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Dark Souls III (plus DeS, DS, DS2, BB) Thread!
Part shameless self-indulgence, part recognition that a few #funcers are very hyped for this. I think maybe we should have more distinct threads for hyped releases (like the Doom4 one), should have done it for FO4 and W3 too. Not sure what's next? Dishonoured2? Deus Ex5? Anyway...

So, DS series, you know the score, console-oriented, 3rd person, very dark fantasy, malevolently-situated, uber-difficult RPG. Convoluted layouts, ominous and gritty atmosphere, sporadic save points, respawning enemies, ludicruous boss battles, and legions of dedicated fanboys who spend hundreds of hours learning the combat mechanisms and then discredit any of their passion and promotion of the game by waving their inflated e-penii around and waffling on about "git gud" and other such cretinisms.

DSIII has perhaps the broadest appeal as it has apparently a proper and full PC version and combines the methodical gameplay of earlier DS games with the faster action of BB. Such hype, so wow, so discuss....

Edit: As czg has wisely pointed out, also a useful thread for tips / tricks / tweaks / spoilers / questions / answers / etcs
What Does The Hollowing Stat Do? 
To Kick Things Off: 
I've obviously followed the series with a fairly critical and intolerant eye, but after watching quite a lot of COHH playing BB and then DS3 press release version, the game didn't look ludicrous unfair and abysmally IMBA, and did look spectacularly stylish and atmospheric. So with these rumours of a proper PC port I thought it was worth a try.

From my spectating and general knowledge, my expectations were as follows:

- It will look pretty amazing
- The atmosphere and style and monsters and themes will also be pretty amazing
- The convoluted layouts will be a refreshing change from on-rail games
- This sort of game will be perfectly playable with mouse+kb as long as it's ported right
- The PC port will be ass and/or broken in some way
- The gameplay will semi-frustrating and semi-satisfying
- Slogging through respawning enemies will get a bit boring
- The distance between save points, esp. relative to boss battles will determine most of the fairness, and will be ass in some cases
- It will be obvious that it would be better with skill settings
- The style and vibe will be good enough to make it worth playing DESPITE the gameplay

From playing the game up to and including the Curse-Rotted TesticleWood tree boss (killed 2nd go, as was boss2, boss1 took 6 goes), my general experience of the game is:

- It does look pretty amazing
- The atmosphere and style and monsters and themes is pretty amazing
- The convoluted layouts are a refreshing change from on-rail games
- This sort of game is perfectly playable with mouse+kb as long as it's ported right*
The PC port is ass and/or broken in some way *
- The gameplay is semi-frustrating and semi-satisfying
- Slogging through respawning enemies does get a bit boring
- The distance between save points, esp. relative to boss battles does determine most of the fairness, and is ass in some cases
- It is be obvious that it would be better with skill settings
- The style and vibe is be good enough to make it worth playing DESPITE the gameplay

(* - limited key / mouse rebindings, menu buttons don't change to keyboard if m+kb is selected (surely this is just a line of code to tell the game to display what the player has bound according to whether they've selected controller or m+kb), other users have reported a lot of crashes).

Now then, here's some things I didn't anticipate so much:

It looks amazing.... even on LOW settings. I had a brief look on high, change it to medium as there were some area loading slowdowns, then just tried Low out of curiosity (but keeping AA on, lighting at medium, and DOF on medium / high), and it still looks amazing. The textures and stuff are crisp enough, I think I prefer them on low - and so much is done by the designs and style. It runs well for me (i3 / 6gb / GTX660 2gb).

The camera is kinda ass too, with mouse control anyway. If we take MM as the mouse movement input, and CM as the camera movement output it works something like this:
CM != MM
CM = (MM +/- ((FPS/10) x (FOV/10) x (some random number the game pulled out it's ass)) ^ (the number of enemies on your ass your really want to avoid)

90% of the difficulty in combats seems to be how much graphical detail obscures both the enemy AND your character, e.g. fur / feathers / branches / crystals / icy fog / black penis slug slime flying everywhere until you've no idea where you are and what you would be aiming at IF you knew where you were. I get the impression that some of it would be pretty steady if you could actually see what's going on.

I do really think there should be skill settings....BUT not just to have an easier setting for n00bs like me. I also think there should be a harder (maybe survival? or maybe just harder combat?) setting for veterans. Maybe I am being over-optimistic so far and will end up rage quitting later, but 3 bosses in I am doing okay, I imagine most vets would be finding it a bit easy so far?? OFC if there was an easier setting I'd be on that just to make it more fun.

I REALLY want to have COHH's "bbbbonfire" music sameplay playing every time I reach a bonfire.

The scenery is ridiculously good, but the interconnectivity - only revealed as you explore - is equally good. It's like Swampy or Zendar in modern form.

The English accents are warmly reassuring.

Enemies falling off cliffs never gets old.


TL:DR - my anticipations were right of course, and it's pretty cool for the style alone.

TL:DR - your mum. 
My Q 
In the area before you have the dual-platform lift with the "archer giant" on top (where you meet Onion Bro and also progress to some firey monster dude)....there was a guy sitting on the left with a huge fucking hammer, so I very cleverly snuck up and backstabbed him before I realised he was initially friendly (tip: use targetting to check), now he hates me face AND kills my face on sight. Have I ruined everything, for everyone?? 
I think you can pay the statue of Velka in the sewers nearby to cleanse you of sin. That might reset his aggro. 
Is right you need to visit the velka statue nearby and absolve your sins 
Obviously CZG needs to absolve his sins.

BTW, who are the fucking scrotes with no armour on who randomly attack ur face?? 
I'm Lovin' It M8 
I just finished Cathedral of the Deep and daaaaaamn son that some good shit. The start of the game is fairly linear (but with some side areas etc etc) and I got a little worried that it was gonna be another DS2 style layout but after a while (once you get the undead village basically) it starts to open up become more of that tangled mesh that was Dark Souls 1.

But Cathedral of the Deep for me is where is all comes together into pure Dark Souls bliss. That area is just stacked with different layers, multiple shortcuts, secrets and all manner of other cool shit for you to uncover.

As for the pc port - in my corner of the woods I have had zero problems. Rock solid 60fps on max graphics at 1080p, no crashes, no hitches, hiccups or anything like that. I'm using a pad so can't comment on the kb/m controls. The only real issue is that sometimes the game can lag a bit when loading peoples blood stains or summoning. I assume that is because it's launch week and the server hamsters are tired.

Anyway. DS3 is great. Play it you scrublords! 
Also The Exploration Is Stupidly Fucking Addictive. 
exploration is what makes me want to play it again every day 
Again, What Does The Hollowing Stat Do. 
It's A Measure Of Your Hollowing, Duh 

"When you get around to recruiting Yoel of Londor from his pilgrimage at the bridge in Undead Settlement, he'll not only offer to sell spells but to "Draw out your true strength". Doing so will essentially give you a free level up at no cost for souls. However, it will also give you a Dark Sigil in your inventory. Having said Dark Sigil means that every time you die, you'll gain one point of Hollowing for each Dark Sigil you carry with you, up to a maximum of 5 Dark Sigils can be held.

You'll find that after getting a few Hollowing, you're character will grow visibly worse for the wear. Getting more free levels from Yoel will depend on your Hollowing level (0, 2, 6, 12, and 16, respectively.) Hollowing will also affect any items infused with a Hollow Gem, increasing your luck if you have more than 15 Hollowing.

To get rid of Hollowing, you'll need to first remove the Dark Sigils in your inventory - by giving the Soul of a Fire Keeper in the Firelink Shrine Belltower to the Fire Keeper, and paying a price to remove each Dark Sigil. However, this will not remove any current Hollowing, which will require a Purging Stone, bought from either Yuria of Londor, found in the world, or from the Firelink Handmaid once you have found Hollow's Ashes later in the game.

The most important effect by far, is that by gaining Hollowing, and Dark Sigils from Yoel, will cause the appearance of Yuria of Londor, who will set you down a path to an alternate Ending."
So It's Just Cosmetic 
My character looks like zombie Gary Oldman in The Dark Knight right now. 
Irithyll Dungeon and those fucking masked things with the brands. What the FUCK is the deal with them killing you just by looking at you. And then there's a room with like 10 of them at the end.
And the fucking roast chicken lizards with human baby faces that scream all the time. This is the worst place.
I just ran through to the next area, I think I might even have missed the boss. 
So I saved up 20,000 souls to go towards the 34,000 souls needed the cleanse my sins and de-aggro that knight dude. And then discovered the very hard way just how bad CURSE is from those FUCKING BUG EYED FROG CUNT SHITBAGS. Then I saved up another 34,000 souls and the price had gone up to 38,000 souls cos it's tied to level and then I cleansed my sins and went to speak to the now-friendly knight except he's not really friendly and is a smug arrogant cunt and I really wish I'd spent 60,000 on another 6 levels instead of his stupid twatty face.

Also fuck abyss watchers, they reset my ember boost before that combat the cunts. 
Just Tried The Young White Branch Disguise. 
I ran my ballsack through a blender this morning. I can't wait to go back and try it some more. 
Pics Or It Didn't Happen. 
The swamps are pretty much DS3's version of Blighttown. With Basilisks and giant crabs. 
The Swamps. 
Are not a place I would pick as a top holiday destination.

