I do agree somehow with bambuz that maps should be playable in normal Quake option.
I had the abandon pak first released and it played well in normal quake and the maps were not bigger than a floppy.

Then I took as advice to recompile them again with new compilers and updated quark, and I had a lot of work getting them leak free.
Great to see them in Fitzquake, but I wasn't able anymore to play them in normal quake because of the grey fall outs.

I am a pacifist, but I can't see the relation with mapping. I have a P3 1300 logitec-gForce. 

Then I took as advice to recompile them again with new compilers and updated quark, and I had a lot of work getting them leak free.
Great to see them in Fitzquake, but I wasn't able anymore to play them in normal quake because of the grey fall outs.

this paragraph makes no sense to me. surely recompiling maps in order to get rid of leaks (and therefore make it visable) would reduce (if not totally remove) grey flash in winquake? if anything, you should have gotten grey flash in winquake before you recompiled and fixed it.

did i miss something? 

There is a difference between lazy+inefficient mapping (made easier by better computing power), versus purposely designing complex maps made for contemporary computer systems. The computational expense of the former leads maps to get bad reviews and might crash your pc, while the latter helps the game evolve.

Maybe. 

 

Here's to evolution. 

Tyrann updated his site:

Just a quick update. I was going to put up a booth at QExpo, but I just don't have the energy right now. Anyway, just to get this out there, here is version 0.1 of tyr-utils (and source). This packages together my light and vis utils, as well as bspinfo and the beginnings of a bsputil tool. The version of tyrlite included is unchanged from version 0.99b, but the version of vis has a few tricks added to reduce compile times. I'll update the utils page later to reflect this new packaging. Qbsp will be added later, once I get a clean GPL version done (the TreeQBSP source isn't GPL compatible as far as I can tell, and I haven't been able to contact the author to get it changed).
http://disenchant.net/ 

1)Dont touch communism, or I'm calling Vondur!

2) Bamb, spare ~100$ on a new mobo+sempron 3000+ CPU. Its time to upgrade. Aslo q3 maps in DP will prolly run even slower on your outdated sys 

1) HT, did you make the detailed spire tops as entities/models/whattheyare so that they are not included in vis? In quake1 you can't do that, because then they wouldn't be lighted properly. And thus they have to be in the bsp and fuck up the map. Or well, modern computers can handle the map even when it's fucked up, but that's not beautiful imo. But in more modern engines they can be excluded from bsp splits and vis calcs. That's one point I'm trying to make, quake was not designed for that, while many engines are. You have only the func_wall that's not going far enough.

2) Upgrading my pc is pretty low in the priority list. I hope we'll see it someday though. :)

3) r speeds 3500 was high even in 1999. My computer is about 2000-2001 mid-range.

Making "modern" maps for q1 is a bit like putting a jet engine to a bicycle. Yes, well, it can be done, but we already have motorbikes, cars and aeroplanes which do the job better. It's a curiosity allright. But I recognize you digress and we can just say, "ok, we disagree but we can live with that", I'm fine if we stop this particular part of discussion here. The tech part is interesting though. 

Q1 scales badly, but it does scale. Even if it takes 10x more CPU to run 5x more polys (numbers out of the blue)
So the only problem there is - it will run slow on old hardware. The question is - should mappers care about the minority with old hardware and limit themselves to low detailed maps and not use the advantage of todays processor's power.
Im not talking about shoddy mapping (no vis optimisation etc) 

In quake1 you can't do that, because then they wouldn't be lighted properly.

That is what negative lighting is for. Where a func_wall torch holder doesn't cast a shadow beneath, you put a negative light set to an info_null to create a shadow cone underneath. You can also place a simpler shape inside of a func_wall to do the actual casting.

If you read my site note, it is very well likely(I'm gauging from your speedmaps)that I have spent more time on this one map in one form or another than you have mapped in your entirety, so why are lecturing me? 

it's just a hack. You can't listen very well, can you. I'll stop this discussion here. 

apparently it's being made by someone else now:

http://nintendo.about.com/gi/dynamic/offsite.htm?site=http://screen7.adventuredevelopers.com/byzantine.htm

:/ 

n quake1 you can't do that, because then they wouldn't be lighted properly. And thus they have to be in the bsp and fuck up the map

You present as an insurmountable problem something that is easily solved by a number of ways that you were obviously not aware of but mappers have successfully used to make pretty maps for years. You can call it a hack but you are just trying to save yourself from a little embarrassment.

You'll be much better off if you stop trying to make yourself out to be an expert in all things Quake and listened to people who have actual experience testing the engine(s) with a few thousand maps of their own.

I'm not angry with you, I don't dislike you, but that is my honest opinion without the sugar on top. 

http://www.ebaumsworld.com/gijoe-belch.html 

 

I'm reading through this thread and.... lol

http://www.celephais.net/board/view_thread.php?id=596 

i won't give eric ebaum my traffic and nor should anyone. he's already a filthy rich criminal scumbag, and visiting his site only encourages his stealing. 

site crashed firefox. beware (ebaums) 

i think i'm missing something...

anyway, i thought it was funny. *shrug* :P 

ebaum's world is a site that just rips off content from everywhere else on the net. I think there was something between him and the SA guy because Ebaum kept taking content from the SA forums and using it...

er, read this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ebaum

scroll down to the section entitled "controversy". 

I do I apreciate your sublinking, but answering
in the link can be lol also. 

I've seen some of those GIJoe Public Service Announcement remakes before. I get cracked up just thinking about the one where a guy is teaching fire safety to kids in a burning house, 'Get the hell out of here you stupid little bastards. Run!' 

i don't keep up to date with all the intarnetty things like this. :P

it's still funny though, what can i say? ^_^ reminds me of that rejected video from a while back 

http://ebaumsworldsucks.com/ebaum.swf A very catchy tune to this one. 

is that Eric Bauman has made much of his money (he's worth millions now) by purposely stealing talented artist's flash cartoons, decompiling them, removing any watermarks or references to the artist who created them, then hosting them on his site and making a shitload off $$$ through traffic because his site is so huge.

Not only does he consistantly ignore the original author's requests to take down their material, he's been known to launch DDoS attacks on the websites of people who complain about his practice of doing this.

In short, he's an utter scumbag of the highest order.