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SpaceHulk256 Mapping Competition (cancelled)
Quake - Space Hulk 256
Level Design Competition
June till SP Day QExpo 2008
______________________________________________________________________________________

You are the slipgate warrior. You've travelled for what seems forever,
in search of that one gate that will take you...home. This time round
you seem to have landed on a floating fortress under attack; both
insurgents and defenders ignore their animosity long enough to rid the
battle ground of your presence. They will fight each other if goaded,
but mostly they want to kill YOU!

OK, get amongst it!
______________________________________________________________________________________

Inspired by:
- Quake (thanks Id)
- the IK Base texture set (thanks Fingers)
- the 100 brush competition concept (thanks Aardappel et al)
- the (out of print) board game Space Hulk (thanks Games Workshop)
- the release of the Quoth2 upgrade (thanks Kell, necros and Preach)
I can now announce the Quake - Space Hulk 256 Level Design Competition

Your Motivation:
Space Hulk the board game:
- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Space_Hulk
- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aViccm7dk94
- http://spacehulk.barsoom.cc/sh1edinv/
- http://www.strategygamersworld.com/resources/Space%20Hulk%20Edition%201%20rules.pdf
- http://spacehulk.beckerf.de/index.html

The Limits:
- the -game option is 'quoth' with the quoth2upgrade installed
- each level will contain no more than 256 brushes
- these brushes will be clothed only in textures from:
-- the IKBASE.wad http://shub-hub.com/files/textures_wads/ikbase_r2.zip and,
-- the hulk_xtra.wad http://shub-hub.com/files/textures_wads/hulk_xtra.zip
- it's in space, so:
-- use the sky textures in hulk_xtra.wad and,
-- signal the 'stars' or 'void' skybox in the worldspawn
- enemy is limited to fiend, enforcer, defender, pyro and eliminator
- the level must include three "safe" coop starts
- the level must have all difficulty levels implemented
- the level must be playable at reasonable framerate in fitzquake 0.80
- the level must exit to 'start'.

Submission:
- please send a .zip containing:
-- a level 4 vised, fully lit .bsp named 'sh256_yournick.bsp'
-- a matching .map for brush number checking
-- a matching .txt thanking those who helped you and explaining the
mission/gameplay type
- please send to spacehulk256 *at* gmail *dot* com
- submission must arrive prior to the end of QExpo2008 day 1.

Referee:
- Paul 'distrans' Brosche

Judges:
- Scragbait
- ?
- ?

Judging Criteria:
- use of the 256 brushes,
- quality of the resulting architecture and atmosphere,
- use of Quoth(2) functionality
- gameplay.

Prizes:
- 1st == 'fiend' maquette by David McKenna http://mckenna3d.com/
- 2nd == Quake symbol by Spirit?
- 3rd and below == kudos
Amazing 
Damn base maps!
I love the restriction to 256 brushes. This includes func-, trigger and other brushes right? 
256 
how big is that now? any idea I could get a comparison if a map with that many brushes has been released. 
 
Well, it could be a huge map with little detail or a small map with lots of detail. Depends on how you want to spend the brushes. :) 
Eh 
i don't want to do a map with only fiends and enforcers :( 
Cool 
I assume combining textures is not allowed?

Quoth2's point triggers will pay off. Using its external bmodel feature is cheating, though. ;) 
My Packs On Hold 
I'm in.

What date is the start of Qexpo / deadline for the competition.

Space Hulk is the dogs bollocks, by the way. 
How Long We Got?!?!?! 
 
Qexpo 
Approximately last week of July 
Enemy Is Limited To... 
what? why? :(( 
 
to roughly resemble the Space Hulk bestiary. 
Hah 
Quoth2's point triggers will pay off. Using its external bmodel feature is cheating, though. ;)

You should clarify this before you start. Will this be considered valid or not? 
Yeah No Scrags 
just look who is judging... 
 
For more Space Hulk goodness, and for the folks who want to actually play the game, head on over to:
http://www.teardown.se/

Unfortunately, despite allegedly having permission from Games Workshop to release the game, the makers have since had to take it down thanks to pressure from GW. Maybe it was too good. See if it's up soon again, or find it elsewhere... 
Some Interest... 
...this is good!