Kona, u tried it?? Trust me I am as skeptical as anyone about repetitive / frustrating gameplay, but this is fine so far. In fact I'm wondering if the DS controller-up-arse fanbois are crying into their Mountain Dew in the early game when the bosses I'm getting in 2-6 goes they are smashing through first time w/out using Estus flask and not getting their "ballsack in a blender" gameplay fix?? Maybe it gets ridiculously hard later on, even if it does I suspect I'll have got my �40's worth from scenery alone.

The cleansing sins thing I did was entirely optional, maybe when it does get excruciatingly hard I'll wish I'd spent that 60k on 5 levels 4 Ember and 4 Homeward bones but it's easy enough to farm again.... 
When it gets ridiculously hard you engage in JOLLY COOPERATION 
Sunbro 4 Lyf 
I do love a good bit of co-op. The online really sets the game apart from many, it's great that your interactions are limited to physical emotes and literally nothing else.

People can still manage to be dicks though, I summoned someone for the Abyss Watcher fight and the guy just crystalled out. This wouldn't be a huge problem except once you summon someone it buffs the health of the enemies.

Also, I got invaded in the catacombs and lost 16k souls. Not a big deal in the grand scheme of things but I also got my arse handed to me several times over, then I ran into an army of skeletons that would have made Jason and his Argonauts collectively shit themselves. 
Yeah Sounds Great. 
Playing offline since day 1 HTH. 
Online Really Is Great 
The amount of times I have been invaded while helping someone as we are travelling to the boss and then absolutely destroy the fucker is far more numerous than the successful invasions.

The reason the dickwraith got me last night is that I rolled backwards off a cliff, then I died trying to recover my souls. I am certain I would have had the guy but I wasn't aware of my surroundings, maybe the invader chose the environment as part of his strategy?

Anyway, you're missing out on a lot by not playing online IMO. 
but invasions and coop are only part of it. You are missing out on all the messages and death stains that litter the world from other players when you play offline. It's part of the Dark Souls experience :(

It's fun to also to leave your white soap stone summon sign down by a difficult boss you've beaten and help others defeat it! If you equip the sunbros covenant item you can get rewards for it to. And souls! 
What Daz Said 
online play is the heart and soul of the game, it can ease off a lot of the supposed difficulty.

There's a reason why people are getting really pissed off that the online functionality of Dark Souls 1 has stopped on PC 
A Taste Of What You're Missing 
i literally can't stop laughing at that, lmao 
The fucking Mimics man. 
I want to play a cool SP game.

I don't want to have random moments of fucking DS3 1v1 deathmatch.

I don't want the beautiful scenery littered with bleeding shitstains with some moronic drivel I have to stop and read every 5 seconds.

I don't want to help any other cunts with difficult boss fights. If they're difficult enough I'm quite happy not playing them again. 
... so play Quake + Quoth mod... that would satisfy your query ;) 
And I Thought I Might Be Getting Immune To The Spectacular Scenery.... 
<Shambler> holy shitting fuck
<Shambler> when you pop out onto dat view of the boreal valley city
<Shambler> DAT VIEW! 
I find invasions add a great deal extra variety to the overall experience, such as one encounter which had me and a friend laughing our arses off.

I was helping him via coop and we not long reached a particular night-time location, He gets invaded and we both proceeded to fight the guy. He's a squirmy one that's for sure. Friend's covenant kicks in and a Blue Sentinel comes to our aid. The invader knows he's outmatched, especially having Lloyd Talismans thrown in his face. Screw this he must have thought and retreated further ahead to mingle with some nasty enemies to take advantage of them. The invaded expected us to come to him.

We had a better idea.

Seed of the Giant. The invader gets slashed in the back by one of those enemies and then stun-locked into its deadly combo, dying soon after. That was perhaps the funniest encounter in a Souls game I've personally experienced in a while. 
Just trying to comfort poor ol' Bal last night who despite probably having 850% more experience and skill in games like this is totally noobing it up, possibly because he has chosen a Pyromancer build.

I've read in a couple of places that a magic build (ranged or otherwise?) is pretty weak in this?? I can imagine that being so, partly because of the need to lock on to enemies are close range thus encouraging them to smash your head in, and partly because of managing mana as well as health/stamina. Is that true??

What builds are people rocking, and what builds are feasible??

I've gone for uber-boring knight, partly because it was recommended as a good starter build, partly because I like having some good honest H2H combat in these sort of fantasy games (I get my ranged weapon fix elsewhere). I've stuck with sword and shield and kept my weight low and my weapon single handed so I can block, then dodge, then still land a decent flurry of blows.

I can imagine "adjacent" builds to this working well, e.g. a rogue-ish build with light armour and maximum daggers for speed, or a barbarian-ish build with massive weapon aiming for just one good hit per encounter.

Discuss etc etc 
I Started As A Pyromancer As Well 
That allowed me to totally clown Ludex Gundyr on the first try, and gave me some safety distance for some of the more annoying parts of high wall. Then I picked up some sorceries and a staff in the settlement and ditched pyromancy because lol it's shit.

Found a straightsword fairly early in the high wall and I've got that at +8 now with a heavy gem and I'm pretty much using that for everything, with soul arrow to plink away at stuff from safety. 
Was my starter class as I prefer faith builds. Extra heals are handy and I just got sunlight sword.
Faith feels very weak compared to previous games. 
Dark Souls III is my first introduction to the series. I did attempt the first Dark Souls awhile back, but I was not fond of it, and quit before even getting to the first boss. I suppose I gave the third game a more faithful attempt because it has a proper PC version, and they've had 3 games to iron out all the little bugs and annoyances that might have plagued the previous titles.

Right from the start though, from my brief experience with the first game, that I knew I had to plan all my actions very carefully, I was going in completely blind.

ludex Gundyr took about 7 tries before I could finally beat him, that gave me a good insight to what I would be up against in the future.I have always believed in the theory of slow and steady wins the race, and I applied that to my pace in Dark Souls 3. I never rush through a new area, or even an area I am only somewhat familiar with. I will explore every nook and cranny as I can before facing the boss, and I am not against grinding a bit to level up, making sure I am well prepared for what may lie ahead.

By following through those procedures, I have become much more proficient then since I first started. It took only 3 tries to defeat Vordt of the Boreal Valley, and I managed to defeat the Cursed Rotted Greatwood on the first attempt. I have begun my journey onto the road of sacrifices.

I wasn't sure if I felt I made the right choice giving Dark Souls 3 a buy, not knowing if I would enjoy it. I see now I made the right choice, as I am enjoying every moment. Its certainly unlike any game I have played, and its very refreshing. But you have to be willing to commit time to it, or it won't be as pleasurable. 
... during my first playthrough.

I had an absolute blast playing a Cleric-build for my second character in DS2 I wanted to try that again. Rapier in my left hand, Mace in my right. And miracles...

Besides healing and lightning blade, everything else was too slow and useless in both PVE and PVP encounters. I had better luck using bombs/urns or throwing daggers for ranged combat. Lightning spear/stake just plinked mere speckles of health regardless of a 40 faith total with both Ring of Prayer + Ring of the Sun's First Born equipped. Switched to Knight's Ring instead. Lightning Blade cast on a +10 Heavy Mace was simply insane in comparison. Very disappointed with faith in DS3.

Think I had more success with offensive miracles during DS2. Heavenly Thunder in the first Bell Tower was a nice bait tactic versus Shades. Good miracles to acquire early on in that game unlike DS3.

The mace was a great weapon though overall, especially for shield guard-breaking. Rapier mostly for a quick stun/finish or parry.

Beat the final boss a few days ago. My build by the end of it:
Status Equipment FashionSouls 
ORL / Post #39. 
Spot on post that. Very similar experience to me (6 attempts on Grundr, 2 on Vordt, 2 on Greatwood - almost the same totals!). 
Pontiff Shitwankfuckflaps 
Okay so this is the DS experience I've been waiting for *rolls eyes*.

Things wot make this fight near impossible:
> Pontiff Fuckturd moves at the speed of sound.
> Pontiff Cuntface seems to have a vast reservoir of near instantaneously recoverable stamina.
> Those fucking flailing fire and magic swords swirl so much shitty sparkly effects around that at any given point I can only see 10% of the screen and that 10% is my rapidly diminishing health bar.
> The 2nd phase Pontiff Twatstench phantom hides behind the original so there's no way to see the fucking attacks coming.

Things wot don't have much bearing on this fight:
> Player skill.

Basically it's like trying to deathmatch against another character with twice as much health as the total of your own health plus every estus flask you own, with the infinite stamina cheat on, in a rave with some cunt sticking fire and magic glowsticks up your nose, until the 2nd phase where it's like that except it's two fucking players and one is partially invisible. FML. 
please describe every boss from now on, it's fucking gold :D

But yeah, he sounds hard. I am not sure cos me and Scampie JOLLY COOPED his arse in 2 or 3 attempts :P 
I tried to solo him once.
Said "fuck that", went to the dungeon instead, came back 15 levels stronger, summoned two phantoms, stunlocked his scrawny ass in a corner. 
When you play offline like shmabrel, do you also lose the ability to summon (and be invaded) by offline bots? 
No U Can Get Invaded. 
Just like Daz's anus. 
Also U Cunts. 
WHERE IS THE SUMMon outside?? I couldn't find it after czg said in IRC. I have been summoned by an NPC once and found a summon but it's nowhere near there. 
is between the entrance and the platform you can drop down to grab the ring.

