|Posted by Shambler on 2019/06/04 14:01:16|
|Warning: This is a positive resolution / solution thread, not a beef thread. You wanna beef, go elsewhere.
It has come to my attention that there are occasional accusations of the Quake community having some negative social aspects. Indeed in the words of rebb (compiler coder) in 2018:
I have known the Quake community for a very long time as one of the most toxic and narcissistic creative communities.
For a moment in time things appeared to have improved, but it turned out to be little more than naive wishful thinking.
Between all it's newfound glory, hyperdetailed maps and "god mappers" still sits the same deep prideful arrogance and highly toxic nature that has most likely been there since the very beginning.
It is a cold and self-obsessed place.
Strong words (which I personally entirely disagree with as someone who has been in the scene from Day 1, both as a player AND contributor). Unfortunately he doesn't specify what actually happened nor who he is referring to. And it's hard to have sympathy without actually understanding what's going on, and it's hard to make progress from that without having some clarity and openness.
IF there is any such "toxicity" in the Quake scene, then I think it needs to be made explicit what the problems are, who has been "toxic", and whether such behaviour is explicable, redeemable, or even simply a misunderstanding of casual behaviour, as per the wise words of Kinn (sometime mapper):
ok, here it goes - there is a lot of really obvious playful pisstaking in this community which is good.
as a man of this sceptred isle, a man of rosy-cheeked chappery and good-humoured banter, I welcome the very obvious joking around and tomfoolery
but perhaps a lot of people don't "get it" - perhaps it's down to cultural differences, or perhaps some even are "on the spectrum" as it were, and struggle to differentiate a malicious comment from an obvious mickey-take
This is not to start arguments or flame wars. This is to CLEAR THOSE UP by explaining what is going on discussing calmly, apologising if needed. There's no point moaning about toxicity and not trying to sort it out, so...
And I Will Admit To:
1. Slagging off OneMadGypsy after his meltdown / Quake scene dismissal. No apology as his whole rant was full of direct threats and massive arrogance / narcissism.
2. Taking the piss out of Baker in his notorious "Age Of The No Penis Mapper" thread. And making a map full of cocks. I never knew if he played the map. I thought it was quite decent for a semi-speedmap.
3. Being highly critical of Bloodshots Quake 1.5 mod. This is nothing personal against Bloodshot even if the aesthetic taste in the mod is bewildering, and I have been clearly praising of his great JamX map.
4. Posting and arguing about Spirit's insults to me on his Quaddicted thread. He was directly insulting to me for no reason. No bad blood from my side and no interest in continuing.
5. I've called Sock a drama queen on numerous occasions. Not as many occasions as I've praised his work though.
6. I sometimes subtly take the piss of the "Quake Mapping" discord channel. This might have something to do with not liking heavily censored channels, nor the lack of integration with #terrafusion. But OTOH I know the ruler does good work and have given him credit for that.
If anyone thinks this is toxic in context of my other general communication / contribution, let me know.
I touched upon the subject matter after some complaints of "toxicity" following community people poking fun at someone who clearly suffers mental disorders.
In context that this person had aggressively and rudely ranted at others, here is what I had to say there :
<Don't get me wrong, some metldowns are indeed gut wrenching (for anyone with a touch of empathy) but expecting internet people on forums to not take a slag at such meltdown especially if it contains insulting content - is just out of touch.
People with severe mental illness do need help and not dissing, but among a loose knit group of game/creative enthusiasts is not the place to hope to get it from. its not the function of such a place, it is not a "safe space", its a community of rando people tied by interest in creative activities, no more. You will get unpleasant brush ups with what you perceive to be unpleasant people, one has to deal with such things, it is not elsewise outside the house.
You might through PM get something more, forge a closer friendship with some members of such a community, but this is not going to happen with any community "at large" other than ones focused on being support groups around the subject of mental illness. >
A Small Thing
Most of you would have forgotten it but....
I'd like to apologize for saying some stupid juvenile stuff here.I wasn't exactly in the right frame of mind,being 13 and stupid.
I intend to actually release a small mod as an extended apology.It's basically Goofy Quake 2.For Quake 1.
Some jokes have the side effect of making people feel welcome or unwelcome in the community. I'm not sure "toxic" is a productive word to use here, but the community can absolutely be a "boys club".
