|Posted by Shambler on 2017/12/26 15:05:41|
|Let's assume that a full HD but true-to-spirit Quake remake, guaranteed 200 maps, AD 3.0, and PC Gamer cover shots fall under "un-realistic", but there might be other exciting ideas and desires that will come true.
So what do you want?? Map-wise, theme-wise, mod-wise, meta-wise?? Let's get the hype started....
@Baker: Don't sweat it.
@bAKER: Been there, done that, i'm sure you've witnessed more than a few of my own rants :( I hope you're drinking 3.2% cause 17 beers oof!
I tried the menus and they do work great!
some engines in the past put all the options on a horizontal row at the top *bleh!* But yours is just natural; quake-style. And as some have mentioned there's a few spots to buff out. But for the most part nice work!
2018 For Quake?
I was just thinking about how cool it would be to have a quake/arcane dimensions 8km x 8km map/mod that had a full 200 players per server with little towns to venture to, to fight hordes of monsters or other players with quests etc. hmm maybe like a world of quake-craft but a merge of coop/pvp on a huge map with faithful art assets.
sorry just mumbling over here at 3:13am :D
Thanks for checking out the mouse menu, R00k.
Yeah, I'm a stick in the mud conservative that couldn't accept a menu with any changes in the appearance.
I was just thinking about how cool it would be to have a quake/arcane dimensions 8km x 8km map/mod that had a full 200 players per server with little towns to venture to"
If you look at some of capabilities in Mark V, I am angling in that direction. It has a mod installer built-in, ipv6, some severely enhanced coop features.
Combined with some of Spike's work in Quakespasm Spiked, this is almost possible now in theory.
That type of thinking is what I ultimately want.
The ability to co-operative play easily in an immersive multi-player environment.
Makarate once ran a Quakeworld coop server using the Undergate level I made. And obv, my work with RocketGuy on RQuake coop and his then popular coop server.
And of course, Gunter who even now runs a Quake co-op server ;-)
Given that Ter Shibboleth
apparently required some pretty hefty code-monkeying to make happen ("...where [ericw] entirely re-wrote the leak code just so the map would compile"
), I don't even want to think about what havoc and even larger map would wreak on editors, compilers, and the engine itself... not to mention the player's framerate.
@spud - Co-op Used To Be Normal
I try to not mention this often, but the Quake bsp compile tools -- specifically vis -- does a horrible job.
You can find some discussions where mh, me, ericw and probably Spike discuss this in the Quakespasm thread.
It used to be normal for maps to co-op. Like Tronyn's Mask of the Red Death or Sewage Devastation.
czg's honey coops
just fine. <----
Co-operative play isn't an alien idea, it used to be normal and expected that all released Quake maps would co-op
That thinking kind of got lost in part because many maps required bsp2 and such and wouldn't work in, say, Quakeworld.
Coops ... Yes ...
And probably 90%-95% of all past single player releases that aren't bsp2.
Co-op ability simply used to be normal. There is scarcely a map by czg, necros, tronyn, pulsar, distrans, etc. that doesn't co-op.
Oh, I Wasn't Talking About The Co-op Part
More the size and complexity of the map part, regardless of how many info_player_coops it includes.
Unnecessary Side Note Double Post
Holy shit Quaddicted works in Waterfox now, neat.
Needs to be designed for. E.g. a gate closes behind you locking you in to an area, e.g. for an arena fight or a puzzle. Your poor coop buddy gets squished by the gate, resses, runs back only to have to wait for the first player to kill all...crap he died too. Now you have to restart the whole level and cheat yourself back the weapons and ammo you had.
Desigb for coop please.
I know it's just dreaming but FTE can handle pretty big maps. This isnt a new idea, years ago people were all talking about taking all the id1 maps and combine them into one huge map! I think that is a doable thing. and imagine 200 people playing across all those maps on 1 server doing their thing.. i think either coop of pvp that would be fun to play. and then imagine its not id1 maps but a whole little quake-world.. :boom: mind blown ! :^D
Half Way Through 2018...
So, have any of your realistic wishes come true?
I'm still hoping for 5.1 surround and rumble support.
As of today we're precisely halfway into 2018, a good excuse to revisit the 2018 expectations as any...
Fewer huge, but irregular ejaculations of maps and a more balanced stream of output through the year. Jams are great but somewhere down the line they turned from short "turtle mapping 2.0" sessions into gruelling, multi-month mapping marathons. I'd prefer to have 4 jams with 4 entries each than 1 jam with 16 entries.
This isn't really happening, LOL. With 22 maps in the DM4 Jam and 19 maps in the 100 brush competition the huge spurts of mappage are probably to stay. At least the deadlines are more reasonable now than last year.
Less perfectionism, more releases. Who really cares if a map is rough around the edges. Polish is important but it's become a bottleneck. We could have hit 200 maps this year if it hadn't been for perfectionism.
In the past 6 months we saw 87 Q1SPs get released. Not sure how much of it is down to "less perfectionism", but the maps are smaller and less polished on average - which is not a bad thing at all.
Less hubisodes, more episodes, playable from beginning to end. Either community episodes or solo ventures.
Hasn't matterialised yet, but there's at least 3 regular episodes in development currently.
Conversely to scar3crow, I want more PCs. (Partial conversions, not personal computers, or more of the PC police that bullied skacky away.) Quake hasn't had its own Back to Saturn X or Valiant yet.