You need to be in "ember" form for it to work.

Another thing to note is that poise has been broken for a couple of days meaning the game has suddenly got exponentially harder for those relying on heavy armour for increased stability.

Also note that you can set a password for summons and summon your friends. Me and one of my friends have played about 25% of the game together and had a laugh riot, this still invites phantoms but you're more likely to succeed against those asshats as a pair. 
Yeah You Need To Pop An Ember 
And there's one NPC summon sign in front of each statue in the area before the fog door. 
Git Gud 
pontiff can be parried. multiple times. he is also vulnerable to bleed. he is much like dark souls 1 final boss - really hard as long as you're clueless about parrying. he's not the only boss with the exact same weakness, btw.

honestly though, the enemy design is pretty irritating in this game. the amount of infinite stamina mobs with 30-hit combos is above enjoyable level, not unlike dark souls 2.

weapon balance is a joke as well. get a straightsword (any will work), invest in physical scaling stats and good infusion, mash attack button like a madman - works on enemies, bosses, pvp players. 
I Got Gud So Fuck You. 
Did him in under ten attempts, admittedly by using 11 Estus Flasks at +8, full HP potion, Siegward Brew and an Ember and finishing on about 6 HP. But I fucking did it unlike these cooping asssniffers.

On the other hand Yhorm who gets his own cameo in the intro, went down first go with only 5 Estus used, and that can't all be down to the wonderful Onion Bro lending a hand.

weapon balance is a joke as well. get a straightsword (any will work), invest in physical scaling stats and good infusion, mash attack button like a madman - works on enemies, bosses, pvp players.

Works for me! Love it! 
P.S. I Think... 
...I tried him with a weapon infused with bleed and it didn't seem to do much more??

One thing that was useful was realising that the 2nd phase isn't that bad as the jump attack is fairly predictable.

What's parrying btw - blocking and then attacking when the enemy rebounds? 
Yhorm is a dumb fight. If you followed Siegward's quest, Siegward solos him for you with some random magical giant killing sword.

If you didn't, you have to realize that you have to run past Yhorm to his throne, pick up and equip the copy of the weapon that Siegward would be using which has no fucking use except that it has a weapon art that kills Yhorm in like 4 hits.

Or you can try and fight him properly and it takes fucking forever because he has a billion HP and isn't even that interesting to fight. 
@Shambler <- that video is a good introduction to parries. although it's about dark souls 1, it's still relevant for dks3 in most aspects. some things work different, but the main idea is still the same 
Yhorm Fight 
is a disappointment for sure. but it's a fanservice, as it mirrors one of the demon's souls bosses. too bad they put that gimmick into a mandatory lord boss fight rather than into some optional boss encounter. 
Yes TBH. 
I wish Yhorm had been more dramatic. Having Onion Bro around is always a morally uplifting experience, but I'd have been happy to have to put a bit more effort and tension in.

So far I think my favourite boss has been the Greatwood. Properly fucking bonkers and not that difficult. 
Probably your favorite boss because you could have a go at its balls, right?! 
was one that me and a friend had a few cracks at. We died 2 or 3 times because we couldn't quite figure out how the sword worked exactly.

It was pretty trivial after that.

I've enjoyed playing it mostly co-op, it's been really fun killing mobs and killing bosses. The occasional invasions have been exciting too. 
Fun Fact 
You can be permanently banned from multiplayer matchmaking by cheaters. So watch out everyone who cares for coop and pvp. From software's attitude to their pc customers is fantastic. 
Next Boss? 
And for this season's show, Shambler "Le Pincushion", is modelling a coat d'arms made of a billion fucking arrows that rained on him from the sky. Not only is this chic garment stylishly glittering with impaled metal, the countless puncture wounds provide excellent ventilation in the armour. And Shambler's flesh.

will make you his bitch...

I can't imagine doing that boss solo. Saying that though a lot of the bosses scale up with summons and have far more hit-points as a result.

There's a boss called "the dancer" who I could absolutely not kill in co-op that I managed to kill solo because he wasn't so much of a tank. 
It was recently discovered that the Miracle "Vow of Silence" works on Aldrich, so if you're doing miracles the boss is a cakewalk because you can just keep casting it to make Aldrich not cast spells for 10 or so seconds.

But for real strats... it's a bit easier once you learn to just always run at Aldrich, and in the second phase just run around in circles to avoid the arrow rain if it does that attack. Everything else Aldrich does you can just roll or ignore. I solo'd it after quite a few attempts, and coop'd it with Daz on his playthrough pretty easily. 
Fucking desperate. More attempts than the rest of the bosses put together?? Maybe.

I did a lot of swapping around items and armour to try to get the best options....and the one thing that finally helped was doing as few attacks as I could manage whenever I went in to attack. Just one or two unless she was doing that summoning fire shit. Any more and I'd get caught out in the open with some massive unavoidable and obscured-by-swirling-bollox health rapage. 
Champion Cuntdr. 
20+ attempts in a row trying to learn his attacks and what weapons might work
10 more attempts later
2 hours grinding to level up str, getting dark sword, and get weapon upgrades
20 more attempts learning that his attack combos / progressions are randomised
1 more hour grinding to level up str, get titanite chunk
3 more attempts (at this point I was working on a long term plan of ten attempts, then enough grinding for +1 str, then ten attempts, then repeat)

This is with optimising my weapon / armour for the build vs boss (the most anti-melee armour I could have while retaining fast rolling, +7 dark sword with heavy to scale with str), using stamina recovery ring + general health+stamina+weight boost ring + rolling invincibility boost ring + rolling invisibility b2b dex boost ring.

Anyway, bit after that was cool / surreal. Ended up like this:

Shambler: "Well I just gave the fire keeper a set of fire keeper's eyes and she's all grateful and stuff and wtf??"

GF: "Yeah, bitches BE CRAZY..." 
<Shambler> i'm gonna miss this game after i get to the final boss and ragequit it 
<Shambler> the style of the world and the aesthetics are utterly entrancing 
DS3 Finished, GOTY?? 
Okay so this is an obviously flawed game:

- The boss balance is completely fucked up. Some are so easy to be disappointingly negligble, some are so frustratingly hard there can never be any pleasure in the fight. And most of the latter are farcically simple when cooped. Totally unbalanced compared to the game in general.
- The boss arenas mostly spoil the gameflow and are quite arbitrary and out of character with the general progression / exploration of the game.
- The story / plot is entirely incomprehensible and obscure... "Learn it through the game, nub", yeah whatever I heeded all the available lore and it still made no fucking sense.
- The NPC quests are even worse, almost all of them are based on totally secret random conditions and actions that are impossible to quest and almost certainly fail on the first time playthrough.
- The PC port is adequately poor especially bad rebinding and not changing menus to kb+m style (despite the game obviously being perfectly playable with kb+m).
- Bonfire spacings are quite screwy.
- Lothric area always loads like a slideshow.
- Ithryll Dungeons and Smouldering Lake corridor sections are a bit meh.
- Online aspect is an immersion-spoiling mess of invasions messages and bloodstains everywhere.

But....but but but.....

+ The dark gothic fantasy aspect is done perfectly.
+ It looks utterly amazing in style and design (even on Low graphics).
+ Some of the scenes are mind-blowingly good - popping out in front of Ithryll Of Boreal Valley is THE more stunning scene I've seen in 18 years of gaming.
+ The exploration and interconnectivity is amazing.
+ The monsters and enemies are very cool, characterful, varied and impressive - including many of the bosses. Some of the designs are bonkers, some are inspiring, some of the attacks are hilarious/disturbing.
+ The amount of optional areas and secrets are great.
+ Some of the NPCs are cute / cool (Onion Bro!)
+ The overall world is so well done and immersive (despite the obscure / unconvincing lore), that it is actually a wrench to reach the end and stop exploring it.

In short I'd say it is maybe 80% perfect?? But that 80% is actually just SO good, it's worth 112.5% extra, so I give it 90% perfect. 
+ The non-boss combat is generally good, fair, and interesting, and the enemy variety and styles make it pretty rewarding. 
Even during my second playthrough, while emberred, I have never successfully fought off an invader. Not a single one. This is my only complaint about the game, the fact that I have to deal with others trying to kill me while I have my own problems going on.

I try to never stay emberred and if I am, I turn my settings to offline. 
Yeah Same. 
Well, never got invaded properly, but just kept it offline. The online thing seems a lot of immersion-fucking bullshit. 
I understand the novelty of it. Gain increased HP at the cost of battling someone, but nine times out of ten that someone is a full armored level 200 tank wielding dual greatswords, charging at me like a battering ram. And here I am a level 50 sorcerer wearing a dress, watching my life flash before my eyes.

I don't like going offline, because that means I miss out on the important and often dirty messages left by others, that reveal secrets, ambushes, or their sick fantasies. As a result, before encountering a boss, I ember myself, and go offline, and continue from there. Once the boss is defeated, I just kill myself, and return online. Or the rare case I need assistance, or feel like helping someone get through a boss.

tl;dr Fuck invaders. 
It's Really Both Funny And Sad 
How people still complain about invaders after all the effort the developers put into making invader's life as miserable as possible.

At the same time, everyone is totally fine with the fact you can summon not 1, not 2 but 3 potentially super op friendly phantoms that can destroy everything in the game without your involvement, including any invaders. You can even spawn fresh summons infinitely if they manage to fail and die somehow. And after obliterating a boss with a bunch of coop partners a lazy host receives exactly the same rewards as an honest player who puts his/her time to learn how to defeat a boss on his own.

