from home but i can�t wait to get home to play this :)

spy all maps are good nobody pay us to map so... i think if we like what e�ve done it�s more then enought :)

my maps aren�t top but for the short time that i have to map i think they are pretty cool to play ;)

i will record a demo when i return ;) 
Hey, I'd play it if it wasn't restricted to an engine that I can't run. *shrug* 
i couldn't sleep last night since you didn't
like my map :) joke

>A good effort but way not in the league of its spiritual grandparents.

i know its not ideal, but nobody told its the best map in the world

today i would make the map different (but almost the whole map was made long time ago, i couldn't rebuild it)

honestly i'm sick of tired of this map
and i'm glad i finally release it

if you'd see it when i've asked to beta test it
you'd like it even less :) 
>Hey, I'd play it if it wasn't restricted to an engine that I can't run.

i'm really sorry 
Don't Take Me Too Serious 
I am a bit ill-tempered at the moment. 
"i'm really sorry"

Don't be sorry if you have a good, solid reason for requiring a specific engine. If it's laziness or something else then yes, be sorry. 
yes i had a reason 
This is not a dig, but more a question:

Do you have access to a Win32/64 platform? The thing is you see that its 2008, and I dont know about anyone else here but I've got PC's coming out of my ears. They are simply everywhere I look. Fuck there are three in my tiny house, four at work, loads at college, all my freinds have them etc etc...

Yu must have access to a Windows toting PC!?!? 
Better Yet 
Doesn't Leopard have something called Bootcamp or Parallels that allow you to run Windows in Mac OSX? Maybe Wine. You have choices either way. 
Some ppl only have 1 PC at home, can't play Quake at work, or choose to install something else on all their PCs. Or they live in some African country, or at MIT, or whatever...


I know I prefer playing Quake in my familiar environment. Sure I could go and ask the neighbors if they mind me installing a warezed killergame on their virused, bugged, unreliable winXP machine.

Where I live, they'd call the police, and the cops would want to see my Id.

I admit I didn't use AguirRe's engine either, I hacked Tyrquake a long time ago and turned it into a superslut that takes most everything that's thrown at it, even in software. I have no idea if it compiles on MacOS though. Want to try it Willem?

Just to open another front, Wine runs on MacOSX. :-E HA! 
OS Racism For The Win 
Note that aguirRe's Quake runs fairly unstable and buggy with Wine. For Linux, Darkplaces is the way to go for excessive maps. It seems Mac users (there's only one anyway?) either have to hack an existing Mac engine or wait for the new version of Fitzquake. 
It was a simple comment. Not looking to start another tiresome OS flamewar guys. Carry on! 
I don't have 3d accel, and I don't want things falling out of maps etc, plus what you already said neg!ke, so it looks like homebrew for me. :-) 
Wait What? 
3d accel? how is that possible 
I'm interested in this modified tyrquake. DP runs this map superslow. \: 
GL renderer doesn't work atm (some things need wrapping up), could be fixed quickly if there is interest.

software x11 binary (hope this works):


let's take this elsewhere (General Abuse) plz kthx 
Darkplaces Runs Fine 
for me works dp fine. speed is the same as in marcher fortress. no problem...and i have a bit old pc - gf6600gt/athlon xp 2.8 ghz. looks much better with dp, the only problem are the black squares that appear inside the granade explosions. have you anybody found out how to get rid off them? btw...great level :-) 
>black squares that appear inside the granade explosions

dps' bug ? 
Blackish Something 
yeah... i know it sounds strange :) but it's hard to describe it. it appears only for a moment when granade or rocket explodes. the same "bug" is in marcher fortress as well. kinn used some extra sprite for explosions (for me it looks similiar to explosion in older but still good game return to castle wolfenstein). and dp can't handle it. 
Well, I have 2.4GHz Celeron with some GF 7300 GS (!?) and yeah, it runs fine when standing. Then it's 40-80 fps in the start area. But when moving and/or looking around it drops down to 5-15 fps... Also had this bug with big, black square around explosion.

I played it in "slutquake", runs smooth there (and looks like in '96 ;). 
Black Squares On Explosions 
It might be that the particular engine you are using is trying to draw the .tga versions of the sprites, and is doing it incorrectly for whatever reason.