To take one example that stuck with me, I recently went through this Quake C tutorials
by MauveBib (from back in 2008? or earlier?). Between useful information, there are some of these "boys club" jokes that aren't very funny and also make me feel like an outsider. As a result, I'm wary to pass on an otherwise-useful tutorial to friends who might like modding in QC. I don't think the "humor" of these jokes makes up for the way they make people feel unwelcome.
My perspective in the quake community (as a comparatively recent arrival) is probably an odd one. I work as a professional level designer with a background in Unreal Tournament modding. Most of the professional level designers I know also got their start in mod scenes, which were also "boys clubs". As a result, we're kind of a samey lot, making samey games, and it's all a bit creatively-empty and dull. I like working with more diverse teams, which requires more diverse applicants, which I think means making the mod scenes more welcoming spaces so more people can gain those skills in the first place.
I also see a new generation of would-be level-designers learning in Unreal Engine and Unity outside the context of any specific game. They're learning the tools, but not the concepts, so it's not proper level design. When I've been involved with hiring LDs, the applications from game dev university graduates are terribly shallow. With those concerns in mind, I see how Quake and Trenchbroom could serve a new generation of level designers by providing them an environment to learn. I've tried inviting some friends with that hope, but they have bounced off after making a map, if they even get that far. Maybe I'm correct in the "boys club" diagnosis, or maybe it's inherent to Quake and a weakness of its theme and a narrow appeal?
In any case, with things like Quake 1.5 and weirder experiments, I think there's a productive way to say "cool, this isn't for me, but it is still welcome here". Per Baker's thread, I think it can also be useful to say "hey can we get more [x, y, z]", but I don't think it has to be either/or. We can have co-op maps and id1 maps and AD maps all at once without detracting from each other! I think there's also value in highlighting the work of newcomers, and creating mapping events specifically to welcome them and offer feedback. I've brought it up before, but Doom is a comparatively lively and diverse scene, and I think that's worth aiming for.
I sometimes subtly take the piss of the "Quake Mapping" discord channel. This might have something to do with not liking heavily censored channels, nor the lack of integration with #terrafusion. But OTOH I know the ruler does good work and have given him credit for that.
I've explained both publicly and privately directly to you the reason I keep the Discord SFW. It's a good reason: I like my job. If I administer the site from work I am responsible for its content. End of story. I guess that's not good enough though as I continue to pay for it. Sorry you can't post "cuntflaps" on my Discord.
Partial "blame" for the "split" between #TF and Quake mapping can be placed on otp. Originally, I was just going to have a small channel directly related to Q&A for the videos. I was being lazy about it and he approached me to do a channel. I wasn't really aware at the time, but I guess otp had some beef with Daz who admin'd #tf. In his own words:
2. Daz has revealed himself to be a giant pussy the moment he hosted tf on Discord and made it safe for work.
He encouraged me to create many of the channels that exist now and I did so because I know #tf is not the greatest place to drive people new to the mapping community. <shrug>
I made many attempts to cross-post events and stay in the know over at #tf. But I got tired of seeing personal attacks there, both on me and people I admire. Call me a pussy -- whatever, it bothered me and I left.
I apologize for nothing in regards to the Quake Mapping Discord. Futher, I don't see any apologies in #1 and I don't expect to. Some people love stirring up shit and provoking a response. Mission accomplished.
If I am wrong Shambler, then all I will say is: actions speak louder than words.
But publicly, I will apologize to sock, muk and scampie. Allowing another to influence my actions cost me fellowship with you guys and I do regret it.
. Some people love stirring up shit and provoking a response.
That is true. If I see any of those people I'll trying to encourage them to read this thread and maybe acknowledge if that's gone awry.
Don't worry I did get your explanation at time, as you know, and respect that - even if I might joke about it. Yes, being able to say "cuntflaps" is fundamental to my lifestyle :)
I don't think anyone is suggesting for any apologies off you of course. Unless you've been secretly "toxic" when no-one's noticed.
Wrote an epic response to mclong and phone killed it. Arse.
I don't think there's any need to assign me some sort of hidden agenda, as I've been very clear about my motivations regarding the Quake Mapping Server - on func
I wouldn't say Daz running a SFW Discord server had much influence on my suggestion to run a SFW Discord.
I'm happy, however, to see my role in getting the server running acknowledged again - the previous comments which left me out of the equation were a rather unnecessary jab, so it's good to see a retraction of that.