"nine times out of ten that someone is a full armored level 200 tank wielding dual greatswords" - what? Just what? That's not possible, hasn't been ever in any previous games as well. Dark Souls 3 even restricts the upgrade level of the gear that an invader can use. The rules of matchmaking are right here:

Btw, pro tip: you don't have to go offline to use an ember. Just do it right at the fog gate to the boss. It will also heal you fully if you get hit on the way and allow to see occasional summon signs. No invader can possibly chase you down ever if you're one step away from the boss fight. Such an issue. Duh...

The only real bad thing online is cheaters, but that's a different can of worms. 
Yeah invaders usually have to overcome quite big odds in order to succeed. Plus you can use a seed to make the enemies hostile to the phantoms. 
I don't like going offline, because that means I miss out on the important and often dirty messages left by others, that reveal secrets, ambushes, or their sick fantasies.

That is one of the main reasons I stayed offline, because I don't want to see that bollox.

I was offline 95% of the time, for a few stupid bosses, I went online, cooped them, and reloaded offline as soon as the bonfire was lit.

And after obliterating a boss with a bunch of coop partners a lazy host receives exactly the same rewards as an honest player who puts his/her time to learn how to defeat a boss on his own.

I'd have a lot more sympathy for this concept if the boss battles were a good bit of the game rather than often a detriment - something to get out of the fucking way to get on with the fun and awesome exploration. And also if they weren't so stupidly imbalanced for solo vs coop i.e. SOLO - 2 hours of attempts, COOP - 2 minutes of doing boss first time.

The harder bosses should have been made twice as easy for solo and 4 times harder for coop imo. 
Why are phantoms stupid glowing colours?? Doesn't fit with the aesthetic. 
It's a shame that you're playing offline, you can play the game with a friend by setting up a password. Granted that you still get invaded but it's far more involving playing that way. 
Amazing Bler Ahead 
you can summon not 1, not 2 but 3 potentially super op friendly phantoms that can destroy everything in the game without your involvement, including any invaders.

Yes, I am aware that you can summon allies to help you fight off invaders, and being in a covenant will summon an ally to assist you. But I never see a co-op soap sign around when I am being invaded, or I see it too late and I'm halfway dead. Or, the covenant ally never makes it in time before I die. I just haven't been lucky in that regard.

what? Just what? That's not possible, hasn't been ever in any previous games as well.

Okay, I exaggerated that part :) But the majority of the time I am faced with powerful invaders who always make short work of me.

Such an issue. Duh... Well, that is what I've been doing. Emberring before I enter the boss battle, and summoning any allies to fight with me.

I've put in a lot of hours in the game so far, but there is still much for me to learn about all the mechanics. For example I just learned how trading with pickle piss rump pumper works. 
Orl (almost autocorrected to Oral...), you're cracking me up. 
I reinstalled. Copied my save game data over from a back up hard drive. Realised the last time I backed up was before the Brothers boss, and the game doesn't save your data on Steam apparently.

Bleh!! Still at least I get to replay Archdragon Peak :) 
Let Me Tell You About Dark Souls 
So I've decided to give it a proper crack of the whip (this is Dark Souls 1 I'm talking about, I'm a bit behind)

Many years ago I started playing DS 1 on the PS3 but I gave up before I really even got started (I'd reached the Taurus Demon) because it all seemed like too much of a painful slog at the time.

In this new playthrough I've made it up to Capra Demon, but him and his dogs stun-lock instakill me within 5 seconds everytime I enter that tiny broom cupboard in which you fight him, so I think I need to read more wikis/guides/youtubes before I'm "gud" enough to beat him.

I actually don't think the game is unfairly hard. What I think the problem is, is the game does a very poor job of communicating essential mechanics to the player, relying on them being forced to go on to the internet and read wikis to actually realise things like "oh, so I need to raise my poise to a certain level before it's even possible for me to block the capra demon's initial attack...and oh right I can't roll away properly until I've lowered my equip load to under 25%, and and and..."

And then you have to wiki more to figure out how exactly you raise your poise to a decent level... 
The game does a very poor job of communicating ANYTHING to the player ;).

In terms of exploration and progression, that's kinda cool. In terms of mechanics it's kinda tedious. In terms of lore, I still don't have the faintest fucking idea what is going on...

When is the DS3 DLC coming out anyway?? 
<--- Rocket Represents My Permanently Erect Member Re: DS1 Map Design 
Smabs - have you played 1 and 2 yet?

Also, for those who've played 1,2 and 3 - is the "level" design and connectivity of the world as trouser-tentingly transcendent in 2 and 3 as it is in 1? 
Capra Demon is a real fucker. The generally accepted tactic is to run up the stairs, kill the dogs and then use the stairs to drop attack his ass as best you can.

Or you could just square up to him and his dogs like a real man. 
In 3 yes, in 2 no. 
Level design is 2 is pretty mediocre save for a few locations, and most of all it doesn't make sense at all. Level design in 3 is not as open as 1 but it has the busiest areas of the series with tons of stuff to discover and lots of shortcuts. 
#3 looks pretty fucking amazing. My gothic fantasy spooge cannons ran dry part way through.

When I reinstalled I'd forgotten to sync saves or some BS and got booted back to Arch Dragon Peak. Not much of a chore to replay that now that I know to avoid boss fight fuckwittery by cooping all the cunts. 
I'm tempted to continue to keep bashing away at the Capra Demon with my current equipment, but really, him and those fucking dogs catch me instantly, every goddamn time before I can run past him, or otherwise strafe or roll. Blocking is a non-option because his initial attack cuts through my Black Knight Shield like it was made of tissue paper, and after wiki'ing, I'm sure the shield is fine but he rapes me because my overall "poise" is poor.

This is really my problem with the game, I don't mind games that are hard, but the mechanics need to be understandable from within the game, and it shouldn't be required to wiki everything in order to figure out what I'm doing wrong. If it wasn't for the wiki and watching videos, I wouldn't have much of a clue against any of the bosses so far, although the Taurus Demon was fairly straightforward because it uses a trick you were actually taught in the game (plunge attack).

Maybe this is the whole point with the "messages" that players can leave on the ground...

Sorry to hear that the map design in #2 isn't as good as 1. Oh well, I've reached the point where the incomparably exquisite structure of the world has caused me to dredge up so many loads, that my abused and aching nards have regressed entirely into my pelvic cavity... so maybe it's a good thing to give them a bit of a rest for that particular entry in the series? Build up a decent reservoir of the ol' wallpaper paste ready for #3 maybe?... 
Let's Have A Good Old Circlejerk 
Fuck Yeah 
WTF am I gonna do until October 25th? 
Play Quake 
Play Quake

Playing DS (DS 1 at least) will actually make you a better quake mapper. HTH. (re: map design, not gameplay) 
Started Making This Before The Vacation
Not gonna finish it tho 
Filename: Caprabox.bsp 
Looks City 
Go Map! 
Damn You SissyG 
Finish that one. 
I See CZG's Post And Raise Him This 

Though I haven't worked on it for a long time - 
Filth Elephant 
Finish that one. 
both look great.
please finish fifth! 
Lol I've Started A Sen's Fortress Map As Well 
Thinking About Evolving Mine 
Into something slightly more unique but keeping some of the themes also. 
A new DS-inspired cziggy map would get the ol' custard flying, for sure 
fifth's one looks acebiscuits as well. 
How About 
A Kinn screenshot for 2016? 
A Kinn screenshot for 2016?

I've put on a bit of weight recently so I might post a cheeky duckface from Vegas 2014 and pretend it's current - let's be honest, we've all done it. 
Phwoar Kinn Duckface. 
Wanking already in anticipation.

Yay, DLC! Winter stuff looks ace. They show a lot of bosses from the main game in that tho? As usual fuck bosses, but PSYCHED for the rest. 
The Bosses Will Return As Regular Enemies. 
Can't wait to see Shambler's reaction when he reaches the Dancer horde fight. 
Fuck Your Face!! 
Gonna coop them all this time. As good as a cheat code. 
The huge warrior dude with the axe looks sick, as do the wolf packs.

Can't wait to see the new painted world, that area was one of the best in DS1 (From software continuing their trend of putting the BEST areas of their games hidden in secrets!)

I think From don't like to spoil too many of the bosses and areas in trailers which is why they recycle some old footage in them. They did the same in some old trailers according to knowledgeable yt folks. 
Just Started 
Just got to the second bonfire in the lorthic wall area.

First impression is that it feels like a mix between Dark Souls 2 and Demon's Souls which is fine by me! I already have uttered the internal mantra: "There HAS to be a bonfire around the corner...come on!" already and that brings back fond (nightmares) memories of the earlier Souls games. My one and only death so far was from naked katana man near the start area.

Disappointed by the lack of 21:9 support and the third party plugin to fix that presents other issues. Oh well, looking forward to getting lost this weekend! 
Naked Katana Man. 
Is a dick. 
He does drop a pretty good weapon, though (if you're thinking about going for a dex build). 
I killed this guy at the start of my game and pretty much used the katana the whole time. 
Updated My Ash Journal 
This is just great, really brings back the oppressive atmosphere of Dark Souls 1 that was absent (for me) in Dark Souls 2.