Spirit: yes, all brushes...and I'll be in contact re: the possibility of a rune for 2nd prize.

nitin: any of the place getters in any of the 100 brush comps should give you an idea of what might be possible, and since Quoth(2) has spawning one doesn't need to waste brushes on monster teleports. Also see Xen's standalone 100 brush map Centurion or CZG's Rabbit In The Deadlights.

Willem: yes, but if you check out the 100b packs I think you'll be surprised at the size AND detail expected.

megaman: ...then don't.

negke: I think as long as one doesn't combine the set textures with any from outside the sets then that'd be fine, although mappers need to carefully read the .txt accompanying finger's IKBase set...then make up their own mind about combining at all.

If it can be done in Quoth(2) then it's fair game. If someone can really optimise the use of the external bmodel function in five weeks, fine...but remember the criteria for judging, doing so would gain you points in the third criterion only...but so would including breakables.

RickyT23: 5 maybe 6 weeks, you'll know more when the QExpo dates are announced.

Speeds: I've included links...

I've started on the start map already, and should have some shots of that and the fiend maquette soon. 
3 Point Clipping... 
is pretty damned useful for this kind of map I think... It's a good way to maximise the number of faces on your brushes and it enables easier carving of weird angles. brush merge is quite handy too. Radiant has both of these features :) 
Btw 
most entities have some effect on gameplay and or atmosphere, if they don't there isn't much point in including them, so surely including Quoth entities like external bmodels and breakables can gain you points in any category the effect of them on your map is relevant to. 
One More 
this is pretty hardcore. Might be interesting anyway: http://spacehulk.beckerf.de/

check out the 3d pages. 
Links? 
dont explain anything about monster use limits.
why cant shamblers or scrags or vores be tyranid-likes? and ogres have resemblance to the bulky space marines, except the skin

and do you mean the map also has to be flat to be space-hulk like, like in the reference pics/vid?
(never played any spacehulk-thing)

and whats the point of brushlimit if you can re-use bmodels like 200 times 
External Bmodels 
NONONO! Allowing this would completely destroy the idea of a limit on the number of brushes.
It seems to be very easy: http://kell.quaddicted.com/quoth/quoth_tutorial.html#external


distrans: No need for that. It's ready. :) 
Too Many Rules 
But it sounds interesting 
Are External Files Allowed? 
And what's the format for external files - sounds and models.

Should they be inside a nick folder?

eg. progs/ijed/whatever.mdl
or
sound/ijed/whatever.wav

I'm assuming external BSPs are illegal. 
In My View, 
no external files such as (b)models and sounds should be allowed.
Point triggers are a bit of a gray zone as vanilla Quake also allows point entity triggers, Quoth2 only adds the possibility of changing their volume.
"Use of Quoth(2) functionality" is a somewhat questionable criterion of judgement. I'd consider maps that come with additional files as a rather 'unlcean' solution, regardless of the apparent benefits regarding the limitations the rules impose. 
It's Pretty Fuzzy 
Since the Quoth corpses are there, as well as custom mapobjects being able to call eg. the player model to place it as a corpse.

How about no (new) external files allowed but with no entities banned? Content that's already in Quake / Quoth can be used. 
Yes 
I don't consider corpses (and other already precached stuff) as external things. 
OK... 
...the sage heads have it!

NO external files, NO entities banned.

Yes of course, all the judging criteria interelate.

Thanks for getting interested enough to make it a cleaner competition, I really appreciate it.

Speeds: I think I've been pretty patient with you over the last montht. If you aren't interested in mapping for these limits, then don't...but stop raining on everyone else's parade! 
 
i wil try to make one but i dont promiss nothing becouse my time is so shoortttttttttttttttt :|

let�s see... and i whould prefer with Id1 use only :p

:\ 
Trinca 
You don't have to use the modified Enforcers. 
 
that clears the bmodels but not the other 2 questions 
 
i think is a positive idear for us "small Quake comunity" make somehing to share with all Quakers in Qexpo...

and since is only 256 brushes is not a big deal and a lot of people can participate, but i think there are to many rules... :p 
My Opinion On External Bmodels 
Ok, first up, I'm not participating either way, so my opinion is irrelevant. With that said, I think you should give more serious consideration to allowing external bmodels.

Why?

Firstly, it's an interesting new feature of Quoth 2. Part of the judging criteria is "use of Quoth 2 features".

