|Posted by sikkpin [220.127.116.11] on 2008/06/29 21:35:28|
|Before I explain everything here, I need to upload the file (preferably to Shub-Hub), but according to the rules there, I need a password to do so.
If someone would be kind enough to provide it, I can upload the file and then complete this post.
Thanks, in advance.
The information for which you seek can be found at the very top of the screenshots and betas threads! ;)
Thanks for the quick response, RickyT23.
Ok, so the main purpose of this post is to ask for help from anyone willing to beta test and provide me with feedback on anything and everything they wish to tell me. Bugs, Feature Addition/Removal, Pros & Cons, Hardware compatibility, etc...
And, of course the other purpose is to give a little something back to a community that has provided me with so much for free.
Now, for a little bit of a description...
The software is based on eerie's http://eerie.anarxi.st/qe3/build.2007.09.05/
QE3.1 which is in turn based off of id's QE4. Most features are inspired or taken directly (with modifications for compatibility) from both Q3Radiant and QE5 by M. Milley http://www.yossman.net/~mmilley/qe5/
so much thanks and respect go Mr. Milley, Robert Duffy and anyone else at id who worked on the editors.
This originally started as a quest by me to find the original QuakeEd. I had wanted to start mapping for Quake again after a long break and within that time I had become accustomed to the Radiant style of editing. So Worldcraft, wasn't an option, BSP is a very nice editor but was just a bit different (even though it is almost 100% customizable) for my liking, and GTK Radiant, sadly, does not work on my laptop (a SiS chip).
So, finally I found both QE3 and QE5. Just what I was looking for but they were lacking features found in Radiant that I felt were essential.
I didn't think to start adding those features myself. I didn't think I had the ability. My C/C++ knowledge is very limited, only having read a few books on my own and that's its, so all I was going to do was change the icon. Then going through the code and finding that I understood some things, at least the Windows side of it, so I started messing around with things. Long story short...
This is Windows only (unless it will run under WinE or other emulators).
It comes with the current source and the original QE3 source by eerie along with most of the popular compile tools, conversion tools, entity definition files, and standard wad files. The only thing that needs to be done is to edit the "quake.qc" to match the directory paths you use.
Also, my internet access is limited, I tend to be gone for days, even weeks at a time so any replies or emails will be responded to when I get the chance. I'll try to provide more info or maybe a proper readme as soon as I can.
Thanks again, in advance.
Get the file here:
Immediate Error On Startup
After extraction, qe3.exe and instantly got an error saying:
"Could not load C:\Games\Quake\tools\/gfx/palette.lmp
GetLastError() = 3
So from the looks of it, I have to create a new directory just for the quake palette to run the editor? Seems a bit unnecessary. But maybe its just a bug.
I'm running Vista 32-bit.
I get the same error.
I don't like that this looks like it wants to be extracted into my base /quake/ dir. I have a lot of other shit cluttering up that folder already and it'd be nice if it were self-contained. It also looks like it wants my base quake dir to be c:/games/quake/ :)
In The Meantime
I've created c:/games/quake/tools/gfx/ and put palette.lmp in there, just to be diplomatic.
Impressions as I goof around in the program:
- The windows snap to each other. That is sexy. My hopes are already high.
- Loaded lundm1.map ... it looks like radiant, only minus GTK! ... I just blew a hole in the front of my pants.
- It didn't load the wad from my worldspawn ent. in fact, it seems to only look for wads in /gfx/. Okay, I'll put the wad in myquake/gfx/ and hit 'update texture list.'
- oh, now it's empty. where on earth is it looking? let's dick around in the project file.
- ah, you change c:/games/quake/tools/ HERE. A first-run dialog box that lets me set all that stuff before the program crashes out because it can't find anything, or at least some mention that I have to edit that file would be shibby.
- okay, let's edit this thing up and see how it works now. Got my texture wads path pointing to /id1/ where all the wads are ...
- the wads show up in the list but I can't load any of them, and the map is still checkered.
Okay, I think mainly the first thing I'd suggest is ripping out the project file thing completely and just going with proper preferences. I was surprised those kludgy projects persisted as long as they did in the GTKRadiant trunk. Worldcraft's preferences and compile dialog always beat radiant hands down.
Otherwise ... this feels just like radiant. I think this may have already become my new default editor. Nice work, man.
at least some mention that I have to edit that file - I will state for the record that yes, I finally noticed that he did in fact mention that.
it doesn't seem as if he's watching this thread now, though. I should email him. I woke up late last night, grabbed a drink, passed by the computer, and had to stop myself from poking too deeply into the source lest I be up until morning writing things.
is there a way to get more than just one editor window open at once? i hate having to cycle through views to get front, side, back.
at least in d3edit you can open up all 3 windows and manually place them, but here the menu command just switches the one window instead of opening up a new one.
at work so I can't check but isn't there a layout option in the prefs? radiant has it but I'm not sure if this qed does. I think the top/zchecker/camera was the only mode qed had.
either way, if you learn to map with top/zchecker/camera you won't go back. Having two side views seems kind of redundant to me now. I do a retarded amount of brushwork in the camera view.
Me too. I generally done everything done in top-down and camera view. I only use side views if I need a good look at what's going on there.
I use 4-view (including 3d preview)... but that's how i use max too, but often just use 3d view, it really depends on what i'm doing.
Anyhow, call me crazy.. but i think adding something like TF2 support would make you a god amongst men. Who knows, may even attract the ladies.
I'm yet to try this out for myself, would like to have preferences and stuff like the simple hardcoded paths fixed up so i can put it where-ever i like and same with my quake. Things i want to keep NEVER go on C drive. That is reserved for the almighty windows that could explode at any moment.