**Minor Spoilers**

I just created the final shortcut before the Cathedral of the Deep fog door. I can only assume this will be a boss (presumably Aldrich of the Deep!) I actually felt exhausted by the time I reached the fog door, and decided to stop instead of braving through the fog door.

But man, CotD is INSANE! Huge layout with multiple layers and surprises. Great DS1 like situations like trying to figure out how the flying fuck to bypass the second resting giant in the goop and how to handle the rafter knights high up above. My favorite area so far, so intense and I am pretty sure I spent my entire session (2-3 hours) just fanoodling my way through this massive space. Can't wait to dive back in!

Also, the fat official lady who bangs her morning star stick on the ground is hauntingly beautiful and echoes throughout the vast cathedral.

Oh and a final note, I joined the covenant of the demon tentacle bed lady and now some white knight lady basically gave me a death threat because of it...nice reactivity there! 
Bloughsburgh, sounds like we are at about the same stage of the game since I got done with CotD about 2 days ago too. 
Awesome, I have been going steady as she goes with the game since my last post. It gets more intense from here on out but I have to still say that currently the CotD is still my favorite location.

**Minor spoilers**

Currently at the snow city experiencing a huge difficulty spike with these knight enemies. I need to re-work my approach which I can surely appreciate! 
Snow City 
aka Ithryll Of The Boreal Valley etc etc....when I first saw that my jaw dropped so far I had to get a crowbar to prise it off the carpet. The most stunning scene I've seen in 18 years of gaming. Although the interconnectivity wasn't quite up to par.

Conversely, I remember Daz shooting his septic load over COTD, but although it was definitely great, it didn't captivate me in quite the same way.

Bluuuurghhhh, what knight enemies are those? The tall skeletal ones are tricky but not that bad, I can't remember if there's a trick or not?? Try playing around with different weapons. It might be the usual "dodge a lot and don't get carried away" business....

I've replayed the last bits....still need to get summons for the final boss and arch dragon peak boss.... 
Shambler, indeed COTD is my favourite area in terms of level design. The layout is fantastic and I love the single bonfire concept (lets ignore Rosaria for now).

If Irithyl had the same awesome layout, connectivity, and verticality then it would be my favourite area for sure. I agree the vista was utterly breathtaking!

I might go through Cathedral again for the lolz. 
Shambler Snow 
Yeah the skull face ones with frost swords. They were kicking my butt when I was only trying to roll out of their ways. I switched to sword and board for this part and found backstabbing comes easy with these folks. Currently exploring the dungeon section which suspiciously looks an awful lot like the Tower of Latria from Demon's Souls. 
Yes, Ithryll is pretty stunning, although I'm sorry to say that DaS III hasn't captivated me as much as I'd hoped in the design department. Ithryll feels like a bit of a derivative copy of Yharnam from Bloodborne; the whole high walls area felt very similar to the Boletarian Palace in Demons' souls; etc.

That's not to say the design isn't a million times better than most other games, it just has high standards to live up to. Controversially, I still think DaS2 has the best design of the series so far. 
Also, Bloodbourne PORT WHEN THE FUCK. 
Considering Demon's Souls has kept its exclusivity, I highly doubt we will ever see Bloodbourne on anything but.

I purchased a PS3 slim for Rockband, LittleBigPlanet and Demon's Souls alone. I could see myself purchasing a PS4 (When it is cheaper, has game bundles, and my ps3 is kicking the bucket) with the knowledge I could then play Bloodbourne in mind.

Would be amazing if they did though! 
I Know... 
...I'm just gonna keep moaning about it. Fuck console exclusives!! 
Just figure out that I can use DSFix to dump the textures from Dark Souls for use in other 3D applications ... 
A DS-flavored Quake map could be yummy-a-plenty! 
I actually used the texture dump to change area titles for a youtube project that never came to be. Dark Souls Quake theme would be coolness.


Anyway, Tower of Lat--I mean the dungeon was a pretty cool place and possibly my favorite or second favorite area thus far, but the health drain aura from the jailers is some wicked bull caca. Profaned capital is very large and the toxic sludge place was pretty devious...I have yet to enter the tall fog gate.

Pontiff Sully was a pretty epic fight but I am actually sadden I did not die once to him. This may be because I tried to do everything before entering the rather intimidating fog gate. Now on the back end and fighting asshole fire priests and feigning giants...still having a great time...but dying less than I'd like...? Does that make sense? 
you didn't die once to Pontiff?

Nerf yourself 
dying less than I'd like...? Does that make sense?
Not much to me. Some masochistic tendencies? ;) 
Called It.... 
That it should have skill settings not just to tone down the difficulty but also increase it for veterans/perverts.

The dungeon is the 2nd most boring place after the underground fire tomb lake corridor things....but each to their own huh. The Health Drain is evil but a neat trick IMO. Keeps you on your toes. Profaned is semi-tiny despite appearances and the boss fight is pretty much a gimmick. HTH. 
Well, I beat the game. I'll summarize the rest of the journey since the last post.

***Super Spoilers***

I like the inclusion of Anor Londo and the whole spiel of Aldrich munching on some Gywndolin doritos. I loved the Aldrich boss fight and room but sadly I bested him on the first go...once you close the distance with him he is pretty defenseless. Aldrich's boss room is probably my favorite location in the game.

Yorhm (sp) the Giant was pure gimmick but a nice homage to Demon's Souls with the Storm Ruler sword. I would have liked this fight be something that wasn't a Lord of Cinder. As it stands, that fight takes about 5 charge ups to defeat the giant regardless of your skills/weapons. He didn't get me once.

Dancer of the Valley is a different story, pretty intense fight and that one spin move is frightening. I had to finally switch away from my warden twinblades +8 to my black knight sword +3 for this fight so I can appreciate that! Took about 3 tries.

Lorthic castle is fun, but I did not get a "final" vibe from the place...just seemed like a continuation of the high wall. But the Dragonslayer Armor may be my favorite boss. This guy took at least half a dozen attempts and I had to learn all of his patterns to walk away with just 1 estus. The burning butterflies are not cheap as you get plenty of time to compensate...just a great fight.

Grand Archives just feels like more Lorthic and not a new area...although the wax head mages are funky.

Lorian and Lorthic are a fun fight, and I knew it was going to have a second phase and indeed it did. At first I thought it was overkill but I really enjoyed the dynamic the duo provided. 2 or 3 tries...can't remember.

Consumed King Oceiros (sp) appeared difficult on the first go, but on the second try I found if you stay almost under him, he really can't do much but hop away. Loved the inclusion of this place in general...completely unessential and I can appreciate that. Further more, it leads to two secret complete areas!

Untended graves is a trip and was very eerie to roam keeper's eyes...haunting. The champion gunther or whatever was a more aggressive version but nothing a single attempt couldn't achieve.

Would have never found Archdragon Peak without checking the wiki...that is just too convoluted to find on your own and offline. But wow is this place cool, not only super secret but also includes a large area, items, and 2 bosses! I loved the gimmick of the ancient wyvern and it was done in good taste...felt really good and that I actually accomplished something. I hesitated to ring that grand bell considering the dev warnings (Dev warnings in this game should be adhered!) but finally broke down and rang the sucker. Cool boss, really feels like the Ozma of FFIX or emerald weapon of FF7 in terms of non-essential but very tough fight. He took about 4 tries and again I had to learn his moves and patterns to make it out with zero estus!

Soul of Cinder was expected to be honest...another Gwyn-esque fight and it was a bit of a let down. Just another humanoid where you learn a couple of swipes and you are good to go. I think 3 tries to take him down. I can appreciate that he appeared to possess abilities of the first four lords so that is cool.

And that's it, I linked the fire and did some things and proceeded to NG+. I was too afraid to give the eyes to the fire keeper as it only sounded horrible but I will be sure to do so this cycle. I also completely missed out on the dark sigil quest line and would like to explore that as well.

Speaking of quests, a nitpick I have is how utterly convoluted some of these side quests are. I checked the wiki after beating the game and I am pretty sure I would have never found 3 of the covenants or how to continue 75% of the NPC's stories. There are so many failure points which I can appreciate but damn son. One example is Patches. I did the CotD in such a way that I never triggered his event. This means I would have to purposefully go to the fully explored tower, ride the lift and back down to trigger him...never would have done that without internet assistance. Oh well minor nitpick.

In summary, I think DSIII tied the three games together quite well. I found a lack of locales in this game but the ones present were fantastic. I found this game to be a smidgen more difficult than 2(Not including DLCs), and 1 harder than both. I think the most challenging boss was probably Dragonslayer Armor or maybe the Dancer with Nameless King a close runner up. The new DLC just came out and I imagine some of you folks will be playing it so I may have to stay away from the thread for a while! Thanks for reading.

One more note is that I played this game (And the previous) entirely offline. I enjoyed the brooding and oppressive isolation that this brings and I was never interested in PvP. Further more I never summoned an NPC to help because I feel that takes away the challenge from a boss. 
Double Post Don't Care 
online play is the heart and soul of the game, it can ease off a lot of the supposed difficulty.

I disagree with this. The statement, not that I have an issue with fifth's playstyle.

I found that the DS1 online connectivity was to have a synchronous world where you realize others are struggling alongside you but not physically with you. The PvP exploded in popularity so of course it will be more infused in future titles. I have no problem with it but I feel having a white phantom distract a boss while you wail at its backside significantly lowers the intimidation (And by extension, the feel-goods when you overcome them) level of the fight. I would have to agree with Shambler and Orl.

