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New Q1SP: The Citadel Of Sinners
Large metal-medieval castle with narrow corridors and small halls.

map name: The Citadel of Sinners
file name: xl2
author: xlarve
Monsters count (easy/nightmare): 193/220
[If there are other skill settings, xlarve isn't admitting to them...]
Secrets: 10

Map link:


Unzipe archive.
Put files in ...Quake 1ID1maps directory.
Launch Quake, type in console "map xl2".

Brushes count in map:
xl2 570
xl2m1 about 10400

Lights count (xl2m1): 1454
Worldtype: 1 (metal)
Sounds: 9
Building time: 2017-06-17 ... 2017-11-26.

Hope you enjoy this map!
About Skill 
Skills available in the map: easy and nightmare! 
Yeah Played On Skill 2, Through The Console. 
I know. The important task was make easy skill. 
So Yeah.

Much improved design over XL1 which I couldn't play as the box rooms were so repetitive. There were still a few too many box rooms here, but the better designs more than made up for it - some really cool medieval shit going on. Keep going in that direction and it will be spectacular. I also quite like the super-convoluted layout, although if some areas were more open, you'd get a better feel of revisiting and exploring.

Gameplay was fun but very easy on SKILL 2. Maybe twice as much health and 1.5 times as much ammo than was needed?? Some of the ambushes and quad runs were cool tho. The end game could have been better as you can escape the room.

Definite progress and improvement over ur first map which is cool, keep it going man :) 
Tnx For Review 
From The Final Hall it is possible to run out in final teleport - just make dodge from monsters. I've tested it many times :) 
Will check this out. 
Nice Map ! 
Cool one! 
Going To Be Playing Through This In About Five Hours 
Updated link in the OP to a fixed version of the map 
Tnx Shambler for discovering the bug.
Tnx Metlslimee for link for download map update.

The bug was in door#25 in the final hall.
Door must have the parameter "wait" 20 seconds instead 3 seconds (default value). For this reason the final trap in final hall worked not right - the player could escape from the room after 3 seconds after activating the trap when the door#25 opens. 
Video - Beware! Spoilers! 
Quake1 - xl2 map run in Nightmare.
No taken secrets, some ammo, armor for not to gain an additional advantage - this is the test-map run.

Quake1 - xl2 map SECRETS 

The map is a definite improvement over the previous, and i'm envious of your ability to dish out so many brushes so fast as i tend to overthink each brush. It has a lot more personality and variations in each room but it could go with a bit more on that yet. The layout improved also more except maybe in one part where there was two ways, one for the Gold Key and the other ended out of nowhere on a room with two doors, which i suppose will open from the other side to connect the map later. The inclusion of the water parts is well done there and fitted the map well. The gameplay seemed fair and well placed enemies for the most part.
On the other side, i found a strange bug where some around 4 units wide black ribbons floated on top of some pools of water, there is still two or three too dark parts, and on the rooms that turns pitch black, there is some knights that are hugging the walls. Also, i expect the arrows and messages to be only for skill 0, they were excessive and annoying and made me think i was hand-held on those parts.

On the gameplay, i could say that i played it but not, who knows. I couldn't find the way to the nightmare entrance so passed on cheating and played on easy, which i regret so i'll be playing on skill 3 next.
I don't know if it is because its being ages since the last time i played on easy and that almost everytime i play on skill 2 or 3 that i couldn't get to it, and i found playing it uneventful. Due to this i played without energies or drive, without minding to explore or find much about the secrets or the details and just to see how it fared, relaxing so much that i almost died once.

So to summarize, due to all of that i have not much to say about the gameplay: it seems good for the most part, save some knights that can't reach the player due to some holes on the ground, one or two spikes of difficulty on the first half, and the overwhelming amount of ammo, being even more on the first half. You could have gone with a quarter of it and would be OK, as the map was practically littered with ammo. Also, even though it is easy difficulty, for a map this long you could have added one shambler only near the end for the feeling of accomplishment.

Going to play the real playthrough, on skill 2 or 3. 
Tnx For Comment 
Many people complained about the lack of ammo (shells), many monsters and hardest skill in the previous map.
About skill... In original quake whole 3rd episode (McGee's) have skills easy and normal-hard-nightmare. This is not bad. I make specially 2 skills.
Shambler. I like this monster. This monsters will be appered in next levels... I dont wanna make Shambler like the boss in final room - don't want to be like many custom maps. 
Had Fun 
Hey xlarve! I had fun playing through this. I played on easy, because your last map was impossible. Also because I am a wussy.