I know DP worked fine with this at the time of Marcher's release, so something has changed in DP since then. 
its probably your gpu 
No It's An Old 
DP bug, the tga sprites are fine. 
Maybe It's Just Me 
The posts are more positive than negative but for me not so good. (trying to be polite and not curse).
The read me didn't tell how to run the map and I forgot so I installed an old quake front end and when it loaded it gave an error.
Couldn't find anything online about running a map with a pak file either.
Apparently you need something more than just quake. I use Fitzquake because it works good for me and brightens the game and has mouse look - crosshair etc.
Guess I'll just have to pass this one up.
Free is free but it don't work for me.
Hey I'm a poet. 
Unzip to quake\bod and run quake with the command line glquake -game bod
-heapsize 65536 (or more)
if won't run with a fitzquake
glquake here its aguirRe's engine (regular or
neh version) for neh version you should include
-id1 in your cmd line
I'm unable to use aguirRe's engine.

I get this error:
"Couldn't set fullscreen DIB mode"

Quake then dies. Vista (ick), Intel 945GM integrated graphics thing. I've tried -refreshrate 60 on the command line as a very quick googling suggests... anyone have any ideas? 
try adding
-bpp 32 -nocdaudio -window -width 1024 -heapsize 48000

will run in a window 1024x768 
I've Heard 
that Intel gfx cards are tricky with OpenGL. You could try -window with -width set to the same as the desktop (e.g. "-window -width 1280" if your desktop is at 1280x960).

If you can't get it to work, you can hopefully always use WinQuake 1.33 (my version also handles big maps like this one). 
Lizard Says Thanks 
Heapsize 66000, aguirRe's glquake and I'm playing. Getting my butt kicked but I'm playing. Looks good so far. Thanks again 
So, well, I'm disappointed... there are nive details touch, and some pure crap area...
Gameplay is weird... you can touch monsters, and they don't react at all: you have to hit them, and then the fun starts... As well, the spawning is visible...
And finally, the lightning effects are flat as Hell...

This map really need a complete rework... sorry man... 
>Gameplay is weird... you can touch monsters, and they don't react at all: you have to hit them, and then the fun starts... As well, the spawning is visible...

please demo

>This map really need a complete rework...

ok. by your request i'll rework it 
Here it is...

And well, don't feel hurted if my comments sound hard, but for a first map, it is not that bad ;) I did worst you know :P 
Go to your display settings and change the screen resolution to (say) 800 x 600, accept the change, then change it back to what it was, then run Quake again.

This happens regularly with my ATI cards and the above fixes it immediately, no re-boot required. 
...I should have said that it often happens to me if I have been using some other application beforehand that displays in full-screen mode e.g. another game. 
maybe you have a virus? 
Ooooh A New Map... 
The reason why the monsters don't attack you is because the Marcher progs automatically sets god mode and notarget if developer cvar is set. It's the same as in Marcher.

Set developer 0 and restart. 
It sucks :P 
>It sucks :P

jpl , are you feeling happy, now? 
Forgive JPL, he is just pissed that his recent ego boost from playing your map without taking any damage has been a mistake. ;p

I would not advise you to rework this map. It is a nice work just with some quirks, that's completely normal. Now just move along and take any criticism with you for new works! That's the path to glory and babes. 
What sucks ? The fact that enabling developer c_var stucked the monsters, and I had no fun at all...
Now the surprise is over, and I'm disapointed... sorry ;) ...

Anyway, I didn't really like your map architecturally speaking, while it seems you put a lot of efforts in it....
Well, it is difficult to please everybody, maube with a different texture set selection, it could have been better... thought...

Anyway, don't take my nasty comments as "stop mapping"... no no no, just take that as a "damned, I have to improve myself" and please persevere in Quake mapping...