Secondly, if you think about it for a minute you'll realise there's going to be a few major restrictions and limitations. External bmodels are not just a free ticket to adding stacks of detail without using "standard" brushes:

- there's going to be lighting issues
- as an entity the external bmodel cannot block visibility
- if used simply as additional detail, it will add to your entity data

The last point is especially important if, as I assume will be the case, a requirement of the competition is that the map must fit within standard engine limits, so that it can be loaded and played in basically any Quake exe.

Also, think beyond the competition and maybe you'll think it's a good idea to allow external bmodels, so people can get used to using them and learn the pros and cons of doing so (on paper it sounds like a feature with a lot of potential, but it's hard to know until you try it).

Either way, everyone is mapping using the same rules and restrictions - it's going to be "fair" for everyone regardless of what the rules are. So I guess it all comes down to what the judging criteria will be, and what you want to place more emphasis on.

All I'm saying is maybe think about it and discuss it more thoroughly, rather than making a snap decision.

Personally I think you'll get more interesting and varied maps if you allow external files, while still requiring mappers to be efficient and clever in their brush/entity use (thereby satisfying the requirements for a good competition). 
Engine Limits 
I mentioned this in the previous post, but in case you missed it in the wall of text, I'm going to say it again:

Please tell us whether it is a requirement of the competition that the map must fit within standard engine limits, so that it can be loaded and played in basically any Quake exe.

This is soft of implied in that you've said the map must be playable in FitzQuake, but I think it would be better to clearly state it in the rules so that there's no confusion. (Besides, Fitz has at least a few engine limits raised, I'd reckon the map should load in ye olde standard software Quake as well). 
 
Why?

Because allowing an indefinite amount of external brushes defies the point of having a brushlimit at all. 
 
Because allowing an indefinite amount of external brushes defies the point of having a brushlimit at all.

And what is the point? (serious question).

Regardless of what the point is, you still have that same restriction - 256 world brushes. It's a fairly small amount for an SP map no matter which way you slice it.

Look, I'm not trying to be disingenuous here... obviously I get that the limited brush restriction is to see what each mapper can do with limited resources. But again, that restriction is still there, and external bmodels, while helpful, are also going to have issues and be limited in number too (entity limits).

My argument is that by allowing external bmodels, you may get this:

- More interesting and varied maps
- Additional challenge for the mappers (how to get the most out of bmodels? What's the tradeoff between entities for bmodel detail and gameplay stuff like monsters?)
- More use of the new Quoth functionality 
Come On 
Models can be called from inside id1 and Quoth1/2 - there's enough there to mess around with. Toxin tanks, air filtration systems and computer consoles might fit the various missions well, but so would a made to order progs, genestealer and space marine models.

The competition is pretty simple - a zip archive with three files only inside it; source, bsp and readme - just those, nothing extra (including .lit I take it). It must run reasonably in fitzquake.

It's a competition based on limits. How well you map when so heavily restricted is if you deserve to win David McKenna's Fiend or not - a decent carrot if ever there was. 
Agree With Frib 
Do it. 
Start Button 
On a technical note, you may want to choose a different name for your start map. There is already a start.bsp map in the quoth package, and since it is in the pak file it will override whatever start map you provide. Something like sh_start might be better. 
Aye Frib... 
...all good stuff (which pretty much followed my initial lengthy ruminations), and what initially made me say booyah if Quoth(2) can do it...it's in. However, I think there's enough new stuff in Quoth(2) for mappers to explore this time round, without including external files. Perhaps a future competition with more lead in time, fewer limits and (most importantly) a greater turn around time from deadline to release might include all Quoth(2)'s goodness.

The map must fit within the fitzquake 0.80 engine limits.

Preach: even if the start level is in a pak with the rest of the maps, files etc. in it's own directory off Quoth? Or is there some problem setting it up this way?

As to 'too many rules', there's been brush restricted comps before and brush/texture restricted comps, all this does is add a restriction that strengthens theme. All the rest are what you would generally (though - technically - not in all cases) expect to do anyway if you were submitting an SP release worthy of release.

The skill selection area is complete bar some final tweaking of the lighting, and then I'll start on the halls of glory (rest assured, there'll be no cesspit in this introduction level hehee!). 
Oh, And... 
Spirit, you are a champion! 
Well 
If you do it like that you're also going to have to supply the entirety of quoth again, because there's no way to tell it to use the mod from the quoth directory with files from another directory. It'd be much easier to just supply maps with a unique name, as then people can extract them into their current quoth install. 
What About 
sh256_start and then putting "lose_items" "1" in worldspawn of the start map? 
OK... 
Ta much Preach, and Lardarse...an elegant solution.