Here is my demo:

Ok so, I like the layout and the monster placement much more than your first map. Although this was on easy, I still had fun. The water sections were also very good and kept things different. I also like the very tall ceilings with all kinds of details as you look up. Also, the very large outdoor room seen in the screenshot is the best, and a very good set piece. Ammo was extremely abundant. The lighting and overall level of detail was nice.

What I think could better is using more textures overall. This is a very, very large map and using only the id WAD can gets repetitive. Areas look the same, and I thought the green rock/moss on the walls looked strange. Things like Hexen,Daikatana and even Scourge/Dissolution WAD could make your map more interesting. Also the gold key door: the message saying where gold key door is, this is ok. But also cheap. I think you could have made 'signs' by using gold key and arrow textures to point the direction to the gold key door.

Overall, I had fun playing this one!
tnx for review
...about trigger message. Some players has lost yourself on previous map - that because i've add 2 triggers message - about ammo-room and where-to-go. But this is only in easy skill.
Grass-moss on the wall? Why not? Halls cuts in the rock... Main reason - i like "coop work" this texture with other textures (contrast, color...)

about some bugs with monsters and maybe lights. I've tested my map in Dark Places quake engine.
Besides low FPS on my weak laptop i've got 2 bugs -
1 torch and Shaltrath - instead of them there were some stranges effects and rays :)

I glad what you liked this map - i did try me best 
I had no time to play it in skill 2 these days, but i am eager to play.

Many people complained about the lack of ammo (shells)

If i were to guess, i'd say that this issue comes from what is done in other custom maps, that give more shells compared to the other types of ammo and yours relied more than most on nails and explosives, so don't mind, the overall ammo was good for the first map.

The directions and message are an improvement from the previous, and it is a good that they are skill 0 only, the mesages, not the arrows, just need to be made less obvious.

Shambler. I like this monster. This monsters will be appered in next levels... I dont wanna make Shambler like the boss in final room - don't want to be like many custom maps.

It is no problem, i just mentioned it because the map being a big one i missed high tier enemies too for extra variety. 
i don't means you.
Many people (in demos, videos) often using shotgun and have a lack of shells 
!lla Ta Dab ToN 
I won't go into great detail, but I will say you've managed to cram every id1 theme in this map besides base. Nicely done.

First run demo, nightmare skill: 
GL-only Run For The Bantz.

Terrible playing, missed with approx 80% of my grenades, a few deaths due to getting caught in corners and/or quad. But suffice to say there is more than enough ammo.

XL if you had reduced every health pack and ammo pack to SMALL, this would have had a good balance. 
Now Do It With The Tarbaby Mod 
No, U! 
Okay, Here You Go

It's a solid map. I like the style. Good outside areas. Definitely an improvement to the first map, although indeed too generous on the supplies. Even though the map has some connected areas, it's still quite corridorish in large parts; I would have liked more connections between areas here, vertically or by means of windows. Seems the layout would have allowed it in several areas. Not a big issue, but that's the impression I got. 
I Streamed This Map Yesterday. 
I have some feelings about it.

I think that perhaps your style doesn't gel with me. It's by no means bad, I just think it might not fit well with how I see quake. So this is arguably a problem with me, not your map.

The things that I like about your map:

Good solid brushwork, consistent sized brushes and the theme was consistent.

The map promotes fast gameplay, whereas I often go into maps super cautiously, I felt like running and gunning in your map.

Good amounts of health scattered around the place.

You do small cramped areas really well.

Things that I don't like about your map:

There are too many small cramped areas, while you do them well, a large map filled with these areas are too much. A smaller map would have been better in this regard. Alternatively, consider having some larger more open areas in your map.

Some of the doors and hallways were a touch smaller than I would have made. It can make gameplay cramped and manoeuvrability difficult. If that's what you were going for, then that's fine. You could see this as a comment on your chosen style.

After watching the playthrough of your first map I noticed there was a lot of back-spawning. It seems like you replaced this for a lot of corner ambushes. I feel like there is a happy medium with a bit of everything that would benefit you maps.

A neutral thought:

Others have mentioned how much ammo there is. I played on nightmare and thought that while there was a lot of ammo, it does allow the player to adopt a "shoot first, worry about aim later", mentality. This is perhaps a more doom-ish approach than quakeish. But this coercion into fast gameplay is what I liked most about your map.

And finally, don't get discouraged by our criticisms. We're a bunch of grumpy old men, looking forward to seeing how you brush up your next map. 
Tnx For Comments 
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