I'll look forward for your next release ;) 
>ok. by your request i'll rework it

it was a sarcasm (ofcource i won't rework it)

>What sucks ? The fact that enabling developer c_var stucked the monsters, and I had no fun at all...

this map uses the progs,dat (property of kinn) from the marcher fortress, so its not my fault if you've enabled developer 1 its automatically sets godmod on and notarget on (its hardcoded in the progs.dat), i should make it clear 'bout it (just forgotten)

as a fact that you didn't like the map i can live through it :) its just a matter of taste

as previously i have said the layout of the map is not original, its remake of the blade of darkness' level 'todg'
install the bod and compare two maps :)

when i have played the bod back in 2005 i thought it would be cool to make a remake of "todg"

the only shame i'm feeling now, that my map has a lot of ammo (especially start area) i would remove half of it now (but watching mr.Richard's demo i see sometimes(often) he runs out of the ammo, so i've decided to add the ammo) 

I agree with Spirit. No need to spend any more time on this map. You got it done, you released it - time to move on! Good job on getting a full map done, lots of people never reach this step to begin with.

We all had first maps. Look up "Eye Socket" some day if you want to see my first Quake release from way back in the day.

Can't wait to see your next creation! 
Eye Socket

quaddicted rocks.

Haven't tried this map yet, but then I've not played many new releases later. I've got quite a backlog to work my way through :( 
Oh god, that screenshot. THE HORROR! 
Spys Map 
is definately better looking than that map. Its about 30 times bigger too! 
Sure. However, let's keep in mind that back then we had Quake (the original from id, no special engines), basic textures, r_speed limits, etc.

You know - control and restraint. :)

Plus, I sucked. I mean 'Eye Socket' isn't bad as first maps go but I definitely had a lot of learning to do. 
>We all had first maps. Look up "Eye Socket"

wow, i've just realized you are "Taskmaster"

one more a legend :) 
That's His First Quake Map 
I seem to recall a Doom II map, 99 Ways to Die, was it? 
Yeah, '99 Ways To Die' for Doom2 was my first LD experience for realz. 
Pretty Good Map That One 
I can sympathize. I would hate for anyone to dig up my first map (released for Thief). It makes my
first Quake release look like the Taj Mahal in comparison. 
>I can sympathize. I would hate for anyone to dig up my first map (released for Thief)

link please 
Sorry Spy, 
that is not going to happen. If you do happen to find it, I would not even claim ownership. It is that bad. 
I think the only reason Eye Socket wasn't a complete abomination was because of my earlier experience with 99 Ways To Die. That map gave me a decent foundation of knowledge to build on. 
>If you do happen to find it, I would not even claim ownership. It is that bad.

I don't care, i love that game (Thief) 
Good Game, Terrible Editor 
but I wont claim that as an excuse, some mappers have made some Godly Good levels with Drome.

Honestly, I would not know where to hunt for old Thief maps these days. 
I've Always Loved 
dm-stomp from the RTNP mission apck, I think at one stage I even requested you for a UT version willem. 
DM_Stomp ... wow! I actually had to google around to figure out what that was. Turns out I made it! I can barely remember it and all I could find is one small screen shot. Shame... 
I Think I Still Have The Rtnp Mission Pack Somewhere 
I can mail you the unr file if you like :) 
Of Course 
I havent played the map in a while, so nostalgia may be making it out to be better than it actually was :) 
I'm positive that nostalgia is playing a role here. :) 
Played Through 
I played through. This was a fun map, huge and with some challenge on skill 2. There were no unfiar sections and supplies were ample enough. Using infighting helps as well.

Some of the textures were a bit ugly but other areas looked fine with the Q3 choices.

I did get stumped by the frozen monsters so I did get an easy preview. Once I set -developer 0, it ran fine.

I got all 8 secrets but one was a bit tricky. Some you easily tripped over, others needed some searching - all were fair.

Good map and I hope you make more. 
>Some of the textures were a bit ugly ...

which one? 
Played This Yesterday.. 
it felt a bit like a supersized speedmap. obviously it couldn't have been made in the same kind of timescale but it had a bit of a 'quantity over quality' feel about it all the same..

the gameplay just seemed to be horde after horde of samey gameplay; there was always shitloads of room to move about in so it was rarely ever a challenge, except for the end battle and when i practically ran out of ammo on the shamblers near the start. then there was the layout.. despite it being one of the biggest maps i've ever seen it only took me ~25 mins to complete (marcher was over twice that, warpc 4x), since it was pretty much just a linear run'n'gun with no exploration or backtracking, and nowhere requiring hesitant gameplay..

still, it wasn't BAD by any means. it was fun enough for a quick blast; some of the designs were cool (if simple) and the impressive scale was nicely pulled off. i just probably wouldn't have spent three years making it :P 
finally had time to play the map properly!!!