I don't need to read a message in front of a statute of a woman that states: "Try holding with both hands."

Anyhoo that's just like my opinion man and I am happy the multiplayer aspect is there but more happy that we that players have a choice!

This is also more in regards to your first play through. Co-oping after the fact would be a different and more social experience I am sure. 
The champion gunther or whatever was a more aggressive version but nothing a single attempt couldn't achieve.

Think he took me 60 attempts or something??

Couldn't even contemplate doing Arse Dragon or Soul Of Chunder solo. 
This guy is way too fucking reasonable for this message board &#128518; 
I don't like toxicity so I try not to spread it if I can help it.


I assume arse dragon is Rider of the Storm? He was very intimidating and was quite difficult. The few points about soloing bosses I can say is I have been doing so since the first Dark Souls and never looked back. It could be that trained my Dark Souls boss mojo I don't know.

I am working on a thematic let's play of sorts where I am attempting a soul level 1 play through only using a certain thematic build. (Raw hand ax, light cross bow, weak ragged armor) I did so in Dark Souls 1 with the hollow thief's set and a fire hand ax and light crossbow and had a blast.

Soul level 1 demands picking the deprived class and I can say that Iudex Gundyr rocked my world about 6 times this time I can imagine many of the bosses that appear to be infamous here are going to give their biggest grimace and gently whisper into my ear: "You brought this on yourself big boy." 
I Don't Like Toxicity So I Try Not To Spread It If I Can Help It. 
What are you even doing on func_ then? :p 
What Are You Even Doing On Func_ Then? :p 
Who knows...

Let's go with something about Quake mapping discussions or some shit like that. 
DLC Preview: 
DLC Thoughts (no Spoilers!) 
Overall I enjoyed the dlc and would recommend it to anyone who wants more DS3 content. It clocks in at around the same size as Archdragon Peak so if you feel that is worth the cash then go ahead!

The new items are interesting as are the new enemies. The new bosses are fantastic and I guarantee the final boss will have you :O'ing

Fuck wolves though, seriously 
Archdragon For $15? 

Thanks for the no spoiler mini review man! 
It's much longer than Archdragon's Peak. Feels like roughly 2 areas as one nicely connected whole. I wasn't disappointed. The level design is great, the difficulty feels like it slots in nicely as something to do after Archdragon... the biggest criticism I can offer is I feel like it could've used 1 extra boss, but the 2 there that were in the DLC were interesting and fun fights. 
DLC Question. 
I started playing this a little while ago, with my normal character, having finished the full game (level 110 or something). Not NG+. IIRC, the DLC was feeling a bit easy at first?? Am I grossly OP for it? Is it designed to either be reached on NG+ or reached by starting over so you have a COTD-level character?

Cheers bromiez. 
There's a note at the beginning of the DLC area suggesting it's for players who are "deep into Castle Lothric", so something around level 60-80. You should be a bit OP, but then again, even on the recommended level range, I found the majority of enemies to be easy, only two or three types are quite tough. And then there's the bosses... 
The design of the game looks cool, I will play it once i get my new computer.

The game looks dark, unlike Diablo 3 that looked like a Disney movie.

The Textures have abit too much detail, and the lighting looks abit flat at moments, this makes the game look messy. I think there can be a compromise between looking like a disney movie or looking like a mess of details.

The typography is also bad, and they HUD-design is also just squares, something like hexen and diablo 1 had good HUD design, imo.

There are moments where the game looks really good, where foreground, middlground and background are nicely separated and legible.

but even in this example the character get blended to the surroundings... Doom 2016 graphics were legible without totally looking like a disney movie.

I dont neceserally dislike the disney movie feel but i think the style is starting to dominate too much. Overwatch, diablo 3, hearthstone, wow... 
Where's BlazBlue? 
I notice the BB abbreviation was about BlazBlue, but so much of this thread has virtually no information on BB. I accept both Dark Souls' and BlazBlue's existences, but still I think a comparison of BB's gameplay with that of DS3 is needed. 
The BB abbreviation was also about Bloodbourne I think. 
Oh well, don't compare BlazBlue to Dark Souls 3 in this thread. My mistake, because BlazBlue's a fighting game. (unless you want to state the fact that it was going to be an RPG at first before becoming the fighter it is now) 
Dark Souls Bosses Rock / Suck Because... 
Ok so my opinion is that the bosses in souls games rock because they force the player to master the game in order to progress. This trickles down in to all the combat mechanics and makes the player engage with their character build in a way that I haven't really experienced in another game.

In the other corner there are players who hate the bosses because they see them as a giant artificial difficulty spike that gets in the way of the enjoyment of exploration and discovery.

I am interested to hear people's opinions on this and also what they think the souls games could do better in this area. 
Dark Souls/King's Quest 
As someone who heard of From Software during the Armored Core days, I think Dark Souls is similar to an old 1990s RPG series named King's Quest, which was developed by From. Of course, DaZ, you haven't played King's Quest and Armored Core in general, but still I think we gamers need to pay attention to those two series and how similar they are to Souls, because they were important for From's success in the 1990s and 2000s. By the way, please note that Armored Core is a series of mecha video games. 
Main Problems With Bosses: 
1. Difficulty spike is extremely disproportionate compared to main game. I.e. not 5-10 times as difficult but more like 20-50 times.

2. Co-oping them is laughably easy i.e. a boss that is 50 times harder than a mob will only be twice as hard as a mob in coop.

3. Definitely does NOT distill combat mechanics down as the mechanics are very different to the mobs: Less exploring around mobs, less drawing them out, less use of scenery, instead repetitive attempts at learning one enemy's attacks.

4. Thematically out of place on the following counts:
A. Boss arenas completely disparate and separate to the complex and interconnected aesthetics in the rest of the game.
B. Lengthy repetitive boss combat spoils the general flow of exploration.
C. Being locked into an arena is unthematically artifical.
D. Basically goes from an action RPG to a beat-em-up fighting game and back again.

5. Bonfire save points often pointlessly far from the boss arena (and equally pointlessly near afterwards).

6. Huge difficulty spike particularly exacerbates lack of difficulty settings. 
If the bosses were well balanced, harder than mobs but not 2+ hours on 1 arena hard, were set in more complex and well themed areas, encouraged use of tactics and reactions rather than just repetitive learning, were significantly boosted for coop, weren't locked in as arenas, had better save points then they would be fine.