My opinion on QM (it's a good place) and the "split" (it's total nonsense) hasn't changed one iota since July 2018: tf and QM can, and should, coexist without trying to integrate.
The fact that QM can be well over 500+ members would rather point to the fact that this so-called "toxicity" is something that stems from here in specific, rather than being inherent to Quake community in its heterogeneous entirety. (Unless we are, in fact, seriously entertaining the notion that jokes such as "I'll eat your face" in a tutorial old enough to be linking to a Gamespy page is a symptom of deep rot.)
Maybe permanently removing the beef thread is something to consider.
There are other jokes that run through the tutorial, and it's an old example, but it also was the tutorial I was referred to for learning QC only a few months ago. Maybe there's a better example of what I mean... I'm trying to say that the "obvious playful pisstaking" referred to in the Kinn quote in the original post isn't always so obvious or harmless. Seeing nonsense like dick jokes on here says to me that this is a boys club, and it makes me cautious to inviting level-design friends here from outside the Quake mod scene. Maybe func isn't the place for the goals I'm describing.
Also yes, the QM discord has shown a tremendous growth of interest! I think much of the community is moving in a positive direction that is more welcoming.
Okay So Previous Reply To Mcdongalong
Good points there. There can definitely be a correlation with small, dedicated communities and a feeling of "boys' club" - I've noticed this clearly in other communities.
The perception can be from the outside that such communities are closed and unwelcoming.
The actual reality is that they are definitely NOT, they are open and welcoming (just as this one is, see later).
But the specific nature, in-jokes, small size, focus, etc etc, can give a false impression. It can look a bit impenetrable....until one actually tries, and then one realises that such places are focused on the insiders, rather than being hostile to outsiders. But the outsider must cross that perspective hump, take a chance and go for it, to realise they're as welcome as anyone.
Take....yourself, dumptruck, otp, sock, mfx, fairweather, ionous, khreathor, nait, poorchop, skacky, etc etc whoever.....you're all total noobs, appearing this millenium, or decade, or even year. You were all outsiders once, looking in - now you're all part of it, some quite fundamentally so. You took that step and just became part of it, that's how it works, it's not a closed shop.
So yeah, maybe toxic is too strong a word, although maybe there is still some stuff to air. And maybe it's just perception that's an issue.
A vote on removing the beef thread would be good. It may indeed be allowing things to get too nasty and personal, rather than defusing and entertaining as the original plan was.
I Would Say Though.
Dick jokes are - even if the word is censored - are essential to any balanced and emotionally stable community.
Well put. Will give this some thought.
Something I forgot to add to my screed above was "good for you" for taking responsibility for past behavior.
Goofy mods are always welcome.
To be honest, either a forum is moderated, or it's not. If there's posting rules, and you breach the rules, then blammo, mod should delete post. "It's a fair cop, guv" says the errant poster.
Func is func. As far as I can tell, it doesn't have "rules". The closest thing to posting guidelines appears to be found here: http://www.celephais.net/board/faq.php
and I quote:
About This Site
We are a community of hobbyist and professional level designers who share insights, opinions, rants, and flames.
Pretty self-explanatory. "Go hog wild".
I don't think we need to engage in great big discussions where we try to create "soft rules" or "etiquette" when I'm sure half the people here don't give a damn about them.
I think if this site needs posting rules and this kind of moderation then it should be explicitly written somewhere and the forum should be moderated accordingly. Is that really
what func needs after existing just fine for two decades?
For my part, I don't think we need to moderate anything, but we should do some obvious tightening up of the basic site mechanics to remove spam and anon shitposting as much as possible.
The Root Cause Is Lovecraft
I think it's good to have some level of sensibility respect and not let things get out of hand. Half the people might not give a damn but half the people might and if some people are finding it really bad it might be worth looking at to see how much of a real issue is it.
If one wants to make somewhere like func "not get out of hand" (more than it has been 20 years) to attract / welcome everyone at large it is simple : func will become something entirely else than it is.
Diversity is desired, yes ?
Turning all existing community bases into heavily moderated and controlled "everyone" welcome type of spaces does not, ironically, achieve welcome for "everyone".
To this I welcome the existence of **both** types of community spaces (and more!) and hope this stays so.
This though does not mean the community needs to be split, god no, this is rather a question of the different spaces acknowledging and promoting each other, informing any new comers of what kind of spaces and flavors are around.