They Aren't Hard Coded
you have to edit the quake.qe3 file in the /scripts directory to point to the correct locations (ie: where you copied qe3)
The Windows Are
there's an "xy.c" and a "z.c" in the source, so, looks like those windows are so your only option that the code is actually named after it.
i meant about the gfx and pallete.lmp things.
really too bad about the one editor window at a time thing though. with the two qonquer maps out recently, i was going to try something out in qe3, but only having 1 editor window slows down the mapping process so much.
in that case, what Willem said. :\
Thanks, everyone, for the replies. This is exactly the kind of feedback I was looking for. I little things that are overlooked and not thought of because I know how it works internally. I'll go through the comments in order and give help where needed.
As a note: My setup is "Quake/tools/qe3.exe"
Also, keep in mind that the code is C-based, using the Windows SDK, and does not use MFC so things that you might like that are in Q3/GTKRadiant will be difficult or not possible (at least for me) to implement.
Orl: Yes, the palette location is hard coded to "location of qe3.exe/gfx". That's how id's QE2 & QE4 were and remains untouched for now. I'm guessing you just extracted the exe instead of everything. I guess I might as well put a new item in the project file for palette location that way people can have their wads and palette wherever they want.
Lunaran: One thing that I wondered but never bothered checking myself was whether wads HAD to be in /gfx in order to load from worldspawn. I'm pretty sure that whatever folder "texturepath" is it should load wads from it (not necessarily /gfx), but multiple locations I don't think so.
There is a run-first dialog if the quake.qe3 is not found. Maybe I should have left it out of the package. I assumed that most mappers here would be familiar with how QE4/QER/Q3R handles paths. My mistake. I don't know how GTK 1.5 does it.
Also goto "File/Edit Project" to edit the project file within the editor.
I don't know enough about how you have all the paths setup to know why your textures won't load. Sorry.
Necros: Only one XY window for now. That's how QE4 is. TAB cycles views though, of course. I personally prefer just one as 1) less cpu usage 2) larger view making it easier to edit. But since I'm doing this more for the public then for myself now, I will make it a priority to implement.
Electro: What exactly would be needed for TF2 support? I haven't done any editing for Source so I don't know what is different about the map file format. But since Valve has everything packaged together in the SDK it makes sense to just use Hammer.
Again, thanks for everyone's interest and I'm sorry there are problems for some. This is still very much a beta and I consider this release just for testing purposes. When I release this "officially" I plan to have a proper readme explaining everything needed for installation and setup and a manual, which if anyone would like to help with that, I'd be indebted.
I'll be online until tomorrow night (7/3/08) so, if you have questions that need a prompt answer...
If I can get this compiling, do you accept code contributions? :D
Of course. You could release any changes/additions as your own editor if you'd like. This is completely open for anyone to do and release what they will. I know the GPL stipulates that it has to be that way, I'm just saying that it wouldn't bother me if anyone did. Although, for the community's sake, it would probably be best to just have one QE3 to keep it simple and just add to that to make it better.
Anyways, you said "if". Is there a problem in compilation? It's a VC++6.0a project, if that helps any.
To everyone else: I have a bunch more commands that are ready to be inserted into the toolbar. My question is, would you want them added or would you rather have more screen space for editing? I prefer the later.
Also, if anyone is interested, I have a Q3Radiant exe that has free look, working camspeed slider, fixed Sphere command, and some other minor cosmetic changes.
The way the map file is laid out is a bit different, and i'm not sure what format their textures are in.. although i imagine it wouldn't be too much trouble to get them out as tga's for mapping for TF2 in this with.
Editing with hammer is just a real pain, radiants way of doing things is so much faster.
The .map files basically have the same data, just laid out differently, I don't have an example to show, but I made a box a while ago in TF2 that I can show you for how the formatting is.
Electro: Go ahead and send it to me. If you could, put some entities in there as well. Also if Hammer still uses FGD's or similar, send that as well. I'm not making any promises here, and I wouldn't even start on any other game compatibility until the Quake side is 100% complete and perfect. Do Source maps still use BSP/CSG/VIS/LIGHT compiling tools?
To Willem: Man, am I glad to find you here. How do you do your hollowing? How well does it work for oddly shaped brushes (e.g. cylinders, spheres, etc.)? Is it possible at all to have a look at your code? Pretty please.
My hollowing is basically making a brush and then making another smaller brush inside of it. I then subtract the small brush from the large brush and delete the small brush afterwards.
This works, of course, only as well as my CSG routines - which is barely. :)
Give me a few days to clean the code up and I'll see about providing a download. I have a few features that are half implemented which is what is preventing me from doing a new ToeTag version at the moment. I'll post in this thread when I have something worth downloading!
You know, I thought of doing that exact same thing. Unfortunately, when I tested it on non-cube brushes, it gave unfavorable results to where having overlapping brushes from normal hollowing was preferable.
I'm interested in trying your editor but I have no access to a Mac. I recently downloaded an emulator, though I haven't messed with it yet. Hopefully I can get it to work.
And, take your time with the code. It'll probably be a week or so until I'll be online again, so no rush.
Yes, it's not ideal but it basically works. When I get time I want to try some more optimal solutions. Hollowing is generally done on box brushes 95% of the time so it seems good enough for now.
Anyone hollowing a sphere in the Quake engine is asking for pain anyway. :)
I've got a hollow sphere prefab which I made. are there aany edtors which can make a sphere? had to make mine using czg's curve tutorial!!!
I haven't added one to ToeTag at this point because generally spheres cause tears. :)
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