Let's have those trigger_changelevels point to 'sh_start' (force of habit, I like to keep .bsp names to 8 characters) 
'sh_start' 
Distrans 
Nice, as usual ;) 
 
what day of june is? i�m in vacation i dont have quark in here or anything to map :p but i whould like to make a map since is only 256 brushes... 
Distrans 
looks nice, but what about making the nightmare entrance(hell?) a little secret? Even if it's just an obvious button or something, I always enjoy start maps more that way. 
Ta... 
JPL. Trinca, when do you get back from hols? Seilwolf, hmmmmmmmmm, I have an idea... 
Distrans 
I'm not on holidays, I'm currently working on a huge map project... so no time to participate :( Sorry my friend ;) Maybe I'll ask you to beta test my map ;) 
 
19 of june Distrans 
Ok... 
...no prob JPL. Trinca, you should have at least 4 weeks to get something together after you finish your hols.

Judges finalised: scragbait, seilwolf and kell.

If a kind moderator could edit the judges list and change 'start' to 'sh_start' in the 'limits' section I'd be most grateful. 
Damn... 
...once again I've mispelled his name, 'sielwolf' that is. 
Remember 
I before E except after C 
In Other News 
I've been "budgeting" my map, seeing how many brushes I need for various things, and I think I have 30 spare brushes. Any ideas for what I could do with them? 
Obviously 
That would make a decent 10 genitals. Less if you choose more details. 
Dis 
np, I'm curious with what variation you will come up next 
 
Ceilwolf is watching you masturbate. 
Ke 
careful I'm a judge now...or else. 
Ok 
So I'll better be multiplying the monster count by 3 to please you... 
 
ok, take me out i officialy quit mapping for good! 
QExpo Start Dates Announced 
Meaning that the dedaline for everyone serious about this is August 5th. See the QExpo thread for the official announcement. 
Define "safe" 
- the level must include three "safe" coop starts

Also, is the 3 just a minimum, or is it a maximum as well? 
Safe - 
The opposite of a nazi dentist looking for diamonds. 
Attention 
The Space Hulk 256 Competition is cancelled

Apologies for any inconvenience. 
 
Well, I never! And after all of that high quality bitching that everyone turned in. 
Distrans 
Oh, why ? 
Maybe 
we should have a mapping competion where the entries are judged on how much drama, whining and shit the mapper can post on an internet forum during the map-building process, with bonus points for talking about aspects of their personal life that no-one else cares about and how it has affected the quality of the submitted entry. 
#62 
Do you want the thread/title edited to avoid any confusion?? 
Kinn 
Bad idea: Trinca already won the contest :P 
Can You Believe That? 
was this a hoax from the start 
Ah 
Cool.

Next time I won't bother, then.

I'll be releasing a map in a week or so anyhow. 
I Have To Mention This 
In his last mail, Distrans mentioned he was fed up with the trolling/negativity about this project AND his work mail has been bulk spammed from assorted russian servers...

I mean what was he thinking; releasing that sucky base map which no-one likes and then taking initiative without the consens of 'the true Quake community'(tm) *fanfares trumpets and stuff* 
Sad But True 
I understand canning this with all my heart. 
Sielwolf 
Wrong, not everybody was flaming his last base map: I really loved it. As wel as this mapping contest project that sounds great (while I will not participate due to lack of time, and all the remaining work on my current project i want to finish before).
I think distrans has very good reasons to be pissed off by the elitist and purist attitudes shown for his "Ruined Nation" base map, and all the sarcasms posted there (there was a parallel thread that was very stupid BTW). So I can understand his decision.
Damned, after Trinca, distrans.. who will be the next to "abandon" the community ? Are we so much or what ?
I've been told a while ago that posting maps here will not issued onto a "popularity contest", and I could expect to be flamed a lot... but sometimes, some people should think twice before systematically be negative what other hobbyists do...
Anyway, I hope distrans will come back with a fucking good map, just to show us how how fucking good is his maping skill :P 
Too Much... 
.. fucking, kill the fucker :P 
Err 
what? 
Ok 
But expecting people not to troll stuff that you post on func is a bit unrealistic. There's plenty of good people here, but theres also a good percentage of arseholes.