On the chat / discord side a real strong approach for this would be instead of integrating places like discord QM into a TF subchannel or vice versa (hey! #tf was first :P) the real beauty would be to have shared/fully mirrored Subchannels such as the News / Releases threads and other meutral "cultural" ones.
Another could be a identical shared read only information channel with a summary of community spaces/resources.
Sadly Discord does not allow this simply :/
Could likely be ugly-hacked up with bots/scripts and the like though.
Otoh The Duke Community
func, as far as I'm aware,* does not harbpr any open Nazis or Stalinists, people with loli avatars, or Nazis/Stalinists with loli avatars. Those facts alone put func ahead of plenty of internet communities I've observed, despite a small group of cantankerous grumps.
*I don't use IRC or Discord or whatever the hell else so I'm unaware of what goes down there.
Soooooo the func / TF community are not toxic ? Could it only be that drama queens have been drama-queening around ?
Now would be a good time to post and offer some insight to not have one's complaints dismissed as above.
Well that's something at least, that the community avoids the internet-political tedium.
As for discord: on the original worldwide quake mapping community server at least, there's a clear balance between keeping it liberal and fun, but drawing a line before any actual abuse (the only person to get kicked for a post content had said a racist jest in a cruel context). In the guidelines...
@everyone : Please note that while #terrafusion is proudly maintained as a liberal open-minded discussion platform that is accepting off and sometimes promoting off foul language, vulgar banter and sordid topics of discussion, IN CONTRAST: actual extremist views, genuine harassment, xxx-phobias of most forms, and persistent targetted banter when requested otherwise are not tolerated. PLEASE if you feel uncomfortable with aspects of the channel or think anything like that is occuring in a genuine way, RAISE THE ISSUE FIRST (in the channel or message a moderator) to prevent further problems.
Come along and give it a go: https://discord.gg/d5mytUj
, everyone is welcome.
It does seem to be that there are mutterings about a "toxic" community but when it comes to actually clearing it up, finding out what is going on, being accountable for stuff or open with issues....people are suddenly clamming up.
Surely if anyone has an actual problem, this would be a good place to raise it and resolve it??
Or maybe it's just not that bad... (which personally I think is the clear truth, but I don't want to dismiss others concerns if they're actually going to raise them).
From the newcomer's point of view a portion of the community suffers from the typical "Internet doesn't understand free speech" syndrom. Free speech protects from govt shutting down one's ability to critique govt actions. Being an ass and crying that soy snowflakes don't like one's "sense of humor" isn't covered by free speech. It's just being juvenile and not willing to own it. Not being as toxic as, say 4chan is a very low bar. But I guess it's hard to ask for more on teh interwebz these days.
That sounds worth looking into, can you be more specific what problems you've encountered??
I don't know what this "soy" trend means and I've never visited 4chan so that's not a context I understand.
Soy acts like estrogen. So soy or soyboy has the same meaning calling one a pussy does. 4chan and places like that are pretty good at using covert language of this kind.
This divides people into there groups: those who are in on a "joke" and play along, those who understand and aren't and if they complain, the third group will claim that they either don't understand or don't think it's that big of a deal, effectively siding with bullies. That's why it's so hard to get rid of pepe and ok sign which are nazi winks and nods - many simply can't or won't believe this is happening. :)
But to be clear, I'm not claiming that someone did attack me here. I just read tons of threads from the last 10 or so years and it's a general observation of mine. It is possible that some of this behavior toned down but I'm also watching discord servers and it doesn't seem to be the case. All that seems to indicate is that func became less relevant as a form of day to day communication, not that people, behaviors and attitudes have changed.
I'm starting to think this is becoming an imagined problem. Every community has shits, and the only difference between them is that some communities ban the shits, and some have no mechanism to ban the shits.
We don't have a mechanism to ban the shits so we have to put up with a very, very occasional shitstorm. It's pretty easy to dig up one of these shitstorms from 2008 (for example) and say "look how shitty this place is" whilst kinda forgetting that this is a post someone made in 2008.
AFAIAW the common or garden internet edgelord doesn't really post here. These are the chaps that go on massive rants about muslims or gays or jews or women or whatever. Already that elevates us above 95% of internet forums.