i think is bloody ownsome, scale of map is very good and the use of the textures was pretty good for the size of the map with a good layout.


to many hordes and few amo and spawns in your face suck a lot... better guns early would make game play much fun... the few amo and small guns made game play slow and bored! in both demo 1st run and 2 run died because of no amo... :( and when we died because of no amo is terrible :\

p.s�� I think you have lots of potential hope to see more from you ;) and next time make a smaller map ;)

thks for the fun map my friend more please!!! 
I eventually played with Winquake, fun blast from the past. Map was fun, I've got no complaints apart from monsters spawning in my face. The end bloodbath was better done than I expected. The bell tower was terrifying!

BTW, Mike, thanks for the tip, going to 800x600 does indeed fix that error but GLquake crashes when I try 'map bod' afterwards. No error message. Hmmm. 
Do You 
have some information about the crash, address, registers, Dr.Watson report or similar? Or is it a system lockup? 
I didn't find (dunno if they were available) any rocket launchers or lightning guns which I believe would have spiced things up a little bit - now it got a little repetitive after a while.

Took me a bit under 20 mins. I died once by falling into lava and then a few times when those three Shamblers spawned right in front of you (I saved in a bad position and almost made it impossible to continue). 
Quite Decent 
scale is impressive, brushwork gets a bit repetitive and plain but its fun even though it doesnt go much beyond horde combat.

There was a bug with monsters sometimes spawning right in front of you, sometimes right in your face.

Nice start. 
>There was a bug with monsters sometimes spawning right in front of you, sometimes right in your face.

it was done with purpose (ie an ogre)

maybe it was bad idea 
I dont think its a good idea, better gameplay options available than that.

also, I forgot to mention that I was glad to see kinn's baddies again, they should be included as part of quoth IMHO, very good fit into regular quake. 
if i remember correctly the rl and lg available
on skill 0,1 
Maybe so, but if they were hidden I missed them. I really don't look for secrets.

Btw, why aguirRe's GLQuake doesn't allow you to change resolution in game? I'm too lazy to bother myself with command line parameters so I ended up playing the map in 640x480.

Also, always include installation instructions in the txt since people who are playing their first Quake maps have no idea how to launch maps especially when they're in pak files. I also noticed that "game" command doesn't work in-game in GLQuake like it does in FitzQuake. 
you should create a batch file with something like a (glquake -heapsize 65536 -game bod -noserial -nojoy -noipx -nocdaudio -width 1280 -height 1024 -bpp 32) cmd line 
Oldschool fun.

The horde combat did get a bit repetative; a bit more chaos could have helped - more infighting, maybe giving the RL / LG on higher difficulties and throwing some of the other enemy types in - the spawn would have worked well to shit the player up and add some good infighting moments.

I was a bit let down not to see more of the shufflers as well - especially the brown berserker version, though I'm not sure if that's Bastion progs only.

The second half of the map was better for me, since the hordes were less because of the smaller areas.

I had the same developer bug as well, since all my autoexec's have it in, with the engine defaulting to id1 autoexec if there is none.

Luckily I checked here right after the first bridge / knight ambush so didn't lose much. 
Here is my demo - just up to the point when I got bored:

This map is a great effort with it's scale. It looked good in places with grand design. Had also a nice fight with fiends on a walkway. 
Slight Offtopic - Mac Engines 
I mean Mac users cant play it. But Mac users cant play Warp either.

I would like to dispel this rumor, as it is not true. Darkplaces runs on mac just fine, at least for me. Darkplaces runs warpspasm and this map.

The only caveat I should mention is that it looks like the latest darkplaces releases don't have a mac binary, I had to go back to the feb 22 08 release to find one. 
Architecture's above average, but texturing and lighting fails. Combat's not much fun either. Still, a promising start. It'd have helped if the map was a little smaller in the first place. Here's my run: 
Replayed This One Again Today!!! 
And it seems much more balance.

but died near the end!

if spy want to give a look... or not...

Thanks For The Demo Trinca 
you were so close ;) 
the space is very tight :( and i didn�t go to the other side of map becouse i forget :| lol

i will replay it again in next weekend... i will finish this bastard on hard! 
the end of my game is Dal Gurak not Abyss. What should I do 
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