The only new threads or posts that aren't automatically bitched about are map releases, and even then it's about 50% of the time.

You can understand me being a bit narked, but it's no big deal. At least there'll soon be a finished map. 
Yup 
I was a bit dismayed since I really wanted that Demon1 statue. But since my map currently only has ~40 brushes I suppose it's not so bad. Still, it sucks that it was canceled cuz I was planning on participating in this. 
Then Make The Map Anyway 
And all the "nazi dentists looking for diamonds" around here can go fuck themselves... 
Safe 
Why not make it a speedmapping session - whatever everyone who started a map has, they finish it by next weekend?

No rules, no Fiend statue, just to get it out of the way. 
Or 
Whenever works best.

Lardarse - I wouldn't have expected you to be thin skinned with a name like that. 
Shrug 
Just meant it as a joke.

I'd assume safe coop start meaning without alerted monsters. 
Ijed 
I didn't mean you by that comment. I was refering to the people arouind here who seem to not appreaciate anything that they didn't defecate themselves. Your quote was just too cool to use, though... 
And As For By End Of Next Weekend 
(which would be turtle mapping not speedmapping, but I don't feel like splitting hairs right now...)

That sounds good. Means that I have another week to put the final 130 brushes in... 
Updated Thread Title... 
Anyway, I don't think the Ruined Nations thread was unusually harsh or anything; the map was controversial but I think the controversy was constructive and interesting, it's actually a success to have a map that people are that passionate about.

The amount of negative response in this thread seemed a bit harsh, but still not unusual. Creating a whole second thread in order to mock this one was beyond the normal levels of func negativity, though. It was well excecuted mockery, but unfortunately the target didn't actually deserve it. I don't blame him for giving up on the whole thing, why put up with this much crap just to run a contest? 
Hm 
Without really remembering the contents of this thread, i don't think it was overly harsh, not even lun's cynism. That thread was just the appropriate, #tf-y reaction to a contest with seemingly pedantic rules. I loled ;)

And, yeah, melt's right, the map release thread was ok & fine, imho. awesome graphics + controversial gameplay = people tend to care and bitch and moan and praise.

don't take it too seriously! 
I Took Lun's Reaction 
to be a general parody of Quake mapping contest in line with criticism he has given going back to the 100 Brush contest with it's stupid no Quake textures rule, and if he intended it to mock a specific contest, more likely, he would have done so in that contest' post. 
Thank You 
I'm glad some of you got it. I really hope the cancellation isn't because of me, because I was just playing the court jester. Biting, but ultimately good natured. 
Do It Anyway In Support Of Distrans 
I know I was looking forward to seeing these maps and I can't be the only one.

I'm sure almost no one cares about mapping due a prize, honestly the Quake mapping community like most of the few remaining Quake communities is so inbred as to make competitions uninteresting.

I'm mostly posting in support of Lardarse, btw. Although he and I aren't really much alike, he is one of the few remaining human-like beings in the Quake continuum and I highly value his friendship.

/The StealthQuake420 thread was hilarious and I think most readers saw it not so much a parody of the SpaceHulk256 competition but many of the competitions in general. Have you guys ever seriously read your readme files? Jesus Christ how many times do you thank Ben Morris for fricking Worldcraft from 10 years ago and the people who made the compile tools -- sheesh! Beyond a certain reasonable extent, it becomes majorly gay.

/Almost clicked delete instead submit. Thanks to Sam Adams for making the beer that gave me the courage to click submit. 
Wait 
The Stealth Quake comp is a hoax?

Lunaran, there's a lot of curry bills on there way to you. 
Their 
 
:) 
I don't know if it's a sad or awesome that some of the juiciest, best drama I see in my life on a daily basis comes from this board.

A few things:

1) distrans is one of the nicest most dedicated people this community has so anyone that personally slagged him off can eat leather shoes for dinner (1920s insults only)

2) I totally forgot about this thread for a while, saw Lunaran's thread, laughed, then cringed when I realized that the reason Lun's thread seemed familiar was because it was a parody of this. As Lun said, I don't think it was anything more than a playful ribbing of the many interesting parameters of this contest so I hope that didn't factor into your shutting this down distrans.

3) Everyone should remember that we do this for fun and if it's not fun then don't do it and don't blame other people for the fact that you're not having fun.