Hasn't happened yet either, and there are none in development to my knowledge, but I'm still holding out hope.
More Quoth content. Quoth maps, or Quoth features jumbled into custom mods. I think jam 9 showed that the old friend still has some juice left.
21 Quoth maps were released this year so far. I'm pretty happy with this turnout but also not 100% satisfied with how Quoth was used in them, obviously the 100 brush limit was harsh but I'm very much down for a necros style map with lots of rotating stuff and clever entity stuff.
More True Color maps. I don't mean hi-res bullshit, I mean recolored external textures (ne_marb, sm179_otp). There are so many colors that have been barely brushed in Quake.
None in 2018 so far. Maybe some sort of tutorial would encourage mappers to get more colors in their maps.
Some sort of reinvention of the QExpo. qbism was right that the booth/exhibiton format has gone past its expiration date, but some sort of cross-community, content driven event should be a Thing.
Not sure there's much interest for such an event happening, sadly.
New maps from ionous, negke, ijed (ok, too unrealistic), Kell, G1ftmacher, Bloodshot, Nait, and the QUMP team.
I'm 50/50 on this, since some people on the list have delivered lots, some have delivered a few, and some not at all (Spud mapping is good, but where's the rest of QUMP?)
New maps from people whom we haven't even met yet.
Now this is the one prediction that has delivered in spades!! Since the beginning of the year we've had 15 map releases from newcomers. With TB and dumptruck's A+ tutorials I expect this number to double in the next 6 months.
More banter from Shambler.
The banter is here alright, as on-point and stingy as ever.
I typed this one without much thought as to what a 1.0 release should actually entail; but there would be high potential for both mappers and players (specifically the newcomers) in having DP particle support, CSQC support, Twitch chat relay support, etc. in one, unified, easy to install, well documented edition of Quakespasm.
TLDR We're doing rather well in 2018, Q.E.D.
Sometimes I think about a TC. And then I think about how much harder it would be to make all those models vs. all the sprites people can use in Doom :(
(Spud mapping is good, but where's the rest of QUMP?)
Hey now, according to a quick Quaddicted search, Danzadan, Naitelvenividivici, Newhouse, and Pritchard have all released maps since QUMP, and I think a few others are currently making maps for upcoming map-things. Unless you mean specifically the rest whom QUMP was their first released map in which case nobody here but us chickens, sorry.
And then I think about how much harder it would be to make all those models vs. all the sprites people can use in Doom :(
And all the shenanigans about custom HUD layouts and such that require clientside QC and thus severely limit port choice, and learning QuakeC in general instead of relying on sourceport specific languages that hold your hand all the way through, and the smaller playerbase in general that will end up playing it and tends to be rather picky about what they want in their Quake maps. It's way easier to just kitbash some sprites together, add custom sounds, modify some premade weapons, and boom, Doom total conversion. I'm not bitter at all.
Sprites can work very well with top-down or sidescroller cameras. And Quake is much better for coding such kinds of TCs than Doom. Examples: Prydon Gate, TargetQuake
I Made A Qump Map...
Now I'm sitting around with a severe case of Dunning-Kruger. I just about managed to finish my Qump map last year, before hitting the bottom of the slope.
(Spud mapping is good, but where's the rest of QUMP?)
i may release a map this year, but no promises
i don't have much time, and this year i'm playing xcom 2/skyrim too. i didn't play dmjam4 or 100brush yet!
More Mods / Modern Tools
Would love to play more mods or see people revive features from older mods like extras r4's water hacks.
Would also like to see updated tools that are more future proof. I updated my drivers yesterday and now QuArK cannot display MDLs. These issues are likely to get worse.
+1 For Tools
I want a simple tool for exporting skins, importing skins on models or frames on sprites. QME is sluggish and has no dragndrop and doesn't support sprites. AdQuedit is worse.
I want a Wally that doesn't crash or basically addons for Gimp that give me the amazing pixelly filters.
An updated Blender addon that has support for multiple skins on export to mdl.
Psst, I'm already reviving features from mods but not wanting to spam that too much, people get tired of hearing about Keep it seems.
Wait...Quark!!?!? Yeesh, what good is that for anymore??
Tools are in sore need indeed. I'll create my own tools, but only after my engine work is complete (which should only take a decade or so).
My current toolset is TexMex, fimg, The GIMP, qME, PakExplorer, JACK, EricW's tools, and some other stuff.
More Stuff Is Good Ya
The Blender tools is a big +1.
I'm working on a bowl of fruits .mdl for Quake, apples and bananas, maybe some grapes. Quake needs some fruits. But you can't export with more than 1 skin in Blender. How am I supposed to have green apples or red apples?
And don't think about using QMe. It will destroy your vertex normals. Because its evil.
Also Nth-ing Tools
The workflow for just mapping and making textures isn't bad but as already discussed above the toolset for modeling is far worse and if you want to do stuff like edit the conchars file you have to pray to your deity of choice that you remember to export and import in the right order in the right programs (including goddamn AdQuedit which is apparently the only editor to properly handle it as the specific console characters file instead of just a .spr).
Hmm… Creating whole new tools for simple stuff like conchars editing doesn't sound like the best approach for me.
A GIMP plugin
for loading and saving LMP images could be enough.
GIMP is awkward and unproductive.
Takes 5, 10 or 20 clicks to do what many other alternatives can do in 1 or 2.
It also takes things easy to do in most other editors and finds a way to make them needlessly difficult.
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