As it happens a lot of the bosses are aesthetically spectacular (as are many of the mobs) but are wasted in completely out-of-place gameplay. 
<Shambler> i am assuming that 90% of the gameplay will be fine and the bosses with be stupid out of context boring arenas that are unplayably difficult
<Daz_> I mean you're wrong but I cba to argue
<skacky_> DS3 bosses are honestly not too hard compared to bloodborne
<Shambler> that doesn't mean they're good skacky
<skacky_> with the possible exception of pontiff sulyvahn or nameless king
<Shambler> also half the people on func cooped them anyway
<skacky_> I think they're very good
<skacky_> well soul of cinder is also pretty difficult, gwyn it isn't
<Shambler> aesthetically maybe
<Daz_> learning and eventually beating the bosses is one of the best parts of souls for me :P
<skacky_> it's funny because I find the levels harder than the bosses in souls games
<skacky_> except in bloodborne
<skacky_> one exception would be DS1 anor londo, it's a really hard level with an equally hard boss
<skacky_> ornstein and smough gave me PTSD
<skacky_> but then you have blighttown which is hard as fuck and quelaag which is very easy in comparison
<skacky_> or catacombs and fucking pinwheel
<Shambler> levels are mostly easy and great fun
<Daz_> FUCK catacombs
<Shambler> learning and eventually beating the bosses is by far the worst, most boring, most out of place, more repetitive, most immersion spoiling pile of shit in any game, especially ds3
<Daz_> and BlightTown
<Shambler> you get this amazing fantasy world to explore, full of interconnected madness, amazing atmosphere, bonkers monsters and such a cool vibe
<skacky_> and strong opponents to prove your worth
<skacky_> makes perfect sense to me
<Shambler> then it all just fucking stops for 2 hours as you do the same thing over and over a-fucking-gain in some arbitrary arena counting fucking attack timings and getting bored off your fucking tits and all that immersion just flies out the fucking window
<skacky_> the poison swamp in DS3 is pretty difficult but it's just a far easier blighttown
<Shambler> strong opponents are fine
<Shambler> the tougher mob enemies are good
<Shambler> you have to try hard and fight hard but it's part of a satisfying process
<@Bal> the only thing that kept the bosses bearable for me was reading up how to kill them online after my first attempt at each
<Shambler> repeating the same damn arena is the dullest thing ever
<skacky_> you're really weird
<Shambler> no you are
<skacky_> I have tons of fun figuring out how to beat a boss
<skacky_> I'm not the only one
<skacky_> a lot of people love souls games because of the bosses
<skacky_> yeah losing your souls can be annoying but that's part of the game
<Shambler> yes there's a fucking bunch of you, and pandering to your weird fucking puritanical work ethic maschocism ruins what would be a pretty much perfect game
<@Bal> I don't mind them soo much, but I probably would have stopped playing the games without a wiki :D
<@Bal> just cause I'd get bored redoing them over and over
<skacky_> also it's really satisfying to beat a boss on your first attempt in your first run (wink wink nito)
<Daz_> git gud
<Shambler> there you go daz
<Shambler> you ARE the problem
<Daz_> lol
<Shambler> bal is correct
<skacky_> I always loved the really epic (I fucking hate that word but here it's perfecly appropriate) feeling you get when you fight a boss
<skacky_> it's the culmination of all your trials and tribulations in the gauntlet before
<Shambler> skacky, they can be epic without being dull, imba, repetitive
<skacky_> honestly there's not a single DS3 boss that is imba
<Daz_> I don't agree with you at all Shambler. DS series is s breath of fresh air where you have to actually demonstrate mastery of the game in order to progress.
<Shambler> skacky, if it was remotely proportional to the trials before, like only up to 10 times harder instead of 200 times harder, it might make sense
<skacky_> exactly
<@Bal> they aren't imba, but I feel they are very frustrating if you go at them with no info at all
<Shambler> daz: tell that to scampie and czg who cooped the bosses i did solo
<skacky_> Shambler a lot of people play these games solo
<Shambler> also for me, DS3 was great becaose of everything else
<Daz_> well coop is there if you've had enough
<skacky_> I do, I don't play coop
<Daz_> its the relief valve
<Shambler> also if people want miserably boring and frustrating games, that's what skill settings are for
<skacky_> if you want an imba boss look no further than bed of chaos
<Shambler> no i don't
<Shambler> i want quality, balance, pleasure
<skacky_> there is not a single boss in DS3 that is remotely like bed of chaos
<Daz_> because it was bad
<Shambler> anyway i really liked rotted greatwood, only took 2 goes but that was spectacular because it was spectacular
<skacky_> yeah but greatwood is piss easy
<Shambler> bonkers boss, dramatic events, etc etc
<Shambler> obviously for 1337 git gudders like you
<skacky_> not, greatwood is just a pushover
<@Bal> greatwood was the tree testicles?
<skacky_> it's really hard to die against him unless you're really stupid
<skacky_> yes
<@Bal> yeah that's one of the few I got first try
* Daz_ is really stupid
<skacky_> lol
<Shambler> Daz: <Daz_> git gud
<skacky_> iudex gundyr was probably the single best first boss in the souls series
<@Bal> I'm still mad onion knight died right away against the big sword guy, wtf
<Shambler> iudex gaycunt was fine yes
<Shambler> that seemed nicely balanced
<@Bal> I read online "don't worry onion knight will kill him alone"
<@Bal> onion knight runs in, instadeath
<Daz_> weird
<skacky_> Bal siegfried does insane damage against yhorm
<Daz_> he took a few hits on my game and was ok
<Shambler> also coop is a kinda skill setting for bosses......except it's stupidly easy
<skacky_> you can effectively just run around and let him fight yhorm for you
<@Bal> he literally didn't have time to attack once
<skacky_> lel
<@Bal> yeah that's what I started doing
<Daz_> too much Seigbrau man
<@Bal> for 5 seconds, before he died :D
<Shambler> if mobs = 1x difficulty, then tougher bosses = 200x difficulty, and coop = 1.5x difficulty
<skacky_> but then again yhorm is probably the only "bad" boss in the game
<skacky_> because you need a special weapon to beat him
<Daz_> no
<Daz_> I killed him in my 1st playthrough with regular
<skacky_> and he's definitely not as fun as storm ruler in demon's souls who uses the exact same gimmick
<Daz_> with no onionman
<@Bal> it was ok
<skacky_> how many hours did you take Daz_ lol
<Daz_> fucking forever
<skacky_> well yeah I mean you can beat him like that
<skacky_> but the 'intended' way to beat him is with stormruler
<Daz_> I just thought that was how the boss was
<Daz_> didnt notice the sword pickup at his throne
<Shambler> daz i bet that was the best bit of the game by far eh, i mean forget the madness of the first town, or the beauty of ithryll, or the interconnected splendour of cathdreal, i bet doing that boss fight over and fucking over for hours really made the game
<Daz_> the worst part of the souls games are hte fucking quests tbh
<skacky_> some people seem to dislike ancient wyvern but it's not really a boss per se, more of a gauntlet with a boss creature in it
<Shambler> what a pair of cunts you both are, i can't believe i've actually had some serious discussions with you morons in the past
* Shambler puts everyone on ignore except bal

<Daz_> lol
<skacky_> dude, you loved thi4f
<skacky_> your opinions are invalid
<@Bal> I'm kinda worried that I'm half-agreeing with Shambler :\
<skacky_> worse taste than kona
<@Bal> ouch
<skacky_> I would love to see Shambler play against some bloodborne bosses like father gascoigne or oprhan of kos
<skacky_> just to see streams of blood pour from his prolapsed anus
<Shambler> why
<Shambler> i'd quit?
<Shambler> i learnt my lesson with gundyr part2
<Shambler> part 2
<skacky_> if you don't like the bosses in dark souls there's no way you'd like bosses in bloodborne, who are much faster, much more aggressive and much harder overall
<Shambler> which again ruined a really cool bit of the game, going back to the same area in a different.....errr however it was different
<Shambler> yes no shit you said that already
<Shambler> i also wouldn't like hammering nails into my bellend to see if i could get just the right pretty pattern after 3245 attempts
<Daz_> lol
<Shambler> god you lot are awful

...the main problem is the git-gud-wankboys. HTH. 
Ds Bosses 
I only played ds1.

Currently stuck at the dlc Boss Manus

I think he's difficult on purpose, but there's a bit too much:
- will kill you in ~3 hits, sometimes two.
- you have to learn when it's possible to heal
- has three attacks that, while they're readable okish, require you to jump in different directions (I think...), without any perceivable reason for that in the game world
- you need to use an item to deflect one of his attacks, but there's no real way to know that
- on the way to him, there's one ranged mob that I have no idea how to avoid; it can push you down a ledge into your death ~5-10% of the runs
- there's loads of respawning humanity, but at this time, no coop play because nobody is ever available there
- this is the only boss, where the summon sign for a npc is inside the boss area
- the npc that is summoned is almost useless, as it does almost zero damage and the boss switches focus to you for quite a while when you approach him
- the level before was kind of easy

In general I think:
- the bosses are important; the levels often feel like a built-up, which is a good thing.
- however, you WILL die on your first try, because you have no idea what's coming and the bosses do not pick up level themes at all.
- difficulty spike on some of them is a bit too much, but i think that's due to design issues
- bosses show most obviously where there's a disconnect between the graphics and the entity system, and for me, this is often a problem. Examples: I have problems if the timing is a matter of learning when to jump in relation to his animation" rather than "jump when you would jump in reallife". Legs are attackable? Yes, but in reality you would always receive damage. These things make the bosses so hard, because it turns into a guess-game what to do. Can I block these two giant swords? Probably not, in comparison that I have problems blocking other stuff sometimes. However, with this one boss, it's entirely possible.
- glitchy camera/controls: the sheer size of them combined with having to approach them close quarters sometimes blatantly shows the problems with the controls
- difficult bosses work much better if there are multiple routes available, because you can just choose another route and return later to it. Only works if the level design supports it, though. It doesn't work if there's a 30 min trip between them. 
2 Words 
Git. Gud. 
And translates to "I know I'm wrong and deluded, so I'm going to bring in cringy pseudo-macho boasting to try to desperately prove I'm superior". God I'd hate myself if I had to resort to that. 
I made a mistake in my "Dark Souls/King's Quest". King's Quest was an adventure game series not made by From. When I accidentally used the term "King's Quest", I was trying to mean "King's Field". So King's Field was an old 1990s RPG series made by From. 
Try Resetting 
I am not seeing anything obvious here. 
Yeah I did restart, no luck. The only "warning" message in game is when I try to click okay, it says I need to select at least one attribute to level up....NO SHIT DS3!!

Anyway, I sacked it off, tried to spend my 86k souls so I don't keep losing them, got rid of 40k then tried the boss and lololol okay whatever homz. 
DLC Optional Area. 
<onetruepurple> Shambler: are you frustrated?
<Shambler> nope

I made it down eventually. The ice is cool, the crabs are cool, the Milwood cunts are still cunts. I tried the optional boss once but there were no summons so I sacked it off. Did the main boss coop though. Actually well balanced for coop. Must be an extremely miserable experience solo. Playing through this DLC overall (lovely scenery, good exploration, cool designs, really weird and cool enemies) and then having the discussion about bosses and seeing the other points of view in their favour....only made me realise how utterly wrong those points of view are and how chronically, jarringly out of place boss arenas are combat-wise. Definitely something only to be tolerated / got-out-of-the-way, not enjoyed.

Maybe there should be a separate DS3 boss arena mini-game for the freaks and perverts??

P.S. Obvz get the DLC if you haven't already. 
Fuck Yoiu 
the ice arena boss was fucking amazing and you are an actual physical shit for thinking otherwise :D

ps love you 
Replaying DS3 
Haven't played any Souls game in a while so I'm playing this again, with a regular knight, melee only character. I'm at the catacombs of Carthus right now. I still stand by what I said: the levels are far more difficult and challenging than the bosses.

Cathedral of the Deep in particular is a really nasty place and I died a lot there. The huge knights with their broadswords are really tough and some of the ambushes are pretty damn dangerous. The giants are pretty easy to beat though. I found Farron Keep to be a breeze this time around, I downed the Stray Demon and even invaded someone through the Farron covenant. The bosses are really easy compared to the levels, though.