4) *hugs distrans* you da man! 
Blitz 
Everyone should remember that we do this for fun and if it's not fun then don't do it and don't blame other people for the fact that you're not having fun.

This is the most sensible thing that anyone has posted here in a very long time. 
Further Advice 
:) 
:) 
Well 
Everyone should remember that we do this for fun and if it's not fun then don't do it ....

I agree with that point, we do it for fun, and when fun is not there, there's no reason to do it

.... and don't blame other people for the fact that you're not having fun.


Well that point is a little more controversial: you cannot blame people for not having fun with your map. you cannot blame people to express they don't like your map.
However: you can blame people to be nasty and systematically negative about your work, the more when it comes from the same people each times...

Just a small example (I will not finger point anybody): When I posted "Slime refinery Complex", and "Five Rivers Land", as well for the screenshots of my current project I get here and on #tf a you are mapping for the wrong game just because I was using an alternate texture sets (i.e Doom3 and Half Life)... It was exactely the same for distrans' map.
Surprisingly, I didn't read nasty comments about the visual of "Castle of the Dark Ages" (Daikatana episode 3 texture set), as well for "Event horizon" (Daikatana episode 2 texture set)... Was it because Daikatana is a failed quake sequel ??? Anyway...
I really thing some people here are too much conservative, and should open their mind regarding the fact that Quake is 12 years old, and that the game tend to evolve (visually, etc....). There are no good reasons not to experiment new things, and neither good reason to flame, nor to post sarcasms, just because he provide fun to the people who posts that... What si the idea behind that: is it just a matter to see how a mapper react ? Well, it sucks if it is the purpose of such behavior...

Well, I'm not asking everybody to be smart, I'm just saying that expressing his point of view through the net can be sometimes not well understood, and can be perceived as a personal attack... Maybe am I too much sensitive to what others think about my humble work ? But it does not help people to continue mapping for Quake... Well, If a map is pure crap, you can say it, but I think there are no good reason to insist after that: the smallest jokes are the best :P 
JPL 
There are no good reasons not to experiment new things

Sadly, for some of the regulars around here, there's a very good reason: they've forgotten how to be creative... 
Lardarse 
true.... 
Being An Arsehole 
and telling your target to just grow up and take it is stupid and irresponsible.

Sometimes we don't mean to be mean but we are. So let's cut that back a little, ok?

No man is an island. If people only map for themselves or for fun, why does this board even exist? 
Obvious ! 
If people only map for themselves or for fun, why does this board even exist?

To have the opportunity to post there: http://www.celephais.net/board/view_thread.php?id=60218 :P 
stupid and irresponsible is coming to an internet forum and being hyper-sensitive about comments made to or about you.

What the hell happened anyway? Qboard/PnF/Func used to have plenty of thoughtful, intelligent individuals who commanded respect, and there was plenty of good work and discussion all round (and some quality piss-taking of course!)

These days everyone is a teary-eyed fucking primadonna who can't even take valid criticism of their work when they ask for it, let alone cop a gentle ribbing with good grace...

Whatever. Maybe it's just me, right? 
 
"No man is an island. If people only map for themselves or for fun, why does this board even exist?"

For sharing your work and having discussions about it. It should NOT be the REASON why you make maps but rather it should be the outlet for getting them into the hands of people who might appreciate them. 
Is Anyone Else Working On A 256 Brush Map For This Weekend? 
 
So Full Of Crap... 
bambuz wrote:

<No man is an island. If people only map for them selves or for fun, why does this board even exist?>

so fucking true...

But some of the people prefer to be aggressive because there�s life are a fucking crap so they shoot the stress with a LOT OF NICE PEOPLE THAT EXISTS IN THIS COMMUNITY.

Those please go away that nobody will miss then...

and i say one write old school...

fuck off i play Quake since fev.1997 so i�m also old school but i have respect for others people work... but some in here are to good to make positive comments on other�s people maps they just spit crap out of there�s mouth.

Take the fucking old school status that is a fucking lie and be a fucking grownup boy. 
Well Maybe If Anyone Had Released A Decent Map Since 1998 This Wouldn 
't have been such a problem. 
 
Maby who should go map to make one to make that happened 
 
didn�t Nehahra had decent maps? errr i saw lots of then! 
 
#102

I apologize if I piss people off. I'm just very confident in my opinions and I express them in an up-front manner. I'll quiet down a little if it's irritating people. 
Ijed 
I am still working on my map as well. My target is 11:59pm UK time on Sunday night.

