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SM156 Is Here
We have TWO AMAZING NECROS MAPS and oh yeah I made one too. Try to give it a spin after you finish your post-sex cigarette from playing Necros' maps.

Link! sm156_pack.rar
and lets me forget this annoying discussion...
What was it about?
Ehhh,hem yeah!! Germany!!
Great maps by necros btw!! 

Great mapz, Necros!!! Love how you discover you have to kiss the edies goodbye. ;)

Nice oldschool lil' romp, Zwiffle. 
necros is a one map mapping machine, wow. Fantastic ideas and execution. Zwiffles was good too. 
I assume someone actually played through my map, which is fine, because I didn't actually test to see if the final part worked or not. I was already a day overdue so just kind of assumed that all the triggers worked, and the final door worked.

For Necros' maps, after playing the first one he sent me I knew there was no way I could outmap that, it was just too damn good. The second one at first I thought was bugged, or maybe I had put it in the wrong directory or something, because it was just too fucking mind blowing (that's what I choose to call it.) I still haven't beaten it, I haven't gotten past the rocket grunts on the boats yet.

But yeah, that first map was toooooooo fucking epic. Very solid turtle map, let alone a speed map! 
I Played SM156_zwiffle 
And once again Zwiffle retains the coveted "Least Heterosexual Quake Mapper" title. Bravo.

Someone needs to convert this to QuakeLive. 
Thanks bler, I take that as a compliment. 
Screenies Pleez 
Played Your Map Zwif 
ending fight works fine, but i fell off the elevated area so it was easier but also annoying because i had to go all the way back to get back up there.

ending chamber was weird but cool. :) 
The Monster Count In SM156_Necros2 Is Telling... 
Zwiffle, I went through one of the windows by the ammo area and couldn't get back 'round. Other than that, I liked your map's style.

Necros, could you please provide a MAP file for sm156_necros and check yourself back into therapy? Thanks.

Seriously, I thought negke was the only one capable of such sweet dementia ;)

Great maps, both of you!

the monster count is misleading. you probably won't even see 10% of that.

the second map i did is really just a bunch of rough, unformed ideas. 
I hate you. 
what? o.o 
A Hint 
if anyone is having trouble on sm156_necros2 in the lightning tube with all the edies, you have to shoot the 'god' (ie: the drummer texture) to stop the monsters and escape.
the lightning gets harder and harder to avoid the longer you take and more and more monsters will appear as well. 
Nice Maps 
That spinning nail trap is fucking great. Is one of the last gods darth vader pouring water?

Zwif - solid fun, although I think I broke it by falling out of the window. 
I died in the lightning tube, and was pretty disheartened.

Big fan of the first speedmap Necros. Amazed by that nail trap and not sure how you did that. I agree Generic - providing a MAP file would be rad, although I might never look at it.
Kind of glad I didn't submit my map - it would have been lame in comparison.

Zwiffle, your maps are always reliably fun little hallcrawlers and, once again, you came through for me. congratulations on being unheterosexual. 
I'm Not Unheterosexual 
I'm just the least heterosexual 
post #10

the spinning nail trap:

something i don't think anyone noticed is that you can target ANYTHING by a rotater.

this is how the monsters don't fall off the moving boats and the droles are attached to the plane. they are part of the rotater and have the same targetname as the rotate_objects and funce_movewalls.

i've been thinking of combining the chthon killable hack and a slow func_rotating_train to make a moving chthon map which could be cool. (or moving vermii for quoth) 
I have never even used a rotater, so HA!
my first mapping was in HL, and the quake rotating objects just seemed like a huge pain in the ass to set up, so I've never bothered. Not very dedicated to expanding my skillset, in that regard... 
They're Worse In Q1 
Origin brushes . . . 
yeah they suck to set up, but i just love rotating shit. 
No Shit 
I love that you love rotating shit. 
I Love To Shit Rotating... sue me. 
Without Rotating Shit 
. . . there'd be no cogs. 
Rock'n Roll !!. 
Definitely this pack is good ! My preference order:

1: necros
2: Zwiffle
3: necros2

necros: I don't know how you do all these shitty rotation stuffs, but OMG ! It owns !
Second map is too hallucinating for me :P

Zwiffle small castle architecture is incredibly good: could have been used for a complete map theme

And now go map !! 
Necros... the Best in this one. but in Map2 you had too much Vodka!!...
or didnt I...?Hmmm...
L>SD style mapping at its best(worst..???don�t get me wrong, this is great!)
Cheers from Cologne, GERMANY! 
The zombie juicer and rotating nailgun... damm cool ;>