These examples are not for the sake of calling out individuals, but rather some common patterns of behavior. Maybe it is "banter" and I'm not picking up that tone, but both cases seem to have pushed people away from here:
1 - in the SM189 thread, there was talk about TBA143's map. It was a first map with some rough edges, but also some promise. AFAIK, TBA143 hasn't made any more mapping efforts for Quake. http://www.celephais.net/board/view_thread.php?id=61660
This is a case where we could've said "What kind of experience were you trying to create? I didn't get it / it wasn't for me, but the brushwork was really promising! Hope to see more maps from you in the future". See also the recent SM196, 195, and JamX conversations around Ing and Pinchy maps. They're doing something different with the tools, and it won't be for everyone, but we should welcome that variety and be glad that folks are trying different things (even when they fail).
2 - The General Abuse convo around "RetroPew". Again, maybe this was banter and I'm failing to pick up the tone, but I think there may have been a more constructive way to have this conversation. http://www.celephais.net/board/view_thread.php?id=1&start=30994&end=31010
Are either examples "toxic"? It's absolutely not 4chan, but these conversations come off a bit more like meatheadded miscommunications, but they're also both about maintaining a kind of orthodoxy of Quake, which is rather rigid.
TBA143 made multiple later maps as Ukko though.
The TBA Example
is kinda mild. One guy says "gameplay is bullshit" because it's a map with no ammo in it (i haven't played it myself), but the rest of the beefy comments are actually defending the map it seems.
Small Communities Of Old Friends
Inside jokes are unavoidable among small communities. Especially when they know each other since long. It's never easy at first for the newcomer to get the local spirit and dialog subtleties between old members (!). As a long time Quake lover, steady lurker and rare poster on this forum, I really see this 'toxicity' as an imaginary problem too. Autarchy and self-regulation works well here. Without proper official moderation, I think Func is a great example of a long time healthy community forum after all.
Day by day life between people knowing each other well is generally full of (sometimes nasty) jokes, rants, flames, sometimes anger and rage quits. This is the price to pay when your life is built on love and passion. No mysteries here. No toxicity either. Just healty passionate people. To hell with god-fearing confessions ! (After all, Quake is about lurid dongeons, monsters, gothic visions, bloody body explosions and all, right ?)
And yes, maybe a 'beef thread' is filled with hard to catch spirit from a noob point of view, but anyway in this case, just refer to the Fight Club first rule...
It's fair enough to say you don't like the name (I don't, for all the same reasons as have been posted). This is just feedback. I think the error there is probably as you say "meatheadded miscommunication" where the language used is a bit too strong for the subject at hand. Serious enough to raise it as an issue though? Quakeulf didn't seem fazed at all by it, so that's debatable.
A good post by JohnXmas btw. :cheers:
Was there a better way of communicating with an extreme purist who doesn't think our maps are Quake maps anymore. Hmm no I don't think so.
It was obvious bait and/or cry for attention. It was met with an appropiate response.
Felt like my responsibility, being the organiser of that particular pack.
Speedmaps are a great gateway into mapping, nowadays often very good maps in their own right, and I resent a worthless anon calling tba/ukko's map a troll map that shouldn't have been included.
Anonymous posts are the antithesis of func culture.
just want to note here that the real toxic comment about TBA's map was from some fuckwad wanking shitecovered cumguzzling dick inhaling asshole anon again.
My point is not just the comments directed at TBA's map. The whole conversation turned into a beef where it was difficult for additional feedback that wouldn't get wrangled in. It's all a bit "salt the earth and let nothing grow"... or, to JohnXmas's point, it may be playful banter that I'm misinterpreting as a relative newcomer to the scene.
Good to know TBA is Ukko! That deflates my point a bit, but that's a good thing.
There's no two ways about it, anonyposts have the ability to trigger a shitstorm, where otherwise there wouldn't have been one.
As soon as someone is accountable for what they say, they tend to be more civil.
The shit-talk propagates in both directions, when anons are involved. As well as anons shit-talking, a logged-in poster can also shit-talk back at the anon without needing to be civil in any way, because it's not personal. You don't know who's on the receiving end and it's fair game.
So it was that shitpost begat shitpost begat shitpost begat shitpost , until the great brown ouroboros of shitposting finally disappeared into its own arsehole and func was no more, save for a small, rusty-hued, infinitely dense pucker in the fabric of cyberspace.
The quake community, born from a love of the brown game, eventually died at the hands of the brown post.
Explain This One Away
This one started over on #tf Discord and continued over here.
Could you blame a newcomer for reading this and being a bit put off?