It still gives me a serious case of "holy shit" to realise that I will have made this map in less than 3 weeks, from planning to release... 
Bloody Hell 
will people just calm down and do what they want. 
But 
That's exactly what I am doing... 
I thought we could bundle them up and release at the same time - mine is more or less done but I'm not bothered to wait, lets me try and shift the polys about some more.

SpaceHulk256 turtle pack, I was thinking for a name. Bit of a misnomer so maybe leave the turtle bit out.

Nitin,

Bloody Hell . . . calm down

Yeah, ok. 
Trinca 
You're not very anonymous are you...

No point flouncing off Func_ if you're just going to come back and join in the arguments...

Maps are good. Mappers are good. Discussion about mapping is good. Word. 
FUNC IS DYINGING!!!!7 
(yes, I felt that was valid enough to replace the normal Hmm)

Firstly, 'old school' doesn't refer the time you've been playing Quake but this 'forum' (or the various generation of it) specifically, some (a lot in fact) of the people here have been posting for a decade or more. There's always been a fairly high level of sarcasm/bitterness/piss taking, if you can't deal with that then you're probably better off finding another forum rather than trying to get people to change their ways. Some people like the sarcy humour ;p

Secondly, you're talking about Q1 mapping here, yes, it is what originally spawned QBoard (and that strange EF thing I've heard of), but frankly the game/'community' is so old now that that's hardly it's primary focus, yes, a lot of us still enjoy mapping (if not releasing finished work), but that's not the only thing that brings people here. There is a lot of intelligent discussion at times, far more so that a lot of forums, but that is ruined if people have to continually tread on egg shells for fear of offending someone's excessively sensitive sensibilities. Grow some thicker skin, it's a generally useful life skill I assure you.

Whatever. Maybe it's just me, right?
No

For sharing your work and having discussions about it. It should NOT be the REASON why you make maps but rather it should be the outlet for getting them into the hands of people who might appreciate them.
Yes

I'll quiet down a little if it's irritating people.
No

No point flouncing off Func_ if you're just going to come back and join in the arguments...
I thought that was the point of func?

Maps are good. Mappers are good. Discussion about mapping is good. Word.
Word


Oh, and I spent at least 15 minutes staring out the window trying to remember the name of QMap. Damn you Frib. 
Well 
I think that nonentity has a good ethic.

I dont take it personally when people say unpleasant things on func. I'll never get to meet any of you people, so it would be silly to take any of it personally! It's good to talk to people who share an interest/passion for a game which I play!

Also I was pretty dumbfounded by the fact that anybody actually played my maps at all! Let alone post their opinions about them, and HELP ME LEARN HOW TO MAP BETTER.

And I dont think people should have to tip-toe around other people because they are scared someone might take it to heart!

I hope nobody takes any of my posting too seriously because it was never supposed to be very serious! Well maybe some of my early posts were a bit heartfelt, but I definately feel I have said things on this messageboard which are complete rubbish!

I like all of ye olde characters..... 
Bla Bla Bla 
ye Shambler i was nasty :\ i�m acting like a kid, but i�m so fucking pissed off :|

i still think people should cooperate more each other.

peace! 
Ijed 
I suggest that you don't wait. I'm not sure if I can finish in 4 days. I haven't even started on the lighting yet... 
Ok 
I'll probably post in saturday or sunday then. 
Trinca 
How about a nice cup of tea??

Being pissed off is all well and good but I'm not sure what it's all about. Maybe I've missed something but I still think it's a good community here. 
 
maby stress of having a small baby at home had some influence... :\ i�m to much fucking tired 
Ijed/lardarse 
#108 wasnt directed at your discussion btw, just realised it could have been read that way. 
Nitin 
It's all good, don't worry... 
<sip Dj> 
 
Arghhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh 
As opposed to the stress of having a large baby at home? 
#116 / #117 
ROFLMAO!!

Trinca can come round here for a nice cup of tea anytime, and keep me company in some of the darker, more sinister hours of loneliness ans solitary confinement.

Mmm-waha. Mmm-wahahaha. MWAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!! 
#118 
Errrr yes that could be it. 
Sorry, Was Delerious At Time Of Posting 
infact I just chuckled again, re-reading it.

117/8 
Love 
i love you 
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