Map 2 - Like those crappy doom mods, but peversely interesting. 
i love u.... 
great pak 
Shit There Is No Pak, But 
sorry for a triple post, actually quadruple post

i'm gonna see my friend.... 
Shit There Is No Pak, But

Ahem. :( 
Here's My Shitty Demo Of 
zwiffle's map

btw, i thinh this map has a great dm potential 
Fun Maps 
All maps are very good. I enjoyed playing them.
First necros map is awesome. Zwiffle's map is solid and good to play. The ending was too much though. Second map from necros is sooo wicked. Great stuff.
I think two demos are recorded with joequake and necros2 recorded with fitzquake: 
awesome stuff! Zwiffle, I would have enjoyed some more ammo and health in your level. I had to lure the last shambler to the edge of the walkway and jump-axe him repeatedly for 30 seconds or so. All levels rocked. Necros, your nailtrap = awesome. necros2 = everything awesome. 
aww ankh, you got blasted by the lightning right at the start. :(

i've been thinking of making a lightning sequence more like resident evil where instead of just speeding up overtime (rotating faster), it would go through patterns, each more funky than the last culminating in the final 'net' of lightning that is unavoidable if you haven't beaten the encounter quickly enough. 
Necros: no problem. I died in at least 5 tries until I realised what is going on. 
that, i think is the major problem with it.

it's cool and fun (for me anyway >_>) but it sucks that it's so far into the map (hence the message about saving).
i had hoped that the last couple of 'gods' had been represented enough so that it would be logical to expect the player to attack the textured wall instead of the monsters, but apparently not. :S
also, it was hard to strike a balance between making the encounter start to slow or too fast.
in retrospect, i should have had like a half dozen monsters just standing there with they back to the player and let the lightning blast them all down as it went by to fully communicate the danger of it. 
Necros2 Is Genius 
the lightning at the end is a great prototype for an interesting boss fight. 
necros2 was brilliant.
The lightning tube was cool - on my first try, I lasted for quite a while (without realizing the lightning was instant-kill) so when I ran in to it and died, it was clear what was going on.

I didn't realize you could do so much with rotation in Quake! (e.g. rotating monsters/spike shooters)

necros1 and zwiffle were good too. I ran out of ammo and couldn't get past the shamblers at the end of zwiffle's, but liked the architecture.

Fun pack! 
the really interesting thing is that the hipnotic rotation code has a specific section devoted to handling misc objects (ie: everything besides func_movewall and rotate_object) but that the hipnotic xpac never actually utilized any of it.
you can attached torches to lifts with this method, you can have a hierarchy of rotaters, you can use it to move powerups around... there's a lot of potential there. 
Can you attach rotators to rotators and keys to the rotators on the end, and so you have these crazy spiral keys you have to get? 
yep, that's what i meant by hierarchical rotaters.

here's how you do it:
make your child func_rotating_entity (and set up all your rotating brushes and movewalls. give those things targetnames "child_object".
give the child func_rotating_entity a targetname "master_object"

make another func_rotating_entity with (optional) rotating brushes and movewalls. give those targetnames "master_object" (the master func_rotating_entity doesn't need a targetname).

so you have the child func_rotating_entity pointing to it's rotate_object and movewalls and a master func_rotating_entity pointing to it's rotate_object and movewalls AS WELL AS the child func_rotating_entity.

the important bit is that the child func_rotating_entity must be first in the entity list so that the engine will update it first before it updates the master. if the order is reversed, the child rotation gets broken.

also, if you want say lightning to shoot at a target in a func_rotating_entity, remember that a func_rotating_entity set will have multiple objects with the same targetname, so the info_notnull you are targetting needs to be the first in the entity list before all the other elements otherwise your lightning will shoot towards the other bits. 
This is genius... You are. 
Really loved these maps, all three of them that is. Necro's map was insanely good, I cant believe it was a speedrun, so many great ideas. I especially liked the moving vehicles and dimension-shifting.

Also, why is the quake community so quiet of late (bar these speedrun type things) ? I'd of thought with QuothII's release they'd be a more active community. I'm not a mapper myself, just a fan of your hard work, so I dont really know these things.. 
If there were a Quoth2 .fgd or .def or what have you it would be highly constructive to generating maps within the community. 
this is the def i use, it's incomplete and contains some legacy stuff. i usually just flip to kell's site for ents that aren't in there. 
Legacy Stuff? 
yeah, it's pretty much quoth 1 def with whatever new quoth2 things i've needed to use so far that i added.

for example, func_hordespawn is in there, instead of preach's renamed info_multispawn. 
Where have you been Zwif? The fgd has been posted in the main quoth thread for months now:

Happy hunting. 
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