Iudex Gundyr: This one is pretty tough, gotta admit, but once you get his patterns right he's not that hard.
Vordt: Just stay close to his legs and he won't hit you, though you gotta be careful of the frostbite aura after a while (I found the Irithyll knight just after Siegward far more difficult than Vordt)
Curse-rotten Greatwood: Piss easy.
Crystal Sage: Just dodge his projectiles and don't tarry. I killed him pretty fast. If anything the mobs between the bonfire and his arena are far more dangerous than him.
Deacons of the Deep: Really easy as well, beat the on my first try. You just have to be careful not to get overwhelmed. Like Crystal Sage, the monsters between the nearest bonfire and the boss are far more dangerous.
Abyss Watchers: Was a bit cocky and got slaughtered the first time, but I beat them rather easily on my second. It's important to roll at the right time to avoid getting hit constantly. The flaming sword looks threatening but it's not too difficult to predict where it will land and what type of attack it'll do.

Comparatively I found the black knight near the Farron crystal lizard very difficult, the Irithyll knight just before Path of Sacrifice took me a few tries like I said, the two assholes just before the entrance to Farron Keep also almost killed me at Ember + 7 Estus + for some reason. Keep in mind that I almost never use parry because I'm shit at timing this ability. 
I would agree that the levels are harder than the bosses. I can't even really decide who the most difficult boss was...perhaps the final one just due to how long it takes. Nameless King perhaps as well.

The hardest spot I encountered was starting Irithyll city with those frost ghost knights. I had to come back after exploring and upgrading to actually handle them.

I also found the Farron guards to be surprisingly difficult! Cathedral of the Deep is probably the first really meaty and menacing section of the game...and one of my favorites. 
the levels are far more difficult and challenging than the bosses.

Git gud.

The huge knights with their broadswords are really tough and some of the ambushes are pretty damn dangerous.

Git gud.

Cathedral of the Deep in particular is a really nasty place and I died a lot there.

Git gud.

(I found the Irithyll knight just after Siegward far more difficult than Vordt)

Git gud.

the mobs between the bonfire and his arena are far more dangerous

Git gud.

monsters between the nearest bonfire and the boss are far more dangerous

Git gud.

Comparatively I found the black knight near the Farron crystal lizard very difficult

Git gud.

Honestly Skacky, you are DEMENTED if you find the bosses easier than the run-of-the-mill easy mobs. Are you sure you're playing the right game?? Maybe you should be on some nightmare mode beat-em-up, or QuakeLive Rocket Arena against some pro-players?? 
I Can Only Assume... 
...that post #167 was sponsored and/or ghost-written by Baker. 
DS3 Bosses 
I also found them to be easier than some of the normal mobs. It's not as bad as Dark Souls 2 though where I killed about 90% of the bosses on my first attempt but got stuck for a long time fighting normal mobs. 
Level design actively works against you with regular mobs whereas the boss arenas usually give you plenty of room to move around the bosses. Only exception would be High Lord Wolnir because you die if you get to the Abyss, but even then you have tons of room to move around.

I mean, don't tell me you found the Cathedral Knights on the rafters in the Cathedral of the Deep easier than, say Deacons of the Deep or the Curse-rotted Greatwood. These assfuckers are really hard because the space is really small and they face you by default, so you can't sneakily backstab them. Plus they seem to have magnetic boots because they rarely fall. Even the crossbow + undead doggos gauntlet at the start of Cathedral of the Deep before the Chapel of Cleansing is harder than the Crystal Sage boss that was just before it. 
For Me 
the game became practically unplayable in terms of difficulty after the Dancer. The Knights after that are fought with as multiples and theres the assholes that heal them. I had to do a suicide run to the next bonfire (I had quit the game for about a month due to the difficulty spike) 
Yeah Lothric Castle is really difficult. The Dancer of the Boreal Valley is a very tough boss with very hard-to-read patterns. Then you have the whole castle chock full of hard enemies and then you have the fucking Dragonslayer Armour which packs a punch and was one of the hardest bosses on my first playthrough, just because it's so aggressive. And that's not counting the upper levels with the archives and all. 
Also another thing to consider regarding my 'success ratio' with bosses is that I usually fare much better against beasts and demons than humanoids, mostly because I'm awful at timing parries. Since most enemies you face in the game as humanoids, I tend to not be extremely good against them, while areas populated by beasts are far easier by comparison. The bosses I found the hardest in DS3 were Pontiff Sullyvahn, Dancer of the Boreal Valley, Dragonslayer Armour, Nameless King, Champion Gundyr and Soul of Cinder. They're all humanoid. 
Man, This Is Interesting. 
You're wrong, but this time you're wrong in a non-macho, non-bullshit, and discussion-worthy way...

Level design actively works against you with regular mobs whereas the boss arenas usually give you plenty of room to move around the bosses.

Level design actively works FOR you with the regular mobs as you have a lot more of the actual level to use, and you can use the scenery against the mobs. It works AGAINST you with the bosses because you're locked into a flat arena with little cover, no elevation changes and no escape.


I mean, don't tell me you found the Cathedral Knights on the rafters in the Cathedral of the Deep easier than, say Deacons of the Deep or the Curse-rotted Greatwood.

That's an unsuitable comparison because you're trying to compare one of the tougher mobs in the game to the absolute very easiest bosses.

FWIW those knights were a bit tricky because of the rafters but I got them to fall off more than I fell off.

Even the crossbow + undead doggos gauntlet at the start of Cathedral of the Deep before the Chapel of Cleansing is harder than the Crystal Sage boss that was just before it.

I can't even remember them. Crystal Sage was quite well balanced though.

For Me the game became practically unplayable in terms of difficulty after the Dancer.

For me, Dancer was almost unplayable, as was Dragonslayer, Pontiff was close, Champion Gundyr was unplayable (I did him solo after 60 attempts, that is not gameplay that is stubborn stupidity), Dragon and Butt Of Fire too.

The Knights after that are fought with as multiples and theres the assholes that heal them. I had to do a suicide run to the next bonfire (I had quit the game for about a month due to the difficulty spike)

Yeah Lothric Castle is really difficult. The Dancer of the Boreal Valley is a very tough boss with very hard-to-read patterns. Then you have the whole castle chock full of hard enemies and then you have the fucking Dragonslayer Armour which packs a punch and was one of the hardest bosses on my first playthrough, just because it's so aggressive. And that's not counting the upper levels with the archives and all.

You guys are kidding right?? By "multiples" you mean two at once, assuming you take down the weak healer ASAP. Again almost all of these areas you have a lot of space to run away or scenery to use.

Yeah a lot of these are tricky. The Lothric Knights, the Black Knights after Pontiff, the Fat Angel Knights. But I can't recall a single section of those that took me near 10 attempts, let alone 10+ that the tougher bosses took.

On the occasions they took lots of attempts, it's because I wasn't taking them serious "only a mob, I'll be casual", which is obviously shoddy playing. Whenever I focused on mobs, they were playable. Whenever I focused on a boss....time after fucking time....they were IMBA hard.

Also another thing to consider regarding my 'success ratio' with bosses is that I usually fare much better against beasts and demons than humanoids, mostly because I'm awful at timing parries.

I never parried, I guess the lack of parrying can't make the mobs that much harder?

The bosses I found the hardest in DS3 were Pontiff Sullyvahn, Dancer of the Boreal Valley, Dragonslayer Armour, Nameless King, Champion Gundyr and Soul of Cinder. They're all humanoid.

Also, they are the fucking hardest ones in DS3, which is why they're hard. Tough, huge attack ranges, deadly attacks, sometimes impossible-to-predict "patterns", and a lot of fucking graphics shit getting in the way. And all in completely unfavourable arenas. 
Ringed City DLC What Are We Saying?? 
Installed, spawned in the first area, (accessible from Sister thingy in the Painted World DLC), looks cool and bonkers so far. Seems to continue direct after the end game, sort of?? Then some giant smoke penis ghost slug dildo monster killed me.... 
Surprisingly large, many areas to explore, cool shortcuts, good style, at least in the actual Ringed City bits. Properly infuriatingly hard in parts. Four bosses in total, plus a bunch of what could be called mini-bosses/encounters. First two are fine; optional one only tried briefly, possibly annoying; final one seems like a real dick. Some nice armors; not sure about the weapons. Cool enemies, fun to fight individually, but tricky in hordes (only one location where this gets a bit over the top, though). 
I Really Enjoyed The Laser Angels. 
Haven't killed the demon brothas yet tho :( 
Possible Spoiler. 
Surprisingly large, many areas to explore, cool shortcuts, good style, at least in the actual Ringed City bits. Properly infuriatingly hard in parts. Four bosses in total, plus a bunch of what could be called mini-bosses/encounters. First two are fine; optional one only tried briefly, possibly annoying; final one seems like a real dick. Some nice armors; not sure about the weapons. Cool enemies, fun to fight individually, but tricky in hordes (only one location where this gets a bit over the top, though).

Spot on! Although I'd say the art style in the Dreg Heap is pretty damn cool too. And the first boss is hard, second is - randomly - very easy Embered, last is hard again. Some of the NPCs are hard too. Didn't try the dragon because dragon reasons.

Very impressed with this DLC. First one was good, this one is great. Worth twice the price. 
....that you don't get to go in the seperate tower in the Ringed City though. A spiral around up to that would have been ace. 
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