The Catch 22
...is that people who have left here due to harassment or rudeness aren't around to explain why and who was responsible. Which makes this thread kind of pointless.
My newcomer's perspective: I basically started speaking to the people who were receptive to my mapping interests and answering my questions. Nonsense posts I didn't understand did not concern me so I left them alone (who knows what long standing beef exists between strangers on the internet). After getting to know who is who, it's really not so bad. It is the internet after all, but more than that, it's an internet forum about a video game. Banter is part of any community after all- digital or otherwise.
The time has come to abolish the schisms of yesterday! One global Quake community- One struggle!
When I made and released my one and only deathmatch map I was expecting it to be praised as one of the best ever made. Of course it was reviewed as nothing more than average, and me being the teenager I was at the time with a thin skin, threw a bitch fit. I was then promptly told I was full of shit, and rightly so. I'll never forget that.
But anyway every community has toxicity and drama, but besides a few bad apples I like to believe Quake's community is the most welcoming to newcomers. Sure you may get busted on every now and then but that's just any community right? That's not being toxic. Even if a person's first map or mod is total garbage, the majority of people here will say don't give up, keep going and you will get better. Not unlike certain members of the Doom community...
Literally no one cares.
Kinn: Quite possibly.
Mclong: Thanks for posting examples, that doesn't seem like singling people out, but just giving clear examples.
For the SM thread, I think it's pretty fair to be critical of a map with no ammo, even to the extent of calling the gameplay bullshit (by negke who is far too grumpy to troll). It takes a matter of seconds to dump some ammo boxes in. The consensus seemed to be it was a valid criticism, but an anon accusing it of being a troll map was less valid.
For the RetroPEW thread, there might have been some harshness, but I stand by my criticism on the basis that the name is scientifically and objectively awful. I - amongst other people - did praise the site for the concept.
For both of these examples, yes there is some harshness, but it's not against the person, and it is for a reason.
JohnXmas - good post from an irregular participant.
Killes - eloquently put. As I've said before, having registration as a pre-requirement to harsh commentary or beef is useful for accountability, which brings me on to...
Dumptruck - firstly, you're right, this thread might be unfortunately more pointless than I hoped, if people are no longer around to air things out. Although maybe that indicates the problems they had are no longer around??
Secondly, that is an interesting example. There is beef between OTP and Muk....plenty of know this and shrug it off, it's just two fluffly little things kicking their wee paws at each other again. It's self-contained interpersonal beef. BUT....is this off-putting in general?? Is it toxic in general?? I don't know. Maybe a bit if people don't know that it's just a couple of people beefing away (a familiar part of ANY community).
Kinn - also a conclusive argument.
Orl - there is a certain amount of rigorousness here, but then again that does partly encourage quality and progress (and it's usually combined with encouragement).
OTP - wheesht.
Func Is Fine
I've spoken up here a few times in the programming help thread asking for help with what in retrospect was pretty obvious shit that's covered by the multitude of quake spec docs floating around. I still got multiple people each time answering my questions and helping me understand things I wasn't sure of.
The same for the quake mapping discord. I took part in the dm4 map jam, and my map was kind of shit, but whenever I asked a question or showed screens I got honest feedback that was no more harsh or pointed than warranted.
Place is fine.
Not too long ago, acting like a xenophobic fuckhead in #terrafusion would have gotten you politely disinvited
from func and ongoing events.
In 2019, calling out xenophobic fuckheads gets your post deleted for being "Unnecessarily off-topic and hostile"?
Shambler, maybe the first proper step in addressing the "toxic community" question would be to actually confront the bigotry, instead of shoving it under the carpet. But apparently you prefer to make big sweeping statements about not tolerating fringe behavior, and then chose to not act on them when necessary.
Thanks For Pointing That Out OTP.
If you highlight current xxx-phobias in areas where I can moderate them, then I will be sure to confront that and act on it when necessary.
Bump, Nice Try Spammers
Take It To The Stasi
Thank god otp has no moderation power in this community, otherwise he'd likely be the only person left posting.
You've been trying to get me banned/kicked out for months with screencaps and quotes of my offences. That it hasn't worked and people don't give a fuck about anything you say is quite the comfy feeling.
Need Something To Get Off Your Chest Drew?
If anyone notices people raising concerns in other areas, i.e. reddit etc, please direct them to this thread so stuff can be cleared up. Thanks.
It's Quite A Funny
on one hand
eddie the shambler welcomes the newbies with a shittalking, posting and asking for a pooping vids, and he believes it's ok (tf discord)
on the other hand
and after all that two faced son of a gun is asking for retribution for spy
Just Lock This Thread Already
pointless and off topic
I Don't Think So.
Some very useful contributions and discussions. Just because one perma-troll is abusing it like he does to the rest of func doesn't negate the purpose.
You've already demonstrated that you go on semi-regular spamming sprees that contribute nothing to the forum other than filling it up with meaningless shitposts. If you wish to make a serious point then form a clear coherent argument and post just that without the tirade of abuse. Otherwise you will keep being treated the same as any other spammer.
So explain something for me Shambler: why does this thread exist?
You stated in the OP: It has come to my attention that there are occasional accusations of the Quake community having some negative social aspects. and then went on to quote a year old post.
So what's the real point? Who's got you so obsessed with this topic? Can't be Rebb. Did someone go on the offensive and start tearing down func in public?
I don't see anything like that at all. Maybe an offhand comment in a podcast or on Discord? Getting warmer? Where and when was the word toxic used? I certainly don't recall reading it anywhere?
You've asked for specifics now I am asking you.
I've left that one up since it had some content.
Yes there are jokes and banter and piss-taking on discord. There are some on here too. Conversely, if someone goes on a pointless shitposting rampage on discord they'd get that moderated too (although the guidelines for a forum and a chat channel are different due to the different speeds of interaction).
Yeah the year old post partly triggered it. Other than that, I dunno. People have occasionally mentioned it on here I'm sure. Sometimes people quote stuff from elsewhere like reddit. It's just sunk into my mind that the community sometimes gets called toxic, and based on that I thought it was worth looking at, it's genuinely nothing more sinister than that, and nothing to be suspicious about. In fact it seems that maybe I've overestimated the "accusation" against the community *shrug*.
I'm positive most critiques are in reaction to a couple of specific people here, not the community as a whole. As far as reddit, I posted there recently and linked back to this thread in case people wanted to add their experiencesor opinions. Every (legitimate) response I read there was very positive toward func. Which is cause for celebration!
The 'sjws' Guy Who Replied There
no beef with you if that's how it was interpreted.
What is this bullshit? (I'm referring to the quote in your OP, not your own thoughts.)
Counterpoint: like I said in general, I just jumped on some random Quake twitch stream, had dudes talking to me and sending me maps, they added me to their Quake discord, and we got matches scheduled and everything.
It all seemed pretty friendly and happy to me.
Disclaimer, I have none of the background on this, nor did I read anything beyond your first post, Shambler. All I'm saying is, SOUNDS LIKE BULLSHIT!
Whoever Is Running The Quake_txt Twitter Account Has Blocked Me
Can that person explain why? I assume he is here or checking this place. I really want to know what I did to offend him so much he blocked me on Twitter.
I don't think it's the quake community really, it's just OTP and Shambler.
Onetruepruple runs Quake_txt
Well since that's said as an anon and someone who doesn't care to post specific examples nor obviously pay attention to my general posting etc within the scene, I'll take that as both a complete lie and typical anon trolling.
So If That Is True
Then please explain yourself, OneTruePurple. I would really like an explanation.
The Humour Is Lost In Text
I think this is the biggest problem. The banter, piss taking etc is fine when you hear it in the quakecast interviews (or the very rare occasion I got to play vermintide with shambler).
But on the forum the tone of the japes is lost and all you get is butthurt instead. The most bantery people here are OTP and Shambler and this may be why they get mentioned specifically moreso than anyone else.
Anyone got a problem with Shambler, send them to me. I'll sort 'em out. What the fuck, people.
Yes I Have A Problem
With Shamblers. They’re too damn hard and you can’t ever get the good guns before facing them 😠
But they're so cute and fuzzy!
Do The Shambler Dance
it's the only way
What 5th Said
The "quake.txt" twitter is lame because it's just a butthurt boomer's personal account, not a light-hearted meme account like people would expect from a ".txt" account. Nobody wants to follow something for memes and then get blocked for disagreeing about Dusk or something.
Warning: This is a positive resolution / solution thread, not a beef thread. You wanna beef, go elsewhere.
My Post Didn't Age Well
I guess the shambler dance is now cancelled post-copper release. :(
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